This hobby is out of control

[Biocube32]

Whining about whining lol

 

[Dkeller_nc]

The most amusing part of this (and other threads like it), is a fair number of folks complaining about how much the frag sellers want for an idiotically-named coral, and then several posts later opining how much they want that same named coral.

The answer, of course, is simply to realize that it's actually the collector's attitude that is the issue. Stop collecting named frags and setting up a garden of 1/2" frags on ugly little pucks, and the problem goes away. There's tons of baseball to softball sized colonies that are actually named for what they actually are (i.e., acropora tenius) for sale on major websites for $100 - $400, even from Australia. But if the stick garden in neat little rows on a frag rack that all have goofy names is your thing, more power to you, but just realize that it's really going to cost.

It's simply an either/or thing, and it's a matter of taste. But it's incorrect to think that the frag sellers are gouging people, they're simply obliging that same collector's attitude, and making a living doing it.

 

[ZipAdeeZoa]

I personally like to see these threads pop up every now and then, I like seeing how the conversation evolves, fresh perspectives and the civility dynamics as they all ebb and flow. I also enjoy when people question things because without doing that we become complacent in their existence and may end up accepting we otherwise wouldn't. What I would like to see more of within these threads is something that rarely comes up, something that we all at some point have surely taken for granted.

"I can't believe these outrageous prices, I just want ____ for my tank, why does that have to cost a small fortune???". We all get so caught up in this we forget to step back and look at the bigger picture. People seem to get so hung up on the amount of zeros in a price tag they forget how fortunate they are to be in a position that they can even look at one. Do we ever stop to think about how crazy it is that this is whats bothering us?

So many people all over the world never get the chance to be upset over the prices of radions or Jason fox Homewrecker frags. So many people all over the world will only ever get to worry about their families hunger, the bullets flying through their streets, how not to freeze to death in the streets this winter, If they still have a school after the drone strike- Do we forget how many thousands of worries away from any of those things someone who has the luxury of having a saltwater tank has to be?

We all get caught up in that, I'm no exception and I don't think anyone on here could have gotten here without being frustrated by some aspect of this hobby and I'm not trying to say we shouldn't. We just need to remember that when green hair algae has us feeling defeated, when tears run down our cheeks as we hold the lifeless body of our favourite fish and even when we loose thousands of dollars when our dream tank crashes- How fortunate are we to be in any of those situations in the first place?

I've only been on this forum for a few months and in that time I've seen at least 20 of these "Stupid high prices for lights/corals/fish/powerheads/controllers etc" threads. I haven't seen a single one for how fortunate someone feels to be struggling with any of those things or to have this hobby in the first place.

Just my 2 cents- which I'm very fortunate to have and grateful I get to share.

 

[fishybizzness]

We currently live in a world where it seems everyone wants something for nothing. We always want the biggest, most colorful, rarest, etc... I remember my first cellphone, the brick! It was the coolest thing ever, even though it weighed about 5 pounds! Lol! Then the race began to see who could make the smallest phone. It got to phones that could easily fit in the palm of your hand. Then the smart phone was created and the trend reversed and the phones started getting bigger to the point now that they rival some tablets in size and cost over $1000 for some. Aquariums are the same as far as alot of people wanting the latest and greatest gadgets and livestock. A big % of aquarium owners now will probably not have have a tank in a few years. I would even go so far as to say that a % are not really into aquariums for the love of the hobby but in it because they thought it was easy because they saw one of their friends doing it or just because it's a way to make some $. Most of those people are the ones selling their whole setups + frag tanks after a year or two. I've found that keeping things simple usually leads to the most success and having the latest high priced gadgets and $$$$ frags doesn't make me happy. I set up my tank to look like the reefs where I snorkel so I don't find a tank full of sticks very beautiful. It doesn't look like reality to me.

 

[KJoFan]

After visiting an LFS this weekend, I made the comment that I think if you're willing to put in the time and effort really looking at every coral (or the coral of your choice) in the store you could come away with some really nice pieces. I tend to think LFS prices, especially for livestock are a bit high, at least at face value. But, when it comes to coral, if you're willing to do the work and spend the time, you'll find some real hidden gems that might even be exactly like that $300 Homewrecker booger you bought, only for a fraction of the price. But, there are many who still wouldn't buy that piece at the LFS simply because it didn't carry the name and they can't prove the lineage. They're generally buying the name, not so much the coral in hopes of growing it and reselling it to make money. For those, it's less about creating a complete reef system like those passionate reefers someone mentioned who are willing to cut large pieces of their colonies and/or sell or give them away for what most consider very low prices.

It takes all kinds to make the world go 'round as they say, no different with this hobby, everyone has a different end goal or idea in mind of what the end goal looks like.

I find it hard not to get caught up in the trap of designer names/corals etc myself sometimes, but this time around, I'm trying to just go for what looks good to me and not worry about the name attached to it. And maybe spend more time at the LFS myself hunting down those diamonds in the rough that will be showstoppers with some TLC.

 

[sde1500]

Well worth the money

That is purely your opinion. Others can have the opinion it isn't. Totally ok

And for people to complain about prices of corals they aren’t even buying I find funny as well to me it means you either want it and can’t afford it and your jealous

What a horrible attitude to have.

The price is what anyone will pay for it there was a live sale from JF and he had a new coral priced at 500 I think and at the end all of them were still left because it wasn’t worth that and in his last live sale the price of the same coral was 250 and none of them were left because people thought the coral was worth that much.

This is a good point, the price is dictated by what some are willing to pay.

 

[sde1500]

I find it hard not to get caught up in the trap of designer names/corals etc myself sometimes, but this time around, I'm trying to just go for what looks good to me and not worry about the name attached to it. And maybe spend more time at the LFS myself hunting down those diamonds in the rough that will be showstoppers with some TLC.

I agree, and I'd frag swaps to places to look as well. You can score tremendous deals there, all day, and especially at the end of the day. Walked to a booth that was just about to start packing up, and was looking through some corals, picked up a big chunky frag for half price and he threw in another for free just because. And since then I've added another 5 corals to my tanks through trading, with more on the way. I don't have anything too rare, just a coral or two that is growing super fast in my tank. People are willing to trade for corals they want too. Great way to add more interesting corals to the tank.

 

[Dkeller_nc]

But, when it comes to coral, if you're willing to do the work and spend the time, you'll find some real hidden gems that might even be exactly like that $300 Homewrecker booger you bought, only for a fraction of the price. But, there are many who still wouldn't buy that piece at the LFS simply because it didn't carry the name and they can't prove the lineage.

I just went through precisely what you're talking about a couple of months ago at a local LFS. For about $1500, I pretty much filled a 2' x 2' tank with baseball-sized acropora from Australia and a few acans here and there. The Australian acros have a species name, but so far as the owner or I'm aware, no comic-book-culture name. And they've multiple colors from blue, pink, yellow, green w/blue tips, etc... I'm pretty sure that if I'd instead visited one of the frag dealer's sites and bought 1/2" - 3/4" named-coral frags, I could've filled the average 12" x 3" frag rack, and then waited about 6 - 9 months for the frags to grow out to the equivalent size of the corals that now occupy my tank.

To each their own, but in my case, no thanks. I much prefer the natural looking reef I constructed with no frag racks, no frag plugs, and list of ridiculous names that I have to keep up with to preserve "lineage" (which is in and of itself a bizarre notion). I should also note that my choice wasn't a cost-saving issue; I've more than enough funds to afford whatever I want. I just don't want "homewreckers" or a "Cookie Monster".

What I'd encourage folks that are reading this thread and are on the fence about whether they want a named frag garden or a natural looking reef is to look through some of the tank threads, like Richard Ross's FTS from this thread. Then mindfully make a decision - do you want to buy large colonies from a place like Diver's Den and construct a reef tank? Or does a frag tank with a collection of corals from the major frag sellers appeal to you more? Even though I've made it clear which side of the fence I sit on, both are valid choices. But I'm suggesting that people just getting into this make a mindful choice.

 

[SVP]

Just a few questions to all who commented on this thread. I personally have had saltwater fish since 1992 my first job wasbat a pet store and I worked in the fish dept. Back then and up until around 2000 not many people at all kept corals. Mainly scientists/marine biologists and the like. And certainly there was not the variety available today in the 90s. That all aside though as I have watched the industry grow from nothing to now the craziness of fb and everyone selling. I am wondering where you guys go(online as I live near Orlando Florida and if you see the big 3s prices over there, no such luck in getting a good LPS colony for under $500. ) So where can I go to get what I collect as I have 2 tanks(Euphyllia, zoos,nice blastos) .I dont play the name game or rather I understand for identification purposes or explaining what I want or have it makes it easier. But to slap the Holy grail name in front of a frogspawn, hammer,or favia is a joke, and is only for money. But I am off topic here I'm asking where to find these great prices? I have always been the the type to buy a colony rather than a frag(I do know that buying from other reefers is a good way as I picked up a 30+headed bicolor hammer for $160. But that's not the norm rather the exception). I have looked a lot but just cannot seem to find nice hammers, nice blastos forget torch colonies lol there's no way a torch colony is going for $300-500 right now. But please point me in the right direction if you can. I understand both sides to this topic and have no issues with either. Just cannot find the good colonies at good prices.

 

[nano reef]

I probably shouldnt say this But the greediness of people on here discust me! Last year at this time I was stalking ebay! I would find sellers that were letting high end zoas go for .99 starting bids and if you were lucky enough to find a new seller that didint have many or any followers you could get them insanely cheap and not single polyps but some were colonies! I had big colonies of kamikaze kush, predators, marvin the martain, bit coin, *** krak, LSOH, death stars, speckled krak, GMK, so many more! I had every highend zoa there was at the time except strosphere which was big last year! I was 1 day from placing in frag tank and was very sick and down for 6 weeks. Lost them all but a few! No one does those auctions now! but the prices are better then on here! I could get them back from different sellers (more money of course then I paid before) but then again paying out the shipping to all of them sucks. Now I am collecting shrooms and rebuying lots of them I lost! anyone who is charging reasonable prices for high end zoas, shrooms and any lps besides chalices and blasto( take to long to grow) hit me up! oops didn't relize this was so old!