This hobby is getting out of control with costs

[ReeferBud]

Many good points made on this thread.

I think the conversation needs to be separated into dry goods and livestock, but both have one common denominator… supply and demand…

While the last couple of years have certainly seen constraints and impacts to the supply side, I’d argue that the biggest factors driving prices up is on the demand side.

As long as there are consumers that are willing to pay exorbitant prices for “something”, companies and sellers will maximize prices up to that willingness constraint… “we” often complain that “they” are raising the prices but it’s really “we” that are paying them… if “we” stopped accepting those prices, “they” would have to lower prices until demand met supply.

However, that would have consequences… we’d no longer see as much r&d and innovation and we’d then complain…

I’ve had to make significant changes to how I approach this hobby. I only buy used equipment, I don’t go for the latest named coral, and I invest in reliability to ensure that I can keep my fish and coral healthy for a long time. I’m fortunate to have a mature reef with colonies and fish that are over 12 years old.

I just with “they” stopped paying those crazy prices for things and the other “they” stopped charging crazy prices so that I could get those fancy corals…

 

[Genetics]

Doing some investment research I came across Bertram capital. Interesting approach this company is taking. If I would have known about this I would have definitely tried to invest in their fourth fund venture before it closed funding.

Notably they acquired BRS, MarineDepot, Neptune Systems, and Ecotech. I think if there were less glass aquarium makers they would have acquired those as well. I would surmise there is probably a minimum 20% surcharge on all items so they may recoup their monopolistic investment approach to the hobby.

 

[fishybizzness]

The new flipper edge came out at 70 for the smaller one and 130 for the max. Holy shamolie! 130 for a little plastic and magnets? I used to think the older versions were expensive. Don't get me wrong, I have one of the previous generations and in my opinion it's the greatest glass scraper out there but 130? No thanks.

 

[Potatohead]

Doing some investment research I came across Bertram capital. Interesting approach this company is taking. If I would have known about this I would have definitely tried to invest in their fourth fund venture before it closed funding.

Notably they acquired BRS, MarineDepot, Neptune Systems, and Ecotech. I think if there were less glass aquarium makers they would have acquired those as well. I would surmise there is probably a minimum 20% surcharge on all items so they may recoup their monopolistic investment approach to the hobby.

Personally I think this absolutely nails it. Time and time again we see new reefers watch the videos and go on to believe they need high end equipment to run a reef tank. I just read a thread this morning where a guy has an Apex, Trident and DOS but doesn't know the fundamentals of dosing kalk. Sad really.

 

[BeltedCoyote]

Its bad enough we have reached the age of $800-$1200 lights, Ive seen test equipment approaching the $200 mark, 110 gallon Tanks for $4000-5000 and now another skimmer released by Adaptive reef starting at $769.00 !!!
Add the cost of fish and coral which is out of control and it questions Who can afford this and the impact on a new hobbyist that wants a reef tank

You're not wrong.

 

[Troylee]

Doing some investment research I came across Bertram capital. Interesting approach this company is taking. If I would have known about this I would have definitely tried to invest in their fourth fund venture before it closed funding.

Notably they acquired BRS, MarineDepot, Neptune Systems, and Ecotech. I think if there were less glass aquarium makers they would have acquired those as well. I would surmise there is probably a minimum 20% surcharge on all items so they may recoup their monopolistic investment approach to the hobby.

I read on Reddit or something I can’t remember, that brs was trying to acquire wwc… idk if it’s true or not.. peeps get crazy spreading rumors lol

 

[hoffmeyerz]

Many good points made on this thread.

As long as there are consumers that are willing to pay exorbitant prices for “something”, companies and sellers will maximize prices up to that willingness constraint… “we” often complain that “they” are raising the prices but it’s really “we” that are paying them… if “we” stopped accepting those prices, “they” would have to lower prices until demand met supply.

Pressure to get the latest gadgets and tech is very high on newcomers. I've only been involved in saltwater for a few years and there is an overwhelming feeling put on first timers that if you don't have this top level skimmer, dc pump, light, testing equip, controller, doser, etc. that you won't be successful.
What helped me was seeing over and over again here....slow down....that's the only thing that held me back. Marketing is SO strong and for someone who hasn't run tanks in the past it really gets pushed like a "must have"!
Unfortunately it's like anything else we humans create, flawed. We tend to forget that it's the consumer that ultimately sets the price...we are the demand! As long as there are those willing to pay, the prices will stay.
For me, I look for used or just one model back. It just has to work, that's all I want

 

[YOYOYOReefer]

while it will never be a cheap hobby.

i think the key is to look outside of hobby sources and buying used gear
in some ways a huge tank is cheapest for gear.
for my lagoon we use 2 $69 trolling motors, and that would cost many thousands in mp60's


We use old cole parmer and milwaukee controllers and masterflex and litermeter pumps and have slowly bought many online used very cheap. I also use refillable ph probes been reefing 38 years , have saved money just in probes. Im a big fan of ozone and uv.. both are available from sources outside of the hobby.

i also dont use any test kits (not recommended for beginners) but i have larger tanks and along with that come stability.
I do check salinity, ph , orp , temp, each has redundancy and just do 4-6 icp tests on each system a year. Not to say i would not buy a kit if i was having an issue i just know once my tanks are growing thats good enough with bi monthly icp i know the results are accurate.

 

[408Dartfish]

My hydra 26 burnt out the other day. 430$ for a new light looks like it has 50$ worth parts into it.

 

[workhz]

I just read a thread this morning where a guy has an Apex, Trident and DOS but doesn't know the fundamentals of dosing kalk. Sad really.

and likely on a 10 gallon nano.

 

[vetteguy53081]

And yet another product showing trend to high prices.
Now we have new Gyre pumps released by Maxspect- Take your pick- $500 or $600 . . .FOR A GYRE PUMP ???

 

[YOYOYOReefer]

maybe Minn Kota will make some smaller trolling motors,,, amazing what $100 can get you these days in a troller motor.

 

[vetteguy53081]

maybe Minn Kota will make some smaller trolling motors,,, amazing what $100 can get you these days in a troller motor.

LOL agree

 

[Steve2020]

And yet another product showing trend to high prices.
Now we have new Gyre pumps released by Maxspect- Take your pick- $500 or $600 . . .FOR A GYRE PUMP ???

Are you talking about the new Gyre XF350 Cloud Edition? If so I was actually surprised that not 1 pump but that 2 pumps plus controller and spare parts is only $579 in todays market. I really thought they would of cost more considering it is a new style pump. Not sure of the reliability of these new pumps ( lots of movable parts ) compared to my Vortech's but looks like an interesting concept having the multiple flow cages and directors in a single pump.
Received an email from BRS today about these pumps so I had to do research about them.

​

 

[afrokobe]

The new flipper edge came out at 70 for the smaller one and 130 for the max. Holy shamolie! 130 for a little plastic and magnets? I used to think the older versions were expensive. Don't get me wrong, I have one of the previous generations and in my opinion it's the greatest glass scraper out there but 130? No thanks.

not entirely on topic, but I will never buy a flipper again regardless of the price. Scratched up my brand new mr aqua and I know there wasn't any sand trapped in between. Tunze all the way, although those can get pricey too

 

[907_Reefer]

The new flipper edge came out at 70 for the smaller one and 130 for the max. Holy shamolie! 130 for a little plastic and magnets? I used to think the older versions were expensive. Don't get me wrong, I have one of the previous generations and in my opinion it's the greatest glass scraper out there but 130? No thanks.

not entirely on topic, but I will never buy a flipper again regardless of the price. Scratched up my brand new mr aqua and I know there wasn't any sand trapped in between. Tunze all the way, although those can get pricey too

$20 Seachem works great for me!



But now I want the Tunze.

 

[Jonreefer]

I have used the Tunze care magnets for a few years.
I only have a small tank now so $25 for the nano isnt to bad and when I had my Reefer 350 I think I only paid $40 for the long.
I dont understand the price of $70-130 for a magnet

 

[GatorGreg]

I think that’s why you’re seeing more and more nanos. It’s way easier to get into the hobby that way. Yeah you can go cheap on the tank and stand. But most peoples significant others don’t want a ghastly looking thrown together DIY tank and stand in their living room. They’re much more willing to accept a clean looking setup like waterbox or Red Sea or whatever your favorite brand is. I’d love to have a 90 gallon cube clean setup. But I’m just not looking to spend that much. The tank and stand are the cheap part. Rock, salt, RODI filters and all that extra ongoing stuff is the expensive part. With a nano these costs are cut by 90 percent if you go 10 gallon or less.