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[vittpsu21]

Hey All, for years I have been wanting and planning to get into saltwater, however, younger kids and life in general had always somehow gotten in the way. All of this is to say that finally with my kids being older, I have managed to order my first tank.

I have ordered IMs 200gallon and it will ship sometime at the end of June, so after years of research and want I’ll finally get to pursue the hobby. For some background I am a DevOps Engineer, for those that know what that is you probably know that I’m a huge fan of automation. My plan will be to try to make my first go around as easy on myself as possible with this being my list of things I know I’ll be wanting or doing:

1) Behind the tank wall, I will be running water lines to my laundry room for easy water changes

2) some kind of monitoring system will be purchased

3) some kind of dosing system will also be purchased

4) live sand

5) copapods early

6) Refugium with dedicated lighting

I am looking for input from people with experience on things they would suggest to set myself up for success. I ultimately know anything can and will happen but I’m most interested in giving myself the best shot at success. My initial plan was Live rock but I have also read some stuff lately that keeps making me go back and forth!

Thanks in advance to anyone for their input!

 

[ReefSymbiotic]

Awesome. Glad to see you join us. Man where do I start lol planning is really key on everything. Automation is great I highly recommend hydros equipment. Test test and test some more. The more strains of bacteria the better. Not just a simple nitrifying bacteria. Make sure your lots of top space to grow corals. Id look heavily into that. You have 200 gallons which seems like a lot until two years in your tanks is full and you wish you had more room for new corals you find. Prevention is better the. Treatment. I think prime reed flakes is the best food the business. Won’t give you high nitrates or
Phosphate but will give your fish all they need.

 

[DrkNMighty]

What type of tank are you planning (SPS dominant, LPS/Softie dominant, Mixed Reef, FOWLR)? If anything but a FOWLR you should start researching what type of lights you want/need. Any specific fish that you want? This would play into the type of tank you are planning as well as future stocking list.

You will also want a good RODI system and mixing station setup to make having water for your water changes easier.

 

[vittpsu21]

What type of tank are you planning (SPS dominant, LPS/Softie dominant, Mixed Reef, FOWLR)? If anything but a FOWLR you should start researching what type of lights you want/need. Any specific fish that you want? This would play into the type of tank you are planning as well as future stocking list.

You will also want a good RODI system and mixing station setup to make having water for your water changes easier.

I know I want Corals, as for fish I am certain on the normal early stuff tang, clowns, etc for cleanup etc.

I started to look at lights a while back and I am kind of torn between a hybrid solution or just straight new age LEDs. The blades look appealing to me for their ease of setup, however a t5 with 2 or 3 kessel LEDs also sounds pretty appealing. This is honestly something I continue to research but haven’t made headway on yet

 

[bubbgee]

You don't necessarily need a T5 setup unless you get serious with SPS. For the most part, any light bar like blades would be sufficient for most corals such as Orphek OR4 and Quanta bars.

 

[DrkNMighty]

I know I want Corals, as for fish I am certain on the normal early stuff tang, clowns, etc for cleanup etc.

I started to look at lights a while back and I am kind of torn between a hybrid solution or just straight new age LEDs. The blades look appealing to me for their ease of setup, however a t5 with 2 or 3 kessel LEDs also sounds pretty appealing. This is honestly something I continue to research but haven’t made headway on yet

For lights my preference is LEDs. Depending on what type of corals you plan on having would determine exactly what and how many you need. I like Orpheks.

For controllers, I prefer Hydros over Apex. There are pros and cons to both systems.

For fish, I would start a list with a few options of the different types of fish you want. For example, you mentioned tangs, so I would list what kind. Some might not get along and others might get too big. I would do the same thing for each type of fish you want. It helps plan overall fish compatibility and will also determine the amount of rock and type of aquascaping you will need.

 

[backbayreef]

Having had many tanks before and the most important advice I can give any new reefers: start with ALL live rocks! You can order from TBS or get them from your LFS. You’ll have instant cycle and not worry about the ugly stages and dealing with crazy cycling issues.

Automation: I have both the Apex and Hydros. I love the reliability of Hydros but love the usability and UI of the Apex more. Unless you want to do ReefPi (not for your first tank though) I would just do a coin toss between Apex and Hydros.

Dosing: you can do 2-part or AFR but at 200gal, sooner or later you will want a calcium reactor. I currently run 3 of them, one for each tank!

Lighting: I run both Radions G4/G6 and Orphek OR3/OR4 — I actually like the Radions better for corals. For fish, the Orpheks are cool. There are many other options out there, but that’s what I’ve been using and super happy with them.

Heaters: go for dual heaters, each with their own external thermostat for redundancy. I personally like BRS titanium heaters with WiFi Inkbirds.

Skimmer: get the biggest one you can fit inside the sump! ;)

Return pumps: you’ll definitely go with dual reruns for redundancy.

Wavemakers: many options out there but I like MP60s - no wires inside the tank!

Good luck and enjoy the ride!

 

[vittpsu21]

Having had many tanks before and the most important advice I can give any new reefers: start with ALL live rocks! You can order from TBS or get them from your LFS. You’ll have instant cycle and not worry about the ugly stages and dealing with crazy cycling issues.

Automation: I have both the Apex and Hydros. I love the reliability of Hydros but love the usability and UI of the Apex more. Unless you want to do ReefPi (not for your first tank though) I would just do a coin toss between Apex and Hydros.

Dosing: you can do 2-part or AFR but at 200gal, sooner or later you will want a calcium reactor. I currently run 3 of them, one for each tank!

Lighting: I run both Radions G4/G6 and Orphek OR3/OR4 — I actually like the Radions better for corals. For fish, the Orpheks are cool. There are many other options out there, but that’s what I’ve been using and super happy with them.

Heaters: go for dual heaters, each with their own external thermostat for redundancy. I personally like BRS titanium heaters with WiFi Inkbirds.

Skimmer: get the biggest one you can fit inside the sump! ;)

Return pumps: you’ll definitely go with dual reruns for redundancy.

Wavemakers: many options out there but I like MP60s - no wires inside the tank!

Good luck and enjoy the ride!

Thanks for this, quick follow up...

If the tank Dimensions are:

• 70.9" x 30" x 21.7"

How do you know how much coverage you should be looking at lighting wise. I also have used MP40's in the past so was leaning towards that style for no cords already!

 

[bubbgee]

Two mp40 sounds reasonable.
For lighting, BRS has a rule of thumb on how many. Lights usually have a coverage map with what kind of corals under a certain square inches.



I am guesstimating around 3 to 5 lights depending on the kind of corals you are going to put in your tank. However, you can go with a lower number of lights, provided you buy a supplemental light bar in its place (XHO,OR4, Quanta).

 

[vittpsu21]

After reading reviews on the Neptune stuff I am very much leaning towards Hydros Control X4, but seems like it might be hard to find?

 

[vittpsu21]

Two mp40 sounds reasonable.
For lighting, BRS has a rule of thumb on how many. Lights usually have a coverage map with what kind of corals under a certain square inches.



I am guesstimating around 3 to 5 lights depending on the kind of corals you are going to put in your tank. However, you can go with a lower number of lights, provided you buy a supplemental light bar in its place (XHO,OR4, Quanta).

oh thank you for this

 

[bubbgee]

After reading reviews on the Neptune stuff I am very much leaning towards Hydros Control X4, but seems like it might be hard to find?

That should be available. Even the launch version.

I am on Neptune. It works for the most part too. It just fits my needs as much as the Hydros might fit your needs.

 

[cilyjr]

For automation the big ones are Neptune systems, Hydros, Ghl.
In the diy forums there many who are using raspberry pi (reef pi) to fit their solutions. I believe reef angel uses raspberry pi.

I really can't speak to the effectiveness of the hydros or the GHL, as I have been in the Neptune environment since the aqua controller III.
I do not believe any of them will be a perfect solution.
I have been using Neptune systems for a very long time. I will say in my personal opinion build quality has become less robust while customer support has gotten significantly better.
In the old days before Bertram bought them out, if you tried to reach out to customer support you are treated like a moron for not knowing the answer.
But then at some point. Russ M, wrote The unofficial Apex manual which then got adopted to the official Apex manual and things slowly and surely got better.
If I were to be starting from scratch, I might consider the hydros but since I have been in the Neptune environment since the '90s, it would not make any sense for me to change at this point.
That said, I find the automation more than adequate for my needs. My wife and I go away for week long vacation and weekend trips often, and I always am able to tell the house sitter don't touch the tank it's going to run it's self.
My tank is a full-blown SPS system with colonies measuring in feet. I mentioned this only to say it is possible.

As far as lighting, most new people don't care for my advice as I lean towards expensive.
There are absolutely great ways to save money in this hobby initially, one is to buy used and id always recommend that.
Lighting is one area where I suggest spending a larger portion of you budget on the onset however. A big reason for that is the simple fact that it is more difficult to upgrade and change lighting, especially on a large tank after the tank is already installed. Think towards future goals. I'm also not suggesting buying the most expensive lights on the market. Do however buy enough lights. The charts that come with LED lights I find to be a bit generous to actual performance. And remember PAR is measuring all photo available light (between 400 and 700 ish light). the organisms in your tank may not be using that. Think taking a multivitamin.

I will never run an LED light without supplementation. In my case, I use four t5 strips in addition to the six Refi Uno's over my tank. It's about spread. Led is a tiny point source light (barely more than a laser) lenses help but without the linear spread of the t5 I see a lot of sticks with dead undersides.

 

[vittpsu21]

For automation the big ones are Neptune systems, Hydros, Ghl.
In the diy forums there many who are using raspberry pi (reef pi) to fit their solutions. I believe reef angel uses raspberry pi.

I really can't speak to the effectiveness of the hydros or the GHL, as I have been in the Neptune environment since the aqua controller III.
I do not believe any of them will be a perfect solution.
I have been using Neptune systems for a very long time. I will say in my personal opinion build quality has become less robust while customer support has gotten significantly better.
In the old days before Bertram bought them out, if you tried to reach out to customer support you are treated like a moron for not knowing the answer.
But then at some point. Russ M, wrote The unofficial Apex manual which then got adopted to the official Apex manual and things slowly and surely got better.
If I were to be starting from scratch, I might consider the hydros but since I have been in the Neptune environment since the '90s, it would not make any sense for me to change at this point.
That said, I find the automation more than adequate for my needs. My wife and I go away for week long vacation and weekend trips often, and I always am able to tell the house sitter don't touch the tank it's going to run it's self.
My tank is a full-blown SPS system with colonies measuring in feet. I mentioned this only to say it is possible.

As far as lighting, most new people don't care for my advice as I lean towards expensive.
There are absolutely great ways to save money in this hobby initially, one is to buy used and id always recommend that.
Lighting is one area where I suggest spending a larger portion of you budget on the onset however. A big reason for that is the simple fact that it is more difficult to upgrade and change lighting, especially on a large tank after the tank is already installed. Think towards future goals. I'm also not suggesting buying the most expensive lights on the market. Do however buy enough lights. The charts that come with LED lights I find to be a bit generous to actual performance. And remember PAR is measuring all photo available light (between 400 and 700 ish light). the organisms in your tank may not be using that. Think taking a multivitamin.

I will never run an LED light without supplementation. In my case, I use four t5 strips in addition to the six Refi Uno's over my tank. It's about spread. Led is a tiny point source light (barely more than a laser) lenses help but without the linear spread of the t5 I see a lot of sticks with dead undersides.

The Automation part makes sense to me from your perspective and honestly it sounds like they are similar unless you are baked into one for a longtime!

For your lighting suggestion, this is where I was about a year ago also, you would favor something like a t5 fixture with 2-3 kessels/whatever leds to supplement over going 5-6 leds

 

[backbayreef]

Going to be yet another religious war between Apex vs Hydros. You can’t go wrong with either one actually.

Lighting: if you with with the Ecotech ecosystem (all controllable within Mobius) those XR30s have pretty wide spread now. For your tank, I think that (3) XR30s should be good. You can always add more later. Again, many options out there and you’ll get many opinions on what is “best”. To me, just set it and forget it - I’m not trying to eek every PAR out of lightings. It comes down to reliability and usability for me.

 

[rtparty]

I’m going to go against the grain and say do not buy into any of the controller systems right now.

Take that money and buy yourself 2 Aqua Logic heater controllers. Heaters are the number one cause of a tank crash. Usually stuck in the ON position. The Aqua Logic controllers are rebranded RANCO controllers with titanium probes for our use. They are rock solid and bulletproof systems. I can’t recall a single Aqua Logic/RANCO failure in my 20+ years.

I’ve had great luck with the SICCE heaters and the BRS titanium heaters. The SICCE has a built in thermostat so you let the SICCE run itself and the Aqua Logic controller backs it up. You will want 2 heaters. 200 or 300 watt will work depending on your house temperature.

For lighting, I would look seriously into the Nicrew Gen 2 lights. For under $1k you can light that tank to keep anything you want. With their hard wired controller, no stupid apps to mess around with. If you REALLY want app control, the AI Blades are great lights. You can check my build threads to see them in action.

For powerheads, Tunze. End of story. Rock solid and reliable. If going Vortech, buy lots of extra wet sides as they fail routinely these days.

Return pump? Sicce if you have the money. Jebao if you want to cut costs. They’ve proven to plenty reliable and most return pumps are all made by the same factory anyway. They just slap different colors and boxes on them.

TBS live sand is a fantastic choice. If you want to save some money, mix it with Special Grade reef sand.

Rock? I prefer dry that I cure ahead of time. I am not messing with all the crap that comes on gulf live rock. Did that years ago with live rock and don’t miss finding pests galore munching on my cleanup crew or killing fish. I can get 80-90% of the benefits with just the sand.

 

[cilyjr]

For your lighting suggestion, this is where I was about a year ago also, you would favor something like a t5 fixture with 2-3 kessels/whatever leds to supplement over going 5-6 leds

Personally I would go with The full compliment of whatever LED. Then I would add the t5 then I would just dial everything back a bit.
I won't tell you what brand you should use. I think you can have success with pretty much anything provided you get the proper amount. That said, I feel like you need more aqua illumination lights than you. Would some of the other more powerful ones. I'm not saying they're bad lights. I have four of them over my frag system. I simply think they do not have the punch that some of the other ones do.
As far as more budgeted options, I've heard good things about reef breeders (full disclosure, I know Logan personally though I have not used the lights) I have also heard pretty good things about some of the newer ones on Amazon. Think Nycrew and Smatfarm.

 

[vittpsu21]

Going to be yet another religious war between Apex vs Hydros. You can’t go wrong with either one actually.

Lighting: if you with with the Ecotech ecosystem (all controllable within Mobius) those XR30s have pretty wide spread now. For your tank, I think that (3) XR30s should be good. You can always add more later. Again, many options out there and you’ll get many opinions on what is “best”. To me, just set it and forget it - I’m not trying to eek every PAR out of lightings. It comes down to reliability and usability for me.

Are you referring to the Pro's or the regular ones?

 

[vittpsu21]

I’m going to go against the grain and say do not buy into any of the controller systems right now.

Take that money and buy yourself 2 Aqua Logic heater controllers. Heaters are the number one cause of a tank crash. Usually stuck in the ON position. The Aqua Logic controllers are rebranded RANCO controllers with titanium probes for our use. They are rock solid and bulletproof systems. I can’t recall a single Aqua Logic/RANCO failure in my 20+ years.

I’ve had great luck with the SICCE heaters and the BRS titanium heaters. The SICCE has a built in thermostat so you let the SICCE run itself and the Aqua Logic controller backs it up. You will want 2 heaters. 200 or 300 watt will work depending on your house temperature.

For lighting, I would look seriously into the Nicrew Gen 2 lights. For under $1k you can light that tank to keep anything you want. With their hard wired controller, no stupid apps to mess around with. If you REALLY want app control, the AI Blades are great lights. You can check my build threads to see them in action.

For powerheads, Tunze. End of story. Rock solid and reliable. If going Vortech, buy lots of extra wet sides as they fail routinely these days.

Return pump? Sicce if you have the money. Jebao if you want to cut costs. They’ve proven to plenty reliable and most return pumps are all made by the same factory anyway. They just slap different colors and boxes on them.

TBS live sand is a fantastic choice. If you want to save some money, mix it with Special Grade reef sand.

Rock? I prefer dry that I cure ahead of time. I am not messing with all the crap that comes on gulf live rock. Did that years ago with live rock and don’t miss finding pests galore munching on my cleanup crew or killing fish. I can get 80-90% of the benefits with just the sand.

Thanks,

I assume you are referring to these, to hook up to the heaters to see the failures before they actually happen?

https://aqualogicinc.com/product/digital-temperature-controllers/
I see you mentioned 2 heaters I assume you are using 1 of them as a backup to the other? or do you think that it will require 2 heaters to heat my size of tank?

I did look at these AI Blades a lot about a year ago, the sleak style and nice setup is a definite plus in my eyes

 

[DrkNMighty]

Lighting: if you with with the Ecotech ecosystem (all controllable within Mobius) those XR30s have pretty wide spread now.

I think there is one callout on using Ecotech for lights. There is a known bug within Mobius that will randomly reset the clock within the application. This results in everything that is being connected through the app to run based on that time. This means your lights might randomly kick on at 2 AM or any other time really. It’s not as big an issue if you are only running pumps but I see it as a larger issue if using the lights.