Weird spot on rhomboid wrasse?

[Reefer Dan]

I recently acquired a rhomboid wrasse and it’s in QT, today I noticed this weird “boil” like spot on its head?

Received on Thursday (5/23) it ate
5/24 increased copper power to 1.0 ppm (didn’t eat)
5/25 increased copper power to 1.7 ppm (didn’t eat)
today I was planning to increase copper to 2.25 if it ate, but it hasn’t eaten and I noticed this today and it’s only on one side.

I’m wondering if it’s bacterial, but any insights or advice here?

 

[vetteguy53081]

I recently acquired a rhomboid wrasse and it’s in QT, today I noticed this weird “boil” like spot on its head?

Received on Thursday (5/23) it ate
5/24 increased copper power to 1.0 ppm (didn’t eat)
5/25 increased copper power to 1.7 ppm (didn’t eat)
today I was planning to increase copper to 2.25 if it ate, but it hasn’t eaten and I noticed this today and it’s only on one side.

I’m wondering if it’s bacterial, but any insights or advice here?

Angles are hard to see and pics a little blurry but one shows a possible post injury or bacterial but need better pics
Is fish eating and breathing normal?

 

[Reefer Dan]

Angles are hard to see and pics a little blurry but one shows a possible post injury or bacterial but need better pics
Is fish eating and breathing normal?

It hasn’t eaten since Thursday (it ate when I got it, that was it).

It is breathing normal, when it decides to swim it seems to do so normally.

 

[vetteguy53081]

It hasn’t eaten since Thursday (it ate when I got it, that was it).

It is breathing normal, when it decides to swim it seems to do so normally.

All the plastic plants and lack of sand is not helping the cause and MAY have contributed to injury or scratch
Still can’t clearly see spot - at least on phone screen

 

[Reefer Dan]

All the plastic plants and lack of sand is not helping the cause and MAY have contributed to injury or scratch
Still can’t clearly see spot - at least on phone screen.

Just to clarify, you want me to add more sand and remove the plants? I thought the plants would make it more comfortable with ample hiding spots. #fishmedic

 

[jkcoral]

Just to clarify, you want me to add more sand and remove the plants? I thought the plants would make it more comfortable with ample hiding spots. #fishmedic

Just put in a few more pieces of PVC.

In my experience, copper is hard on wrasses and some are more sensitive to others.

What have you been trying to feed? Maybe switching foods or trying a few different things will get it munching on something. My go-to is reef nutrition ROE, those little eggs have gotten every fish to eat that was reluctant.

 

[Reefer Dan]

Just put in a few more pieces of PVC.

In my experience, copper is hard on wrasses and some are more sensitive to others.

What have you been trying to feed? Maybe switching foods or trying a few different things will get it munching on something. My go-to is reef nutrition ROE, those little eggs have gotten every fish to eat that was reluctant.

I have tried LRS reef frenzy, mysis, spirulina brine, tdo pellets. I did mix roe and pacpods with other foods, but I will try the roe again.

Do we think this is a reaction to the copper?

 

[vetteguy53081]

I have tried LRS reef frenzy, mysis, spirulina brine, tdo pellets. I did mix roe and pacpods with other foods, but I will try the roe again.

Do we think this is a reaction to the copper?

Possible if you have false reading

 

[jkcoral]

Do we think this is a reaction to the copper?

That would be my guess.

There’s a lot of discussion/debate out there about the sensitivity of wrasses to copper, but there is some consensus that it’s best to ramp the levels up a little slower (~5 days).

I hope your fish starts perking up soon. One of my favorite species, and unbelievably beautiful once settled!

 

[Reefer Dan]

well it is now breathing pretty rapid but not “heavy”, so I’m leaning towards a bacterial issue.. my luck man. Now the real question, drop the copper levels and dose kanaplex or keep it where it is and dose kanaplex?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

well it is now breathing pretty rapid but not “heavy”, so I’m leaning towards a bacterial issue.. my luck man. Now the real question, drop the copper levels and dose kanaplex or keep it where it is and dose kanaplex?

That's a tough call. IMO - 1.7 ppm of copper power won't cause a wrasse to stop feeding (I see that more above 2.5 ppm). I suspect trauma, or some internal infection. Copper won't help with those issues. Personally, I'd go to 2 ppm copper power, just so you don't get some protozoan issue on top of this one. Then, you can try an antibiotic, Kanaplex is one choice, I usually opt for Neoplex, but neither of these work really well if this is some internal infection.

 

[Reefer Dan]

That's a tough call. IMO - 1.7 ppm of copper power won't cause a wrasse to stop feeding (I see that more above 2.5 ppm). I suspect trauma, or some internal infection. Copper won't help with those issues. Personally, I'd go to 2 ppm copper power, just so you don't get some protozoan issue on top of this one. Then, you can try an antibiotic, Kanaplex is one choice, I usually opt for Neoplex, but neither of these work really well if this is some internal infection.

Well no improvements yet, fish keeps “resting” on the bottom, seems pretty lethargic and hasn’t eaten in a while now…but it does move around when it thinks nobody’s watching. Round 2 of kanaplex today. I really need to get neoplex to give that a try one of these times.

Considered adding metro to the mix, but from what I understand there is overlap between copper and that… and I don’t need something to reduce appetite more.

Considered UNWD, but it hasn’t been having the feeding response, and when it swims (short bursts, it seems to swim “regularly” to me).

 

[Reefer Dan]

That's a tough call. IMO - 1.7 ppm of copper power won't cause a wrasse to stop feeding (I see that more above 2.5 ppm). I suspect trauma, or some internal infection. Copper won't help with those issues. Personally, I'd go to 2 ppm copper power, just so you don't get some protozoan issue on top of this one. Then, you can try an antibiotic, Kanaplex is one choice, I usually opt for Neoplex, but neither of these work really well if this is some internal infection.

New video, it’s breathing pretty heavy and not real responsive. Do we think this could be a copper issue? #f#fishmedic

 

[jkcoral]

New video, it’s breathing pretty heavy and not real responsive. Do we think this could be a copper issue? #f#fishmedic

People’s opinions will differ, but this is why I personally avoid copper if possible for wrasses.

This looks like a wrasse getting hammered by copper to me.

 

[Reefer Dan]

People’s opinions will differ, but this is why I personally avoid copper if possible for wrasses.

This looks like a wrasse getting hammered by copper to me.

That’s what I’m wondering. If I plop in some 0 ppm copper water to test our theory, how long do we suspect it would take to perk up? (And confirm that was the issue)

 

[Jay Hemdal]

New video, it’s breathing pretty heavy and not real responsive. Do we think this could be a copper issue? #f#fishmedic

Copper power at 2 or below just won’t cause that. I presume you’re using a Hanna checker?

The fish doesn’t seem to have UNWD, but it does have some sort of systemic infection. The bump on its chin could be the tip of the iceberg for some larger internal infection.

Unfortunately, there isn’t any way to narrow that down. If you are still below 2 ppm copper, it could even be protozoal. I suspect though, that there is some internal infection.

 

[jkcoral]

That’s what I’m wondering. If I plop in some 0 ppm copper water to test our theory, how long do we suspect it would take to perk up? (And confirm that was the issue)

I’m honestly not sure. Although it might be worth a shot, because he probably won’t make it much longer based on how he’s looking now. Makes me really sad to see him struggling and I hope he can bounce back.

 

[Reefer Dan]

Copper power at 2 or below just won’t cause that. I presume you’re using a Hanna checker?

The fish doesn’t seem to have UNWD, but it does have some sort of systemic infection. The bump on its chin could be the tip of the iceberg for some larger internal infection.

Unfortunately, there isn’t any way to narrow that down. If you are still below 2 ppm copper, it could even be protozoal. I suspect though, that there is some internal infection.

I tested with the Hanna checker and it came back 2.25 ppm. If we suspect protozoal, the copper should be working? Should I add metro to the cocktail?

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I tested with the Hanna checker and it came back 2.25 ppm. If we suspect protozoal, the copper should be working? Should I add metro to the cocktail?

No - skip metro, it doesn’t work well on external protozoans and using with copper just increases the stress.
Copper takes around 3 days to work, but I’m still concerned this is an internal infection, which copper does not treat.

 

[Reefer Dan]

No - skip metro, it doesn’t work well on external protozoans and using with copper just increases the stress.
Copper takes around 3 days to work, but I’m still concerned this is an internal infection, which copper does not treat.

Ok, any suggestions? It isn’t eating, so I can’t get meds into it that way.