What causes cloudy salt mix?

[Renee180]

I'm 99% sure it is from settling before you mixed it (Not your fault, it happens). If the Calcium and all components dissolve before the magnesium components, then you will get a bunch of calcium carbonate precipitation. For seawater, it is crucial that there is sufficient magnesium present to prevent the formation of calcium carbonate.

If you have a poorly made salt mix (or the components settled), you can add a little magnesium chloride (dissolves fast) or magnesium sulfate (dissolves slower) to your DI water first, then dump your salt in and it should prevent that white precipitate.

This does sound correct and makes the most sense to me, however, I am not a chemist, I have no idea how to find these products you speak of, or where to get carb water without "flavors' already added, but I bet you can tell me how to make all 3 of these things you listed? Lol
If you would be so kind to teach me, I will :
1. Be forever grateful to you,
2. Be smarter
3. Be able to say I learned something today.
4. Be able to share this knowledge
:)

 

[Ryanbrs]

Black Bucket Red Sea has extremely high Alkalinity (11.5-12.5) and it is super common to see a sizable amount of precipitation. Someone else mentioned that they are particular about how to mix it and this is the main reason why. I know a lot of reefers switch back to blue bucket for that reason.

 

[spinycheek]

Magnesium sulfate is Epsom Salt, which you can typically find in any local pharmacy/grocery store in the first aid section. It's generally very inexpensive for a carton (~$10 or so last time I bought it). It's a slow dissolver, so it might take you 5 minutes of active mixing, nothing too serious. I usually just pouring it from cup to cup until it was dissolved then added that to the mixing bucket.

Magnesium Chloride you can get from bulk reef supply http://www.bulkreefsupply.com/brs-bulk-magnesium-chloride-aquarium-supplement.html
It is easier to dissolve and hence use, but not something you'd find at your local grocery store. Some ice melts use it, but they can contain other stuff so I wouldn't recommend that route.

Carbonated water is seltzer water, there should be some in your grocery store somewhere that isn't flavored. If you cannot find that, you can use dry ice, it's not as efficient because so much bubbles out, but it is significantly more fun!

 

[stevo01]

I love seeing new reef chemist's popping up on R2R! Thanks for helping out here.

 

[spinycheek]

I love seeing new reef chemist's popping up on R2R! Thanks for helping out here.

Happy to help wherever I can.

 

[Renee180]

Luv it! Thanks!

 

[StrangeDejavu]

I deal with this every time I make water using Reef Crystals. I use a 5 gallon food grade white bucket and a powerhead at the bottom mixing the water. I usually add it in at a reasonable pace, but even went the slow route once and spent almost 3 minutes adding the salt. Same deal, never mixes completely clear. I add it to the tank and the carbon clears it out after a few hours but i'd love to know why this is happening in the first place. I never had this issue with RSCP or regular IO, just RC.

 

[Renee180]

To recover what you have already mixed, you can add some carbonated water, which will dissolve the calcium carbonate dust, then naturally offgas over the next day or two.

So one more question, I have the seltzer water now, how much should I add to the 40 gallons I have mixed up? Again, thanks!

 

[spinycheek]

I'd add the whole 2 liter bottle and check in the morning. Hard to tell how much you'd need because there isn't a good way of knowing how much calcium carbonate you're dissolving or how much CO2 is in those bottles. At this point it's just eyeballing it.

 

[mcarroll]

I am using Coral Pro Salt, my first bucket. It has helped my tank tremendously. I am down to the last 40 gal water change with this bucket (155 gal bucket) and my water has turned cludy after adding the last of the salt. The water is RO, with .01 tds, 78 degrees, 1.025 salinity. I have been waiting for it to clear up. It has been a week and a half of aerating and letting a power head run, but it is still cloudy. There is a white powdery dust on all glass sides and equipment? What is this? What caused it? And is it safe to use?
Assuming, NO, as I don't want my dt tank to become cloudy too, or harm any inhabitants . What a bummer and a waste of time and money:( thanks in advance for any suggestions on what has happened here.

Using a giant volume of salt a little at a time with a multitude of opening and re-closing's of the bucket, you will have humidity, which will give you some precipitation. Keep your hands and tools DRY when your salt is open. CLOSE your salt as soon as you're done scooping it. If this becomes a problem with more than one bucket, I'd say you need to do your salt scooping in a less-hunid environment.

Or switch to buying smaller volumes of salt so you can use the whole package at once (or at least much more quickly). It's more expensive this way, but also a better way to go if you need it.

I don't understand the comment about the cloudiness on the glass....are you mixing in a glass tank other than the aquarium?

I use a beer wort stirring paddle. While the water is spinning good i add the saltonce its all added i stir it up in the reverse direction. Let is sit for about 15 minutes. Stir it up again and check salinity. If its all good i add it to the tank. Mixed with room temp RO/DI water.

The best mixing tool - better than a pump. :)

At least with instant ocean products you should be ready to go in about 5 minutes as long as you measure your salt pretty accurately – .5 cups per gallon of RODI.

(I tested this and mixing methods pretty thoroughly.)

This is pretty much how I do it too. Except , I heat it up to the tank temp and aerate for 24 hrs before adding to tank. And I also thought it was good for a long time , ha, but have to admit I never use it if it sits longer than a week. I have one specific 40 gal glass tank i have always used for only "new ro water " for wc

Heating and continued stirring – especially if you use a pump – will cause problems. Heat your RODI if you must but don't heat your saltwater.

Ideally mix with a paddle. It's at least as fast as a pump, probably faster since most folks won't do anything but flop the pump on the bottom of the bucket. Very lame mixing setup in testing. Only slightly better than air stones.

I use a 5 gallon food grade white bucket and a powerhead at the bottom mixing the water.

See comments above re: pumps on the bottom....and videos below for much better ways to mix that will give you better results.

Paddle mixing:


Pump mixing:


My old A Water Change A Day... thread has more... (quite a few folks joined in, so it might be an interesting read for some!)

you can add some carbonated water, which will dissolve the calcium carbonate

I think a pretty low pH is required to dissolve calcium carbonate.....something pretty close to a calcium reactor I think. ;) It's a neat idea, but hard to imagine this working. Curious to hear if someone tries it. :)

(If it was just one 5 gallon bucket of saltwater like at the very end of a bucket of salt, I'd stop worrying, use it, and move on to the next battle...no question.)

 

[stevo01]

@mcarroll I think you have the same video in both links. I didnt see the pump mixing. Those wort paddles are the bomb for hand mixing and thanks for agreeing :)

Ive heard of using seltzer water but I never have used it myself. A coworker of mine uses seltzer water.

 

[mcarroll]

Something happened to my old post by R2R so the video links were all goobered up. (someone needs to be more careful on the database!) Some post links didn't even point to the right posts anymore. :(:mad:

Here's where those links all came from...I think I fixed all the links now:
A Water Change A Day...

And here's the pump-mixing video:

 

[spinycheek]

It's the carbon dioxide reacting more so than the pH. It's a process used in drinking water treatment to dissolve colloidal calcium carbonate to clarify the water. I've used this method before to clear up cloudy water and it worked really well for me.

 

[spinycheek]

Heres a photo after adding new sand. Tank stayed cloudy for about a week. So I added a chunk of dry ice.

http://s393.photobucket.com/user/spinycheek/media/IMG_0060.jpg.html][/URL]

Cleared up within about an hour

 

[stevo01]

Nice DSB, what size is that tank?

 

[spinycheek]

Nice DSB, what size is that tank?

29 gallon.

 

[mcarroll]

Huh....pretty cool!

I think a pretty low pH is required to dissolve calcium carbonate...

It's the carbon dioxide reacting more so than the pH.

All true. :) alk + co2 = pH, so they're all directly linked. Was just surprising that enough co2 would be dissolved for the effect. ;) Like I said already, pretty cool!

 

[mcarroll]

I think most people have their salt buckets open in humid environments, so I'm betting there's a degree of this carbonate sediment for most people at the end of most buckets of salt, most of the time. So this is good to know! :)

However, while I might bother with this once per bucket...I don't keep seltzer or dry ice around normally and I've never had an issue from "dosing" the sediment along with the load of fresh saltwater in the water change. So at the same time I'm not sure I'd recommend anyone go out of their way to worry about this.