About to just give up

[velandracorey]

Hello there,

I'm hoping to get some help to turn around my tank, which at this point, I'm about ready to give up on.
The tank was setup February of 2018, so we're coming up on almost 2 years now, and I have not been able to keep practically any corals in the tank to save my life. The ones that I have been able to "keep", have practically no growth to them at all. I didn't even have any noticeable coraline growth until a couple of months ago.

The only type of coral I can keep alive are soft coral currently, and even then, I can't keep some of these without having issues. Twice I've tried to keep ricordea, at the LFS each one I've purchased was super big and very colorful, and both times once added to my tank, they veryyyyyy slowly shrunk to the size of maybe a pencil eraser, lost its color (turning white) then eventually detached from the rock never to be seen again. As far as I know, typically the bleaching would be from too much light, but each time I've tried them, they were under an overhang, at the corner of the tank, so they were not under direct light. On the other hand, a Rhodactis that I have has been doing fairly well.

The only other corals I currently have in the tank are two different zoanthids and a toadstool. The zoanthids go through phases of being open and looking good, then they will be closed for several days at a time. One of them has grown decently, probably adding 5-6 new polyps in the past 6 months since I've had it, while the other has had two polyps since I added it to the tank around the same time. The toadstool was one of the first corals that I had added, and I would say that it's no bigger than when it was added originally.

All of the LPS I've tried so far haven't fared any better. With probably half of them dying within a week of adding them, to lasting several months and then slowly declining. The Acans and Blastos I have tried always looked good at first, even adding additional polyps over the course of a couple months, then they slowly start to recede from the skeletons and then the remaining polyps bail-out. The euphilia I have tried haven't lasted longer than 2 weeks, lose color (becoming translucent) and then start to recede from the skeleton and bail-out any surviving polyps.
I always start them on the sand once they're added, then slowly move them over to the rock, but most don't even make it off the sand due to the tissue loss.

I've had a few bouts with different types of algae as well (dinos, hair, turf algae) which I've mostly been able to keep in check, but I haven't been able to get rid of much of it completely. As far as from what I've seen a lot of these can be cause by low nutrients but I haven't really been able to raise them too much either. So I'm just at a standstill with everything and have no idea what is causing so many issues... I had attempted to set up a fuge to help with the algae issues, but the chaeto met the same fate as the corals (turned white, kinda broke apart and melted) and I haven't tried to set one up afterwards

I do about 20% waterchange once a week -- up until recently, I was obtaining my saltwater and RO pre-made from an LFS, but thought maybe I was having issues so I purchased a 6 stage BRS RO/DI unit. Which reads at 0 TDS coming from the unit and I have been using the RedSea blue bucket to mix to 1.026 since.

Testing as of right now are below -- I have a triton test that I haven't filled/sent quite yet but plan on doing so in the next day or two.

Salinity - 1.026
ALK - 9 (Hanna checker)
CA - 400
PO4 - .10 (Hanna checker)
NO3 - 2-5??? Hard to tell with my kit

I have a 6 bulb ATI T5 over the tank, probably about 9 inches from the surface, with two bulbs on from 10 AM - 12 PM, all 6 bulbs on from 12 PM - 6 PM and then again just the two bulbs from 6 PM - 9 PM.

I've tried to include as much information that I can think to.
PLEASE HELP

 

[WIReefer]

Sorry to hear about this, don’t give up yet you’ve come so far! I would think maybe shortening the light schedule some I run my 6 bulb sunpower for 11 hours a day and all 6 bulbs are running for roughly only 4 hours try shortening it a bit. Have you tired an icp test?

 

[Funston07]

What is your magnesium at? I use the same salt and it says it mixes at 1240 or something like that but actually mixed more around 1140-1170. Magnesium is very important as far as growth goes

 

[TheGerm]

what WIReefer said, dont give up just yet. You have made it 2yrs, keep going!

I would say try an ICP test, lower the light schedule a tad.

To clarify, what are you using to test your salinity? And was it calibrated recently?

 

[ScottB]

You are showing good numbers there. Assuming they stay consistently around those numbers, by now you should be cruising along. So something is up. Hopefully that ICP can pick up what could be happening. A tiny bit of copper goes a real long way.

I will say that 20% a week is more than you need to be doing. You could do that every 2 weeks and allow you to keep a little more nitrate in there.

And has been said already, trust but always verify your refractometer.

Lastly, I think it was a good move to filter/mix your own.

 

[Oldreefer44]

Don't give up yet. Could be one or more of several things least of which, IMO, is the lighting. IME, almost all issues like yours are water quality related. First thing IMO is get your Triton test sent out to make sure your test results are accurate. The hobby is littered with those of us that learned, after looking at everything else, that our results were way off. If everything is ok there then there also could be stray voltage, some sort of heavy metal or even low PH, if you have high CO2 in your house. Be patient and eliminate one thing at a time.

 

[HB AL]

Check for stray voltage, metals in the tank, send out a sample to triton or such and see what that shows in your water causing the issues. Really seems like a water chemistry issue. Good luck

 

[AC1211]

Hello there,

I'm hoping to get some help to turn around my tank, which at this point, I'm about ready to give up on.
The tank was setup February of 2018, so we're coming up on almost 2 years now, and I have not been able to keep practically any corals in the tank to save my life. The ones that I have been able to "keep", have practically no growth to them at all. I didn't even have any noticeable coraline growth until a couple of months ago.

The only type of coral I can keep alive are soft coral currently, and even then, I can't keep some of these without having issues. Twice I've tried to keep ricordea, at the LFS each one I've purchased was super big and very colorful, and both times once added to my tank, they veryyyyyy slowly shrunk to the size of maybe a pencil eraser, lost its color (turning white) then eventually detached from the rock never to be seen again. As far as I know, typically the bleaching would be from too much light, but each time I've tried them, they were under an overhang, at the corner of the tank, so they were not under direct light. On the other hand, a Rhodactis that I have has been doing fairly well.

The only other corals I currently have in the tank are two different zoanthids and a toadstool. The zoanthids go through phases of being open and looking good, then they will be closed for several days at a time. One of them has grown decently, probably adding 5-6 new polyps in the past 6 months since I've had it, while the other has had two polyps since I added it to the tank around the same time. The toadstool was one of the first corals that I had added, and I would say that it's no bigger than when it was added originally.

All of the LPS I've tried so far haven't fared any better. With probably half of them dying within a week of adding them, to lasting several months and then slowly declining. The Acans and Blastos I have tried always looked good at first, even adding additional polyps over the course of a couple months, then they slowly start to recede from the skeletons and then the remaining polyps bail-out. The euphilia I have tried haven't lasted longer than 2 weeks, lose color (becoming translucent) and then start to recede from the skeleton and bail-out any surviving polyps.
I always start them on the sand once they're added, then slowly move them over to the rock, but most don't even make it off the sand due to the tissue loss.

I've had a few bouts with different types of algae as well (dinos, hair, turf algae) which I've mostly been able to keep in check, but I haven't been able to get rid of much of it completely. As far as from what I've seen a lot of these can be cause by low nutrients but I haven't really been able to raise them too much either. So I'm just at a standstill with everything and have no idea what is causing so many issues... I had attempted to set up a fuge to help with the algae issues, but the chaeto met the same fate as the corals (turned white, kinda broke apart and melted) and I haven't tried to set one up afterwards

I do about 20% waterchange once a week -- up until recently, I was obtaining my saltwater and RO pre-made from an LFS, but thought maybe I was having issues so I purchased a 6 stage BRS RO/DI unit. Which reads at 0 TDS coming from the unit and I have been using the RedSea blue bucket to mix to 1.026 since.

Testing as of right now are below -- I have a triton test that I haven't filled/sent quite yet but plan on doing so in the next day or two.

Salinity - 1.026
ALK - 9 (Hanna checker)
CA - 400
PO4 - .10 (Hanna checker)
NO3 - 2-5??? Hard to tell with my kit

I have a 6 bulb ATI T5 over the tank, probably about 9 inches from the surface, with two bulbs on from 10 AM - 12 PM, all 6 bulbs on from 12 PM - 6 PM and then again just the two bulbs from 6 PM - 9 PM.

I've tried to include as much information that I can think to.
PLEASE HELP

I have the same issue I am very successful with fish however given my freshwater fish background so thus I just wait it out.

 

[brandon429]

team, wrong thread oops

i posted wrong thread/meant for another peroxide thread in the chem forum

 

[velandracorey]

Sorry to hear about this, don’t give up yet you’ve come so far! I would think maybe shortening the light schedule some I run my 6 bulb sunpower for 11 hours a day and all 6 bulbs are running for roughly only 4 hours try shortening it a bit. Have you tired an icp test?

I'll definitely start cutting back the time that all 6 are on.
Originally when I had started trying out some Euphillia, I was thinking the light might have been the issue and raised it wayyyy up just to try to hopefully cut some of the par they were getting (I haven't been able to test par in the tank) but that hadn't made a difference unfortunately.

 

[velandracorey]

what WIReefer said, dont give up just yet. You have made it 2yrs, keep going!

I would say try an ICP test, lower the light schedule a tad.

To clarify, what are you using to test your salinity? And was it calibrated recently?

I have a refractometer that I had gotten from BRS -- I also use their calibration liquid.
Usually I calibrate right before I've been mixing saltwater (so about once a week?).

 

[velandracorey]

You are showing good numbers there. Assuming they stay consistently around those numbers, by now you should be cruising along. So something is up. Hopefully that ICP can pick up what could be happening. A tiny bit of copper goes a real long way.

I will say that 20% a week is more than you need to be doing. You could do that every 2 weeks and allow you to keep a little more nitrate in there.

And has been said already, trust but always verify your refractometer.

Lastly, I think it was a good move to filter/mix your own.

I do think for a bit towards the beginning there I did have quite a bit of instability. Once I started to suspect something was up with the water I was getting from my LFS, I started to check the ALK each time I purchased some and started to notice that a lot of times there was a bit of variance as to what it was mixed to. I saw anywhere from 10 - 6 DKH and once I saw the 6DKH from the water I had purchased I decided I had to spend the money on the RO/DI unit to start to mix my own.

I also was thinking before I had issues with heavy metals because I saw a ton of threads about how metals can really mess stuff up. The last ICP test I had sent in, I did have some aluminum on there, but it was still pretty low. I had checked for rusting on any of my pumps and saw my ATO had a little bit on the pump, which I don't know if that was where it was leeching from but I removed it to be safe about 2 months ago now.

I'll try moving back my waterchanges a tad!

Thank you

 

[josephxsxn]

There are some posts on the forums here where people get thier tank bacteria tested. Some folks found they had huge concentrations of bacteria known to cause problems with corals.

Asking for help because I am at a complete loss

Just read through this. I'm not an expert at much of anything but sometimes throwing ideas out there can help. The bacteria thing sounds like a very promising lead after you've eliminated almost every other lead. However, I know you did some tests on your water source but I didn't see anywhere...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[velandracorey]

Don't give up yet. Could be one or more of several things least of which, IMO, is the lighting. IME, almost all issues like yours are water quality related. First thing IMO is get your Triton test sent out to make sure your test results are accurate. The hobby is littered with those of us that learned, after looking at everything else, that our results were way off. If everything is ok there then there also could be stray voltage, some sort of heavy metal or even low PH, if you have high CO2 in your house. Be patient and eliminate one thing at a time.

I'll take a sample for the Triton test I have laying around later on today!
How would I test to see if there is stray voltage? Would the voltage or the low PH affect the fish at all? The only fish losses I've had since setting everything up has been from jumpers unfortunately before I had a cover.

 

[Timfish]

My two cents: I don't telly see anything different with your system than I've seen in other systems that at least have some corals thriving. I am wondering what spectrum your bulbs are? Do you have a couple daylights? Or are all of them actinic/blue? As mentioned above I would cut back on water changes to 20-30% a month (I personally like small weekly water changes though). My suspicion at this point is the microbial processes don't favor corals and or the short term I would try to get water from a "healthy" reef system that has similar corals to what you hope to keep in an effort to get more favorable bacteria and stuff.

 

[velandracorey]

What is your magnesium at? I use the same salt and it says it mixes at 1240 or something like that but actually mixed more around 1140-1170. Magnesium is very important as far as growth goes

Just tested (salifert) -- it was right between 1410 - 1440, which I think is normal?

 

[X-37B]

How big is your tank?
Looks like you could use more flow.
I only see 1 powerhead.

 

[velandracorey]

My two cents: I don't telly see anything different with your system than I've seen in other systems that at least have some corals thriving. I am wondering what spectrum your bulbs are? Do you have a couple daylights? Or are all of them actinic/blue? As mentioned above I would cut back on water changes to 20-30% a month (I personally like small weekly water changes though). My suspicion at this point is the microbial processes don't favor corals and or the short term I would try to get water from a "healthy" reef system that has similar corals to what you hope to keep in an effort to get more favorable bacteria and stuff.

I don't mind so much larger water changes, since they keep me from fiddling with stuff too much.

I do have some daylights -- right now I have 6 54w ATI bulbs in there (3 Blue+, 2 Coral+, and 1 True Atinic). The Blue+ are on the 2 bulb channel (so that's what I have on in the morning and at night) with the other 4 on midday.

 

[velandracorey]

How big is your tank?
Looks like you could use more flow.
I only see 1 powerhead.

Sorry the images aren't the best lol
It's a standard 75 -- I've got two powerheads in there now as well as the return.
I have an IceCap 3k gyre on one end of the tank (I have it set to random up to 60%), as well as a Hydor Koralia on the other end with the return.

 

[KingTideCorals]

Don't give up!

ICP test could be really helpful in possibly finding what is wrong! This community is here to help, and we can all hash out the problem to hopefully find an answer!