This hobby is getting out of control with costs

[hans4811]

For me, this hobby is going in the same direction as Golf…got too expensive to play. Haven’t picked up a stick in prob 25 yrs, which is sad as I was a scratch golfer at one point.

$5000 for a 130gal tank !? $1000 lights ! I’ll pass…..

 

[CrunchyBananas]

I've been in reef keeping about 20 years now, and installation and maintenance is my full time job, so I feel quite in tune with costs and their increases over the last 10 or so years. Beyond inflation or whatever other economics that drive prices for everything, I've noticed the biggest rise in prices in our industry are likely due to 2 main factors:

1.) Social media. Already mentioned several times, but yeah, keeping up with the Jones's (Joneses? Jonesus?) has hit an all time high with most people heavily involved in social media, and constantly seeing "better" systems. People need the newest and greatest things because X uses one and has crazy acros, or Y doses it, and his torches are insane!

It even extends to the livestock within the tanks. So many tanks have become glowing blue trophy cases to show off expensive LPS. Everywhere I look on social media is packed out tanks of all the name brand torches, fancy scolymia, etc. that show zero growth. People treat them like a bouquet of flowers rather than a living, growing ecosystem. It's just fancy rockscapes with each little pedestal holding a $500-$1200 coral to show off just because the name.

2.) The (3 letter acronym) sales engine. A certain company caught the wave of social media at just the right time to become a massive conglomerate at this point. We all know their videos and products, and most their videos do contain good information, especially for new hobbyists. However, this is where it becomes a bit predatory on new reefers, they become the sole source of information, either through videos or their social media. People fail to realize almost all their videos are sales pitches for products they carry. They even create videos to drive demand one way or another (i.e. poorly reviewing phillips coral care gen 2, stopping carrying it, then praising the neptune sky as soon as it dropped, despite it being at the same price point and a poorer performing light). But they create this situation where a hobbyist trusts them, they say a neptune, a trident, a DOS, and a DDR are needed to bring the red sea tank (purchased from them) to the next level.

People used to learn from other people in the hobby, books, clubs with speakers, etc. but I'd bet over 90% of newer hobbyists post 2018 were shown the ropes and relied (if not still rely) heavily on this sales engine. When the lesson is almost always buy another product, its not wonder the prices keep going up.

 

[ingchr1]

But the marketing tells us:

Stability is needed - You need an automated tester to achieve this.
Cords in a tank are ugly - You need the one brand of powerheads that have no cords in the tank.
Particles in your water column, high nutrients, tired of socks - You need a roller mat to removal all particles immediately.
More/constant water changes are best - Buy more salt; buy an auto water change system.
Here's the latest and greatest in lighting...
These are the popular must have corals...

 

[Cichlid Dad]

I've been in reef keeping about 20 years now, and installation and maintenance is my full time job, so I feel quite in tune with costs and their increases over the last 10 or so years. Beyond inflation or whatever other economics that drive prices for everything, I've noticed the biggest rise in prices in our industry are likely due to 2 main factors:

1.) Social media. Already mentioned several times, but yeah, keeping up with the Jones's (Joneses? Jonesus?) has hit an all time high with most people heavily involved in social media, and constantly seeing "better" systems. People need the newest and greatest things because X uses one and has crazy acros, or Y doses it, and his torches are insane!

It even extends to the livestock within the tanks. So many tanks have become glowing blue trophy cases to show off expensive LPS. Everywhere I look on social media is packed out tanks of all the name brand torches, fancy scolymia, etc. that show zero growth. People treat them like a bouquet of flowers rather than a living, growing ecosystem. It's just fancy rockscapes with each little pedestal holding a $500-$1200 coral to show off just because the name.

2.) The (3 letter acronym) sales engine. A certain company caught the wave of social media at just the right time to become a massive conglomerate at this point. We all know their videos and products, and most their videos do contain good information, especially for new hobbyists. However, this is where it becomes a bit predatory on new reefers, they become the sole source of information, either through videos or their social media. People fail to realize almost all their videos are sales pitches for products they carry. They even create videos to drive demand one way or another (i.e. poorly reviewing phillips coral care gen 2, stopping carrying it, then praising the neptune sky as soon as it dropped, despite it being at the same price point and a poorer performing light). But they create this situation where a hobbyist trusts them, they say a neptune, a trident, a DOS, and a DDR are needed to bring the red sea tank (purchased from them) to the next level.

People used to learn from other people in the hobby, books, clubs with speakers, etc. but I'd bet over 90% of newer hobbyists post 2018 were shown the ropes and relied (if not still rely) heavily on this sales engine. When the lesson is almost always buy another product, its not wonder the prices keep going up.

Wow! I mean wow! This is the best explanation of the whole thread period. If sums up everything. To your point, all I have heard about in lights in multiple threads is the new blade light. It happened right after the **s video came out and I thought the same thing. What sheep we are. Thank you for putting it so well.

 

[Reefer Matt]

Costs have certainly gone up. But so have success rates. It seems like most people have a frag tank now because they are successful, which is a wonderful thing. We all know of ways to cut costs, such as buying used. I think in general, we want to try these new flashy gadgets, but want them in a price range we are comfortable with. That can happen if companies are willing to accept less profit. But they are not in business to make friends, they are there to take our money. I think most of us felt warm and fuzzy before the "big merger" of certain companies, because we felt they were on our side. Now we are left disappointed and enraged that they want more of our money, which is understandable.

 

[Fishgeek88]

I've been in the hobby for 20 plus years. Hobbyist, retail and service ends. I think that the marketing, trends and the new products have gotten out of control...but the hobby overal is in a better spot. Equipment selection has never been better. You can buy old school powerheards like maxijets for less than what you paid 20 years ago...or go abyss on the other end of the spectrum. There are a million LED options out there. And there has never been more all in one tanks. The trends is what kills people. You dont need $400 in Hanna testers, you dont need Radion G6s, you dont need OG bounce mushrooms. I see a lot of high dollar builds on here with very unimpressive displays. Its easy, buy what you can afford and what you enjoy...buck the trend.

 

[Sfork]

Agree. I bought my Apex from my LFS> It was same price as everywhere else, so may as well support him.

As for other things, I am lucky enough to have had from 5g to 1200g tanks. I have most of that equipment as well. Currently condensed down to everything in a 50g tub with a 150g tub sump and my 180 until I move. Should have no reason at this point to buy anything, but still thinking I will order me some Kessil 500 for the new tank. Not needed, but would rather ahem a few of those instead of the tons of 360s I have lol.

I was doing kessils switched to the G5’s for the replaceable lenses

 

[Bob Weigant]

I do not keep up with all the new gadgets that come out. Im still on my keep it simple routine and for the most part it works for me. Yes I have been slowly upgrading my lights G5 to G6 ( really just adding a few more ) but I have no interest in buying all the new things that come out. If my tank is doing just fine without them then thats good enough for me

 

[Schulks]

If people keep buying them, they will keep making them. Cant understand how anyone can justify an $800 powerhead. I'll stick with my Nero 5s.

It is funny those nero 5s are still made by the same company as the $800.
They are also still quite expensive lol

 

[pulpfiction]

I was looking at getting an ai prime. I watched a vid on it from brs that shows their price. I went to brs website and its $50 more than it was last year. That is a significant price hike.

 

[fish farmer]

I've been in the hobby for 20 plus years. Hobbyist, retail and service ends. I think that the marketing, trends and the new products have gotten out of control...but the hobby overal is in a better spot. Equipment selection has never been better. You can buy old school powerheards like maxijets for less than what you paid 20 years ago...or go abyss on the other end of the spectrum. There are a million LED options out there. And there has never been more all in one tanks. The trends is what kills people. You dont need $400 in Hanna testers, you dont need Radion G6s, you dont need OG bounce mushrooms. I see a lot of high dollar builds on here with very unimpressive displays. Its easy, buy what you can afford and what you enjoy...buck the trend.

...but, but, but... practically everyone on this forum pushes Hanna test kits.

Newbie comes on asking about testing phos...geta Hanna...

 

[CrunchyBananas]

...but, but, but... practically everyone on this forum pushes Hanna test kits.

Newbie comes on asking about testing phos...geta Hanna...

Wowzers, I have a couple of them, and I can say exactly where I first heard of them too!
Theres only one or two I like and I think are worth while, the rest... well it's easier to sell a hard digital read out over color change

My background is research aquaculture, and I've used a Hach spectrophotometer in a lab setting quite a bit. I wanted these little colorimeters to be really good so badly, but I'm not as impressed as most by them, and it feels like they need to be replaced after a year to hold accuracy.

but yeah people get spammed by that suggestion, I still stick with salifert, better and cheaper imo.

 

[Lbrdsoxfan]

Ya try and find primers! LOL

I buy in massive bulk, lol. Last major order of primers & powder was back in early 2019. I never even knew there was a shortage .

 

[Lbrdsoxfan]

...but, but, but... practically everyone on this forum pushes Hanna test kits.

Newbie comes on asking about testing phos...geta Hanna... Salifert

Fixed .

 

[Cichlid Dad]

I buy in massive bulk, lol. Last major order of primers & powder was back in early 2019. I never even knew there was a shortage .

Shhh, me too! Only I'm still working on my 2008 supplies from the last great shortage! LOL!

 

[Brennin]

Its bad enough we have reached the age of $800-$1200 lights, Ive seen test equipment approaching the $200 mark, 110 gallon Tanks for $4000-5000 and now another skimmer released by Adaptive reef starting at $769.00 !!!
Add the cost of fish and coral which is out of control and it questions Who can afford this and the impact on a new hobbyist that wants a reef tank

I got back into the hobby recently and honestly almost reconsidered it when I realized how expensive everything is. Clownfish can cost $150. They used to be $10. To set up and run a decent sized tank now is 6000 in the first year easy. Even with getting used equipment. That’s hard to justify.

 

[fish farmer]

Wowzers, I have a couple of them, and I can say exactly where I first heard of them too!
Theres only one or two I like and I think are worth while, the rest... well it's easier to sell a hard digital read out over color change

My background is research aquaculture, and I've used a Hach spectrophotometer in a lab setting quite a bit. I wanted these little colorimeters to be really good so badly, but I'm not as impressed as most by them, and it feels like they need to be replaced after a year to hold accuracy.

but yeah people get spammed by that suggestion, I still stick with salifert, better and cheaper imo.

My career is in meat aquaculture (salmonids), as long as they are swimming in the right direction and eating solid food...I actually pitched getting the Hanna fw ammonia for work use, but only used it a couple of times. We send samples off to the lab for testing.

I like my salifert, when they are new, just wish I could get some color on the phos kit. I used my low range Hanna today...the old one with the timing issue...got 0.02 reading...so I'll feed heavy tonight.

 

[Asagi]

Honestly pal, what isn’t out of control with cost over the past 24 months?

 

[Genetics]

It’s not just this hobby. The decline of the all mighty dollar will continue to push prices higher.

Back in 2000 everything was more or less standard pricing. You want a mushroom rock $30-50 dollars depending on how many mushrooms. Sometime around that time though naming of corals started which lent the idea that the color variations were worth way more.

At the same time the hobby as a whole started having greater success. New lights, new pumps, concepts of water quality, backups, constant monitoring… all were huge leaps.

Now when building out an aquarium I want those named pieces. Why? Because they’re beautiful. I know what I’m buying. I’m supporting conservation knowing this frag has been in circulation for a decade.

Is there price gouging in this hobby. No doubt! But in the end it’s a market of demand. If someone wants to pay $2k for some show piece that’s on them. I’ll wait for the $20 frag.

@vetteguy53081 It is similar to the idea of why pay for the Z06 when the base is still a vette.

 

[TampaSmitty]

I’m slightly taken back by how much my 13.5 Fluval tank has in it now. Maybe only 1500$ in zoas but all the other crap I bought to keep it going is now around 5k
So maybe 6500-7000k all together to have 11 gallons in a box . Still beats the 20k in guitars I don’t know how to play or the 10k in stereo equipment I can’t crank past 3 without a visit from local constibles . Still money we’ll spent then on drugs or women
From younger years