Yellow acro's turning slightly green! Fine tuning.

[Charterreefer]

I have come to the conclusion that some of my yellow acroporas are definitely some of the most difficult at keeping very yellow. I have an all sps tank.

My lighting is fine as far as spectrum as witnessed by the Wolverine, Pink Floyd and Pikachu showing their beautiful unique vibrant yellow colors when water conditions were met. A PAR meter is used periodically to verify level. All other water parameters have been constant throughout. I believe the change occured when I started to dose PO4, raising and maintaining the level to just detectable (PO4 0.01-0.02ppm).

I had previously maintained a nutrient poor system...NO3 maintained at 1.0ppm and no detectable level of PO4 although, I dosed Fuel at about 1/3 of what would be a daily dose as per instructions. These three corals were a nice yellow but the tank seemed starved overall as the other sps were not exhibiting their true colors and not much growth (in comparison to when I raised the PO4).

It's a perplexing situation when trying to keep all the corals in the tank happy. If I maintain these aforementioned levels the coral in the tank grow great and color up beautifully. I even had to turn up the calcium reactor considerably to supply for the higher Ca demand. The energy that the tank is operating at what seems like another order of magnitude! The only problem is that these three (mentioned) coral started to show a greenish color. I have to point out that throughout, I have had a Pink Lemonade stay as yellow as yellow can be, never affected by the change!
What I am observing is that there seems to be a fine line between keeping all corals happy and colorful while maintaining true yellow in the Wolverine, Pink Floyd and Pikachu (I'm sure other yellow corals fall into this group too). I also wish the Hanna PO4 meter read in thousands instead of hundreds although, I don't think I could afford such a device.

I have noticed previously that when I just used "Fuel" (amino acid) at 1/3 of a daily dose with no dosing of PO4, (NO3 1.0ppm) the coral stayed yellow. For the next several months I will be going back to using Fuel and no PO4 to see if my hunch is correct. I will keep the NO3 at 1.0ppm as to only change one variable. I do believe that Fuel will supply the PO4 needs to the coral that I will eliminate from discontinuing the dosing the PO4 directly.
If the rest of the sps seems to show signs of color loss I will go from there.

Any thoughts or ideas are greatly appreciated.

 

[jda]

Yellow is a light thing. Daylight spectrum will really help. So will lots of intensity. I only have the SB Yellow Tort, Wolverine, Pikachu and OG Tyree Pink Lemonade, but they are more yellow at 400+ PAR and under whiter spectrum. In the frag tank under 10K, they are even more yellow.

If you are a T5 guy, then see if you can work a GE 6500K in there. If LED, then whiten them up a bit.

The brightest and intense yellow color comes with lower (near NSW) parameters, so you are good there on N and P. More would make them darker and yield more towards green - richer, if you will, and not brighter.

There is no tank that can color all corals great. I keep my tank with just a trace of N and P because I like the growth and also like the bright colors with greater contrast, but my red plant, for example, is not as rich and dark of a red as others. There are tradeoffs, but very high light and NWSish parameters is where I like it.

Do you have the Hannah Ultra Low? It gets pretty low.

 

[BoomCorals]

Yellow is a light thing. Daylight spectrum will really help. So will lots of intensity. I only have the SB Yellow Tort, Wolverine, Pikachu and OG Tyree Pink Lemonade, but they are more yellow at 400+ PAR and under whiter spectrum. In the frag tank under 10K, they are even more yellow.

If you are a T5 guy, then see if you can work a GE 6500K in there. If LED, then whiten them up a bit.

The brightest and intense yellow color comes with lower (near NSW) parameters, so you are good there on N and P. More would make them darker and yield more towards green - richer, if you will, and not brighter.

There is no tank that can color all corals great. I keep my tank with just a trace of N and P because I like the growth and also like the bright colors with greater contrast, but my red plant, for example, is not as rich and dark of a red as others. There are tradeoffs, but very high light and NWSish parameters is where I like it.

Do you have the Hannah Ultra Low? It gets pretty low.

Great advice. I myself have been thinking of trying a 6500k bulb. I can tell if my nutrient levels creep up - my pikachu will start to look a bit green.

 

[Charterreefer]

The pikachu, wolverine and like corals are the "canary in a coal mine" of reef tanks.

 

[FarmerTy]

I love this discussion! My pink lemonade never wavers but my Pikachu and pink Floyd (granted both are still frags) were yellow when I received them. I kept them at 250 par to acclimate and they stated turning lime green. My nutrients took a spike and they went full green. I got my nutrients back down and went lime green again. I moved them up to 350-400 par and they seem to be regaining some yellow. Consider my experiences above all anecdotal since we are talking about 1" frags here. [emoji23]

 

[Graffiti Spot]

Are these frags or mini colonies we are talking about? Meaning 3" or less and fully encrusted.
I agree with jda, it's mostly about light, stability and low nutrients. But with more nutrients in the water it can be done with lots of light. Frags can look great and not the next when there are fluctuations. If a yellow coral is growing it should be yellow. AA cora that was yellow and is now green and growing is probably a green coral. But certain tricks and certain tank conditions can help bring out more of a yellow tint to a green coral.
I try to not worry about colors on frags or mini colonies. I only worry when colonies of corals I have had for a long time shift. Some frags can shift for no good reason and will leave you chasing something that's not there. Focusing on the growth of fragments is my goal. A lot of corals look great when cut and encrusted, then when forming into a mini colony colors don't become as noticable, even though things are fine.
That's just my current thoughts about yellow acros.

 

[jda]

Your experience is pretty legit, IMO. Bright colors do not like higher nutrients, IME - I know that higher nutrients are all of the rage for some folks, but this leads to saturated colors, which are spectacular in some acros but are not great on others (hard to make them all happy, right?). Bright yellows, bright pinks and electric blues/purples are a staple of the Euro ZEO tanks and they have lower nutrients, lots of daylight spectrum to go with their blues and also massive output with usually 8, 10 or even 12 T5 bulbs over normal sized tanks.

BTW, standard disclaimer - I do NOT advocate ZEO-level ULNS unless you REALLY know what you are doing, but N under 1 and P around .01 will do this just fine and has a good balance of contrast, brightness and saturation that makes *most* corals happy... this is closer to NSWish. You can get to these levels with fuges, turf scrubbers and other things and not have to use GFO, LC, organic carbon, etc... but you can if you are good at it.

 

[madweazl]

Not sure how these will show up on your display but they're both a vibrant yellow in person. They're under Kessil A360WEs running 60% color (14k looks from what I remember) along with a pair of 54w Blue+. The Kessils are on for 12 hours and ramp from off to a set max intensity of 75% over the course of six hours and back down (the T5s are on for eight hours without dimming). Max par in the locations of both these corals is approx 275 but that is only for a brief period (three minutes a day) at the top of the ramp so average PAR for the photo-period is far lower.

This one lost a bit of yellow and gained more white/clear areas when I increased color (increases the amount of white diodes being used in the Kessil array). 60% seems to bring in back but 75% diminished some of the yellow.

This one stays extremely vibrant regardless of what I give it in regard to light.

In regard to parameters, my alkalinity is typically ~7.7 dKh with barely detectable nitrates and phosphates are typically around .05 on the Hanna ULR (or 0-.01 on Triton's results).

 

[bubbaque]

If it's a new coral green is a transitioning color. I received a browned out red planet frag and it would then turn green in an area and then turn red. It went all the way down the frag as it morphed color. Also just got a browned out vivids rainbow delight for the growout contest. I see it turning green in a small area so I know it's going to gain some color soon.

 

[madweazl]

If it's a new coral green is a transitioning color. I received a browned out red planet frag and it would then turn green in an area and then turn red. It went all the way down the frag as it morphed color. Also just got a browned out vivids rainbow delight for the growout contest. I see it turning green in a small area so I know it's going to gain some color soon.

I dont know that I'd associate green coloration as some sort of normal transition while coloring up; not something I've observed in my own tank anyways.

This one has had a rough six months with various moves but colored up well despite the setbacks.

Edit: I was going through some pictures and stumbled across this frag. It was under 106 PAR (peak of the day) and had a green growing edge. When I got rid of the LPS and bumped the lighting up, the green disappeared with it. That correlates to what jda had mentioned above but at pretty low PAR in my case.

106 PAR

Same coral with 297 PAR (wish it still had some green, it was beautiful)

 

[bubbaque]

I dont know that I'd associate green coloration as some sort of normal transition while coloring up; not something I've observed in my own tank anyways.

This one has had a rough six months with various moves but colored up well despite the setbacks.

Edit: I was going through some pictures and stumbled across this frag. It was under 106 PAR (peak of the day) and had a green growing edge. When I got rid of the LPS and bumped the lighting up, the green disappeared with it. That correlates to what jda had mentioned above but at pretty low PAR in my case.

106 PAR

Same coral with 297 PAR (wish it still had some green, it was beautiful)

It's hard to tell with the pics you uploaded. The first pic seems the end color ended up being green. The second had green but then went to its proper color. I'm always excited to see a coral that's brown turn green. It's always an indication that it's headed in the right direction.

A couple years ago I bought a pc rainbow from Adam at battlecorals and after a week it started to turn green. I reached out to him and he said not to worry that green can be a transition color and just give it time and it will color back up. It took about a month but it lost the green and colored back up.

 

[madweazl]

It's hard to tell with the pics you uploaded. The first pic seems the end color ended up being green. The second had green but then went to its proper color. I'm always excited to see a coral that's brown turn green. It's always an indication that it's headed in the right direction.

A couple years ago I bought a pc rainbow from Adam at battlecorals and after a week it started to turn green. I reached out to him and he said not to worry that green can be a transition color and just give it time and it will color back up. It took about a month but it lost the green and colored back up.

If it's coming out green it's due to our monitors displaying differently.

 

[Charterreefer]

All yellow coral mentioned is about 1 1/2 years old. Lighting is at ~450 PAR as measured by Apogee SQ 510. Lighting/ photoperiod has been the same when coral were a deep yellow as well as currently with this greenish hue going on... only nutrient values have changed.

 

[markalot]

Are the lights aging (T5 or Halide)? I only have a lemonade and it's bright yellow and red regardless of what I do so I can't really help.

 

[Charterreefer]

Are the lights aging (T5 or Halide)? I only have a lemonade and it's bright yellow and red regardless of what I do so I can't really help.

I believe that if the lights were aging this would be indicated by PAR #'s that would get lower. My PAR meter is measuring photosynthetically active radiation...supposedly the kind sps coral like.

 

[Charterreefer]

When I presented my delima (my initial posting) I left out what kind of lighting I have, only to say it was the same and hadn't changed. I wanted to focus on the nutrient issue. The light was the same when the coral was a deep yellow as well as when they turned green.
As far as lighting..I believe that the type of light (light's) you choose to put over your tank does two things. #1. It causes your eye to perceive your coral to be a certain color - as the pigments in that particular coral reflect specific parts of the spectrum they are being illuminated it with, this is what our eyes see. #2. I also believe that illuminating coral with a specific spectrum can cause a actual color shift in specific corals over time. There seems to always be two things going on.

I also believe that certain coral just don't do well under certain light. I have a walt disney and an orange passion that are awesome looking although, I have a pinky and the bear and a few others that are drab as heck. I am trying to sort out the coral that like my conditions and thrive and not get too crazy with the ones that won't. I don't want to change my lights, just get coral that like what I have. Excuse me for getting a little side tracked.

Hopefully with the Triton tests everyone seems to be doing we will collectively be able to dial in the nutrient and trace element requirements of specific coral over time, adding up to more healthy and colorful coral!

 

[markalot]

I believe that if the lights were aging this would be indicated by PAR #'s that would get lower. My PAR meter is measuring photosynthetically active radiation...supposedly the kind sps coral like.

For acropora it seems to be mostly about the spectrum as long as there is enough PAR. You're probably right as spectrum shifts usually show up as lower PAR, I'm just not sure.

I would be careful chasing perfect conditions for one coral though, you're liable to decrease the health of the other acros if you aren't very careful. IMO the biggest issue is the amount of food in the water. NSW may have super low nutrients but there is a ton of food bits in the water column for the acros to feed on. IMO this is how and why Zeovit and other dosing regimes can maintain such beautiful tanks. Strip the water of all nutrients but make sure the water column has something to feed on. You end up dancing on a knifes edge and any mistakes tend to be rather dramatic. Some acros do well in low food higher nutrient water, some do not. I tend to give away those that don't, makes life easier.

 

[jda]

I don't mind that you left the lights out as long as...

1). You can get enough daylight from your source - some are good at this and some are not. This will help with yellows and brightness/contrast. This also helps with species that thrive under more light and like massive amounts of PAR.
2). You factor the source into the PAR readings. The sources that have massive amounts of IR and UV will contribute even more output to the corals than sources that have no/low amounts of these. This spectrum can feed proteins that excite down to 350 and over 700 and do not show up at all on a PAR meter. Example... 400 PAR from a 10K MH might be more like 500+ when you add in these spectrums... or UVL Super Actinic T5s measure half as much PAR as a BluePlus, but under a spectrometer which captures the output fully below 440nm (instead of partial), the UVL have slightly more output than a B+. Just factor it in when you compare your results outside of the tank. Of course, your results from the past-to-now are fine without any factor.

Lights do matter when you want to fine tune and have the brightest/best acropora colors in the top 5-10%, but there is no reason that you should not be able to get what you got before (after a few months of settling in - maybe 4-6 tops). You are right to pick corals that work with what you like... I do it as well... I will not buy any acros that need the blacklight or heavy blues to look good since I run pretty true 14K all of the time. Unfortunately, most people do not pay attention and cannot see the details enough to take this approach, or people think that all lights can do the same things. You are way ahead of the pack.

 

[Charterreefer]

It would be nice to compile a list of what corals like what type of light!

 

[jda]

It would be nice to compile a list of what corals like what type of light!

Almost every coral is going to get the best actual color under 6500K - especially acropora. Illuminating them is another story and totally personal... I don't know of anybody who likes to illuminate under 6500K, so it is a balancing act between gaining actual color and illumination.