The fate of my tank…ich after fallow & QT.

[Miami Reef]

My copper stayed at 2.5 since my afternoon dose.

So far copper is working really well in the DT. My tank temp is now 80F

 

[Miami Reef]

Here’s some update photos. The moorish still has ich (which is expected)

 

[AbdominalSnowman]

I can’t recall where I read it, but someone else also proposed the idea that coral or other filter feeders could be consuming tomites. This thought seems reasonable to me, but also relies on a mature stable system with significant coral mass.

I think it’s important to note that I obtain fish from an LFS that handpicks the fish they sell directly from the wholesaler, preventing any visibly sick fish from entering their systems. From there they observe and medicate the fish for two weeks before moving them to tanks for sale. They also send the fish home in water containing methylene blue. The owners of this store have over 25 years experience (over 50 combined) in this trade. I am not going to pretend I know more than them and try to do additional quarantine at home. I am not advocating for not performing some sort of QT protocol, as I have been in many stores that I would never touch their fish, even if I was able to quarantine the fish first.

 

[Miami Reef]

I tested at 3pm: 2.50ppm

It’s 9:00pm: 2.49ppm.

Oh no! What ever shall I do? My rocks are “absorbing” all my copper!

Lol!

 

[Miami Reef]

 

[Tamberav]

I think dosing rocks with copper was more of a problem when you had to use crappy copper kits and try to guess pink from slightly darker pink.

The hannah HR copper test kit has had such a big impact for those who QT with copper even with some fish who were thought to be previously copper sensitive can now be treated.

 

[Lionfish hunter]

It baffles me that so many people think bacteria plays this role in a tank with ich. The problem is ich people! The tank is clearly cycled and there is no ammonia or nitrite spikes, it is stable as any fish needs. All the bacteria in the world could not solve this parasite problem. Why are we talking about bacteria! Somebody please tell me 1 specific scenario were bacteria changes anything in his tank. The only problem is parasites, bacteria does absolutely nothing for parasites, please try and be helpful.

 

[Miami Reef]

Morning update:

Copper dropped from 2.5 to 2.30. I topped off the copper.

Now I’m doubting the efficacy of copper. I see a nassarius snail and an urchin ALIVE! I rescued the urchin. Here’s the nassarius snail.

 

[Miami Reef]

Maybe my Hannah test kit is faulty? I really really don’t understand how these critters are alive with copper…

I don’t think my test kit is faulty. I’ve made copper standards and it tested them fine. Maybe inverts are hardier than we thought?

The copper killed all my aiptasia! It’s an excellent eradication technique for a FOWLR.

Edit: maybe copper works best for smaller, simpler organisms. I think all my copepods and amohipods are dead? Let me check because I know a spot where there are TONS of them.

 

[Vreef007]

Hi there, sorry to hear about the issues with your fish and tank. I am also in Miami and just wanted share my experience with ich and how it appears to be fully resolved or controlled in my tank. I have 4 tangs and various other fish in a 180 waterbox system that’s been up for almost 2 years. Two of the tangs came from my prior tank. About a year and a half ago I introduced the Hippo tang which looked great in the store. A few days after the Hippo was introduced it began showing signs of ich and soon after the other tang appeared to have it as well. About a week or so later the Hippo appeared to show signs of what may have been velvet… Now instead of attempting to treat my fish with chemicals and QT which I think adds a lot of stress to both the fish and human, instead I decided to feed my fish frequently with highly nutritious, minimally processed natural foods. This included live clams, oysters and LRS’s Fish Frenzy which I still feed them. Please note, I also believe rock solid parameters and a appropriate size protein skimmer are critical if you are going to take this approach. Anyway, after a few more weeks of frequent feeding and just keeping everything stable, the tangs all started looking better until finally none showed signs of ich or any other disease. Today all my fish are fat and happy. Colors are vibrant and I continue to feed them well. (I also have an SPS dominant tank )

Bottomline, I am no expert, this has just been my experience. I believe that stress and poor nutrition will weaken a fish’s immune system and open the door to these parasites. Hope this helps.

 

[Vreef007]

Here’s a pic of the tank:

 

[Miami Reef]

Here’s a pic of the tank:

Beautiful tank! Thank you for sharing your story!

I’d love to visit your tank in person one day. Definitely a success in my book!

 

[Elliott ll]

@Miami Reef What did you feed your moorish idol when first acquiring? I have a new one now and it's on day 3 of not eating.

 

[Miami Reef]

@Miami Reef What did you feed your moorish idol when first acquiring? I have a new one now and it's on day 3 of not eating.

LRS fish frenzy! Good luck!

 

[Elliott ll]

The only invert I added was a shrimp a month before the fallow was over. I kept them in quarantine for 2 weeks and they shed a lot during those weeks. I also added unquarantined urchins (they can’t hold ich). My fish always had those spots though. I’m thinking either I messed up with fallow, or the fish had ich from a failed quarantine.

I think you may have made a mistake with adding unquarantined urchins. I believe they can indeed have ich, and certainly have water or something on them with ich. Adding the shrimp was a gamble too. I am in the middle of a fallow treatment on my 90 gallon , about 21 days in. I would never add anything at all, would reset the clock.

 

[snorklr]

lionfish i think what people are trying to convey is the theory that fish do better in older tanks than new ones...and no one really has a definative explanation as to why...and there's a good chance that the answer is bacteria...and not just the bacteria responsible for the nitrogen cycle itself but countless others that process things we dont understand and cant test for or dose...and maybe they only show up in sufficient numbers after a long time and/or after introduction of rock that actually came out of the ocean...and when they do, the fish are healthier and able to fight off disease...if this hobby was easy everyone would have instant success and obviously not everybody does....at this point the OP's tank has devolved into the way we kept fish 40 years ago...fish only, dosing meds....its like a setup from the show "Tanked"...can you keep fish alive this way? of course you can...but its no longer a reef tank

 

[wmb0003]

Morning update:

Copper dropped from 2.5 to 2.30. I topped off the copper.

Now I’m doubting the efficacy of copper. I see a nassarius snail and an urchin ALIVE! I rescued the urchin. Here’s the nassarius snail.

I guess the sand and/or rock is absorbing some copper after all.

 

[Miami Reef]

The fact that you can have an ich free newly set up copper quarantine tank proves that theory wrong.

Will ich be less prevalent in an old tank? Sure. But does ich in a tank mean that tank is too immature? No.

 

[Miami Reef]

I guess the sand and/or rock is absorbing some copper after all.

I know the rocks and sand absorb copper. I did mention this in previous posts in this thread.

It drops .20 every 8 hours which is fine because I test and top off. Therapeutic is 2.0ppm. As long as I’m above that I’m good!

I test 3x a day and the lowest it ever goes is 2.3ppm. I obviously redose it to 2.5

 

[Lionfish hunter]

@Miami Reef What did you feed your moorish idol when first acquiring? I have a new one now and it's on day 3 of not eating.

Live clams from the grocery store and nori were all mine would eat at first. It gave him time to pick at them on his time.