Worried about torch, considering cipro

[mpw213]

Hey everyone , my favorite coral, a banana torch, has been thriving for the past 9 months or so when I got it. Recently my corals have been doing well and I do think the torch is splitting but I’m worried something else is going on. It’s not extending nearly as much and there might be very slight flesh band recession but not sure and it’s still pretty robust.

Do you think it’s better to continue to observe or just treat the tank with cipro? I’ve read good things about it and have easy access to it luckily.

Last week mouth looked weird

How good it looked 2 weeks ago

Fleshband today

 

[EnterName]

It might be easier for the community to respond if you answer the following questions:

• Have you changed anything about the flow or lighting?
• Have you ever checked the PAR levels you are exposing the torch to?
• Have your parameters changed recently?
• What are your current nitrate, phosphate, salinity and alkalinity readings?
• Do you feed it frequently (like every other day) or rather "rare" (once a week, every other week, every month)?

I don't think treating the entire tank with Ciprofloxacin is a good idea based on the current "symptoms". If only one coral is showing some kind of issue (and we don't know if it's a bacterial issue), an antibiotic dip for that one specific coral might suffice as a preventative measure. If your corals are not strong enough to deal with the potential pathogens on their own, they might be weakened for some reason and we will need to find the underlying issue.

 

[mpw213]

It might be easier for the community to respond if you answer the following questions:

• Have you changed anything about the flow or lighting?
• Have you ever checked the PAR levels you are exposing the torch to?
• Have your parameters changed recently?
• What are your current nitrate, phosphate, salinity and alkalinity readings?
• Do you feed it frequently (like every other day) or rather "rare" (once a week, every other week, every month)?

I don't think treating the entire tank with Ciprofloxacin is a good idea based on the current "symptoms". If only one coral is showing some kind of issue (and we don't know if it's a bacterial issue), an antibiotic dip for that one specific coral might suffice as a preventative measure. If your corals are not strong enough to deal with the potential pathogens on their own, they might be weakened for some reason and we will need to find the underlying issue.

I should mention it’s a 2.5 gallon pico so parameters fluctuate for sure but I check daily to try to minimize that and the torch has never flinched from the fluctuations)

- under about 300 par, haven’t changed light or flow in a long time
- i check parameters daily. I did have a big Alk and phos spike about 3 weeks ago but pretty stable since then (salinity 1.025, ca 483, Alk 8.5, nitrate 10.3, phos 0.13, mg 1320 working on getting it up).
- I feed the tank frequently but the torch very rarely if at all

 

[EnterName]

I should mention it’s a 2.5 gallon pico so parameters fluctuate for sure but I check daily to try to minimize that and the torch has never flinched from the fluctuations)

- under about 300 par, haven’t changed light or flow in a long time
- i check parameters daily. I did have a big Alk and phos spike about 3 weeks ago but pretty stable since then (salinity 1.025, ca 483, Alk 8.5, nitrate 10.3, phos 0.13, mg 1320 working on getting it up).
- I feed the tank frequently but the torch very rarely if at all

Hm, okay...
Magnesium test kits are quite prone to error, so I don't know if adjusting magnesium is actually necessary. That would probably require an ICP test or you try to bring parameters back to normal by doing a lot of like 10% - 20% water changes over the next weeks. In a 2.5gal pico tank that would be very easy to do.

Feeding already stressed corals is always a bit difficult, but I would definitely target feed it very small portions frequently. Yes corals have zooxanthellae to meet a majority of their energy demand, but it doesn't meet 100% of their nutritional requirements. It's more like 65% to 80% even for some light-hungry SPS corals (Grottoli et al. 2006). This might already be the underlying issue.

 

[mpw213]

I should mention it’s a 2.5 gallon pico so parameters fluctuate for sure but I check daily to try to minimize that and the torch has never flinched from the fluctuations)

- under about 300 par, haven’t changed light or flow in a long time
- i check parameters daily. I did have a big Alk and phos spike about 3 weeks ago but pretty stable since then (salinity 1.025, ca 483, Alk 8.5, nitrate 10.3, phos 0.13, mg 1320 working on getting it up).
- I feed the tank frequently but the torch very rarely if at all

Hm, okay...
Magnesium test kits are quite prone to error, so I don't know if adjusting magnesium is actually necessary. That would probably require an ICP test or you try to bring parameters back to normal by doing a lot of like 10% - 20% water changes over the next weeks. In a 2.5gal pico tank that would be very easy to do.

Feeding already stressed corals is always a bit difficult, but I would definitely target feed it very small portions frequently. Yes corals have zooxanthellae to meet a majority of their energy demand, but it doesn't meet 100% of their nutritional requirements. It's more like 65% to 80% even for some light-hungry SPS corals (Grottoli et al. 2006). This might already be the underlying issue.

Thanks for the advice! It never really accepts food but I’d think it gets something when my power head turns back on. I can definitely try to target feed it. You’ve convinced me to not dose the whole tank, but do you think a kfc dip/bath might be worth it?

 

[EnterName]

I should mention it’s a 2.5 gallon pico so parameters fluctuate for sure but I check daily to try to minimize that and the torch has never flinched from the fluctuations)

- under about 300 par, haven’t changed light or flow in a long time
- i check parameters daily. I did have a big Alk and phos spike about 3 weeks ago but pretty stable since then (salinity 1.025, ca 483, Alk 8.5, nitrate 10.3, phos 0.13, mg 1320 working on getting it up).
- I feed the tank frequently but the torch very rarely if at all

Hm, okay...
Magnesium test kits are quite prone to error, so I don't know if adjusting magnesium is actually necessary. That would probably require an ICP test or you try to bring parameters back to normal by doing a lot of like 10% - 20% water changes over the next weeks. In a 2.5gal pico tank that would be very easy to do.

Feeding already stressed corals is always a bit difficult, but I would definitely target feed it very small portions frequently. Yes corals have zooxanthellae to meet a majority of their energy demand, but it doesn't meet 100% of their nutritional requirements. It's more like 65% to 80% even for some light-hungry SPS corals (Grottoli et al. 2006). This might already be the underlying issue.

Thanks for the advice! It never really accepts food but I’d think it gets something when my power head turns back on. I can definitely try to target feed it. You’ve convinced me to not dose the whole tank, but do you think a kfc dip/bath might be worth it?

If you actually see receiding tissue or the coral is producing mucus, then I would try an antibiotic dip. I don't think KCl is having an antibiotic effect though, I think iodine-based dips would be more effective in that case, but they seem quite stressful to corals so most commercially available dips avoid iodine.

I would definitely try it with some food. LPS food might be accepted better than powdered stuff, so maybe try something like Nyos LPS Power or similar If you turn of the flow you can easily place one of those tiny pellets on the coral. This way no unwanted detritus is added to your tank and you don't have to worry that feeding frequently would increase nutrient levels too much. Note that torches often retract/deflate after eating and will out stuff they weren't able to digest. If you start with once a week or every three days it's probably already going to help a little bit. You don't want to overfeed now as digestion takes a lot of energy the coral might not yet have.

Note that this bit is mostly based on anecdotal evidence and hobbyist literature so I can't give you the scientific optimal method to nurse your coral back to health

 

[mpw213]

I should mention it’s a 2.5 gallon pico so parameters fluctuate for sure but I check daily to try to minimize that and the torch has never flinched from the fluctuations)

- under about 300 par, haven’t changed light or flow in a long time
- i check parameters daily. I did have a big Alk and phos spike about 3 weeks ago but pretty stable since then (salinity 1.025, ca 483, Alk 8.5, nitrate 10.3, phos 0.13, mg 1320 working on getting it up).
- I feed the tank frequently but the torch very rarely if at all

Hm, okay...
Magnesium test kits are quite prone to error, so I don't know if adjusting magnesium is actually necessary. That would probably require an ICP test or you try to bring parameters back to normal by doing a lot of like 10% - 20% water changes over the next weeks. In a 2.5gal pico tank that would be very easy to do.

Feeding already stressed corals is always a bit difficult, but I would definitely target feed it very small portions frequently. Yes corals have zooxanthellae to meet a majority of their energy demand, but it doesn't meet 100% of their nutritional requirements. It's more like 65% to 80% even for some light-hungry SPS corals (Grottoli et al. 2006). This might already be the underlying issue.

Thanks for the advice! It never really accepts food but I’d think it gets something when my power head turns back on. I can definitely try to target feed it. You’ve convinced me to not dose the whole tank, but do you think a kfc dip/bath might be worth it?

If you actually see receiding tissue or the coral is producing mucus, then I would try an antibiotic dip. I don't think KCl is having an antibiotic effect though, I think iodine-based dips would be more effective in that case, but they seem quite stressful to corals so most commercially available dips avoid iodine.

I would definitely try it with some food. LPS food might be accepted better than powdered stuff, so maybe try something like Nyos LPS Power or similar If you turn of the flow you can easily place one of those tiny pellets on the coral. This way no unwanted detritus is added to your tank and you don't have to worry that feeding frequently would increase nutrient levels too much. Note that torches often retract/deflate after eating and will out stuff they weren't able to digest. If you start with once a week or every three days it's probably already going to help a little bit. You don't want to overfeed now as digestion takes a lot of energy the coral might not yet have.

I don’t see mucus but I do think there has been minor tissue recession. The bottom of the flesh band looks a bit like it peeled up but I’m not sure over what time period. I think the KFC dip has iodine, cipro, revive, and a few other things. And I do have LPS pellets so I’ll try that (I just worry about the phosphate spikes from stuff like reef roids but the few times I’ve tried pellets it was fine). I think I’ll try a dip, apparently it’s well tolerated, and also feeding. Really appreciate the advice!

 

[EnterName]

I should mention it’s a 2.5 gallon pico so parameters fluctuate for sure but I check daily to try to minimize that and the torch has never flinched from the fluctuations)

- under about 300 par, haven’t changed light or flow in a long time
- i check parameters daily. I did have a big Alk and phos spike about 3 weeks ago but pretty stable since then (salinity 1.025, ca 483, Alk 8.5, nitrate 10.3, phos 0.13, mg 1320 working on getting it up).
- I feed the tank frequently but the torch very rarely if at all

Hm, okay...
Magnesium test kits are quite prone to error, so I don't know if adjusting magnesium is actually necessary. That would probably require an ICP test or you try to bring parameters back to normal by doing a lot of like 10% - 20% water changes over the next weeks. In a 2.5gal pico tank that would be very easy to do.

Feeding already stressed corals is always a bit difficult, but I would definitely target feed it very small portions frequently. Yes corals have zooxanthellae to meet a majority of their energy demand, but it doesn't meet 100% of their nutritional requirements. It's more like 65% to 80% even for some light-hungry SPS corals (Grottoli et al. 2006). This might already be the underlying issue.

Thanks for the advice! It never really accepts food but I’d think it gets something when my power head turns back on. I can definitely try to target feed it. You’ve convinced me to not dose the whole tank, but do you think a kfc dip/bath might be worth it?

If you actually see receiding tissue or the coral is producing mucus, then I would try an antibiotic dip. I don't think KCl is having an antibiotic effect though, I think iodine-based dips would be more effective in that case, but they seem quite stressful to corals so most commercially available dips avoid iodine.

I would definitely try it with some food. LPS food might be accepted better than powdered stuff, so maybe try something like Nyos LPS Power or similar If you turn of the flow you can easily place one of those tiny pellets on the coral. This way no unwanted detritus is added to your tank and you don't have to worry that feeding frequently would increase nutrient levels too much. Note that torches often retract/deflate after eating and will out stuff they weren't able to digest. If you start with once a week or every three days it's probably already going to help a little bit. You don't want to overfeed now as digestion takes a lot of energy the coral might not yet have.

I don’t see mucus but I do think there has been minor tissue recession. The bottom of the flesh band looks a bit like it peeled up but I’m not sure over what time period. I think the KFC dip has iodine, cipro, revive, and a few other things. And I do have LPS pellets so I’ll try that (I just worry about the phosphate spikes from stuff like reef roids but the few times I’ve tried pellets it was fine). I think I’ll try a dip, apparently it’s well tolerated, and also feeding. Really appreciate the advice!

Oh sorry, I thought you meant KCl (potassium chloride). Yes the KFC dip recipe contains antibiotics, and other stuff. It should at least give some short-term relieve if it's actually a bacterial issue.

Usually I would expect tissue necrosis, polyp loss, full deflation, and maybe even "brown jelly" if you were dealing with any pathogens, but obviously it's possible that a potential infection hasn't progressed far enough yet to become this obvious. Try to place the frag exactly like it was before so it doesn't have to get used to different flow and light coming from a different angle.

 

[mpw213]

I should mention it’s a 2.5 gallon pico so parameters fluctuate for sure but I check daily to try to minimize that and the torch has never flinched from the fluctuations)

- under about 300 par, haven’t changed light or flow in a long time
- i check parameters daily. I did have a big Alk and phos spike about 3 weeks ago but pretty stable since then (salinity 1.025, ca 483, Alk 8.5, nitrate 10.3, phos 0.13, mg 1320 working on getting it up).
- I feed the tank frequently but the torch very rarely if at all

Hm, okay...
Magnesium test kits are quite prone to error, so I don't know if adjusting magnesium is actually necessary. That would probably require an ICP test or you try to bring parameters back to normal by doing a lot of like 10% - 20% water changes over the next weeks. In a 2.5gal pico tank that would be very easy to do.

Feeding already stressed corals is always a bit difficult, but I would definitely target feed it very small portions frequently. Yes corals have zooxanthellae to meet a majority of their energy demand, but it doesn't meet 100% of their nutritional requirements. It's more like 65% to 80% even for some light-hungry SPS corals (Grottoli et al. 2006). This might already be the underlying issue.

Thanks for the advice! It never really accepts food but I’d think it gets something when my power head turns back on. I can definitely try to target feed it. You’ve convinced me to not dose the whole tank, but do you think a kfc dip/bath might be worth it?

If you actually see receiding tissue or the coral is producing mucus, then I would try an antibiotic dip. I don't think KCl is having an antibiotic effect though, I think iodine-based dips would be more effective in that case, but they seem quite stressful to corals so most commercially available dips avoid iodine.

I would definitely try it with some food. LPS food might be accepted better than powdered stuff, so maybe try something like Nyos LPS Power or similar If you turn of the flow you can easily place one of those tiny pellets on the coral. This way no unwanted detritus is added to your tank and you don't have to worry that feeding frequently would increase nutrient levels too much. Note that torches often retract/deflate after eating and will out stuff they weren't able to digest. If you start with once a week or every three days it's probably already going to help a little bit. You don't want to overfeed now as digestion takes a lot of energy the coral might not yet have.

I don’t see mucus but I do think there has been minor tissue recession. The bottom of the flesh band looks a bit like it peeled up but I’m not sure over what time period. I think the KFC dip has iodine, cipro, revive, and a few other things. And I do have LPS pellets so I’ll try that (I just worry about the phosphate spikes from stuff like reef roids but the few times I’ve tried pellets it was fine). I think I’ll try a dip, apparently it’s well tolerated, and also feeding. Really appreciate the advice!

Oh sorry, I thought you meant KCl (potassium chloride). Yes the KFC dip recipe contains antibiotics, and other stuff. It should at least give some short-term relieve if it's actually a bacterial issue.

Usually I would expect tissue necrosis, polyp loss, full deflation, and maybe even "brown jelly" if you were dealing with any pathogens, but obviously it's possible that a potential infection hasn't progressed far enough yet to become this obvious. Try to place the frag exactly like it was before so it doesn't have to get used to different flow and light coming from a different angle.

No problem. When I got home I saw that a small part of tissue was dead so I just started the dip tonight. I think I got to it fast so hopefully it’ll recover