Acrylic to glass adhesive/ Hybrid tank

[stuckey_t]

Hi,

Looking for an answer to a question from someone with firsthand knowledge or personal experience. I am currently building a custom aquarium. 65" long by 32" wide by 24" tall. Bottom and sides are all glass. Viewing panels are 1/2" glass and bottom panel is 3/4" glass. Viewing panels are starfire glass bottom panel is regular glass. I would like to use acrylic to eurobrace the top. My plan is to use acrylic strip at 2.5" wide. I would like the eurobracing strips to offer some strength to the tank but most of the strength should come from 3/4" glass on the bottom. Does anyone know how companies like A.G.E. bind acrylic bottoms to glass panels or know of an adhesive that can handle glass to acrylic and bond with strength. At the same time said adhesive needs to be reef safe.

 

[benny z]

you can't bond acrylic to glass.

 

[bct15]

The 3/4 inch glass will increase the weight support for the tank but will not hold it together (will Not increase the load bearing capacity of the tanks sides). You will need some sort of bracing or the top, as people forget the rim around a tank actually holds the tank together, the seams just keep water from leaking out (on a glass tank).

I am not currently aware of any adhesive that will bond acrylic to glass, good luck with the build. I believe you would have to build some sort of bracing that attaches to the top of the tank, rather than binding it.

Brandon

 

[stuckey_t]

you can't bond acrylic to glass.

I knew people were going to tell me that Here's some food/ links for thought...they must be doing something different than 9/10 of the builders out there:

http://www.kingfishaquarium.com/agecustomaquariums.htm

Acrylic and Glass Exhibits

 

[stuckey_t]

I think the whole idea with the rimless tanks is thicker glass gives you more binding strength/surface area for the silicone to adhere to letting you get away with larger dimensions and less bracing up top. I could be wrong but there are some large tanks being built out there with little to no bracing on top. Look at this build which is longer and taller than my build and goes rimless:

https://www.reef2reef.com/forums/large-aquariums-180g/58640-my-new-255-gals-rimless-reef.html

The 3/4 inch glass will increase the weight support for the tank but will not hold it together (will Not increase the load bearing capacity of the tanks sides). You will need some sort of bracing or the top, as people forget the rim around a tank actually holds the tank together, the seams just keep water from leaking out (on a glass tank).

I am not currently aware of any adhesive that will bond acrylic to glass, good luck with the build. I believe you would have to build some sort of bracing that attaches to the top of the tank, rather than binding it.

Brandon

 

[Murfman]

I knew people were going to tell me that Here's some food/ links for thought...they must be doing something different than 9/10 of the builders out there:

http://www.kingfishaquarium.com/agecustomaquariums.htm

Acrylic and Glass Exhibits

The AGE tanks are not acrylic bottoms but PVC schedule 80. The bottoms are CNC machined for a very close tolerance fit. IDK what adhesive they you, probably silicone. Since the glass fits down in the machined slots they don't move. You could do the acrylic to glass, as long as you have an outside type clamp brace to keep it from pulling apart.

 

[JMSKI333]

i could be wrong but aren't the overflows in our tanks made of acrillic? and aren't they siliconed to the glass? Maybe its just a water seal and not structural but it came to mind.

 

[Jeepguy242]

"A.G.E uses an abrasive water jet to cut out a smooth glass channel for an external "calfo shelf."

the way i read that, is there is a channel cut in the bottom to hold the glass, if you could do that, then it will probly work, otherwise, i think over time it will fail, but that is just my opinion.

 

[Jeepguy242]

i could be wrong but aren't the overflows in our tanks made of acrillic? and aren't they siliconed to the glass? Maybe its just a water seal and not structural but it came to mind.

those overflows are not structural, as far as the tank goes, and they do not have any load on them. i have seen them fall off on several tanks including one of my own

 

[iani]

The AGE tanks are not acrylic bottoms but PVC schedule 80. The bottoms are CNC machined for a very close tolerance fit. IDK what adhesive they you, probably silicone. Since the glass fits down in the machined slots they don't move. You could do the acrylic to glass, as long as you have an outside type clamp brace to keep it from pulling apart.

They also make hybrid acrylic/glass tanks. I believe their hybrid tanks have a lip on the acrylic that the glass sits into. It would seem like what ever they are using between the glass and acrylic is not for structural support.

 

[stuckey_t]

The AGE tanks are not acrylic bottoms but PVC schedule 80. The bottoms are CNC machined for a very close tolerance fit. IDK what adhesive they you, probably silicone. Since the glass fits down in the machined slots they don't move. You could do the acrylic to glass, as long as you have an outside type clamp brace to keep it from pulling apart.

These pictures that I found online suggest that a "lip" is CNC cut into the schedule 80 but don't really suggest a "groove" being cut into it. I could see if it was a groove that the glass would have some lateral support but it looks to me like they just glue the glass to the lip itself. If that is the case they still need some type of adhesive that holds glass to plastic? It would be cool if someone who has one of these tanks could shoot a picture of the bottom. Is it a lip or groove cut into the schedule 80 on the bottom?

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/stuckey_t/pvcbottom4.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/stuckey_t/pvcbottom3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/stuckey_t/overflow1.jpg

 

[Murfman]

Looks like in this pic it is a groove. You have a slight edge on the outside but enough to keep the glass in place IMO.

 

[stuckey_t]

Looks like in this pic it is a groove. You have a slight edge on the outside but enough to keep the glass in place IMO.

Man, I don't know. With all the pressure going into the joints of that tank I can't see where that little bit of a "groove" is going to hold that tank together. I would be very afraid of that bottom glass popping right out of that groove. I am still banking on them using some different type of adhesive. If glass and plastic can't be bonded what keeps the bottom on when moving it around?

 

[iani]

Why not just eurobrace it with glass then? I know when AGE eurobraces their tanks they use a single piece of acrylic. Doing it like that has got to be way more expensive than using a bit of glass. I don't think a 2.5" eurobrace would be enough. Normally eurobraces are 4" on glass tanks.

 

[cmcneil]

AGE doesnt groove the bottom.my buddy has a 4x4x2 rimless that AGE made.the pvc sheet is dattoed at the bottom edge,not groved.the glass is flush with the pvc sheets outer edge and has NO groove.they use a special adhesive to bond the pvc to glass.it isnt silicone but more along the lines of the type of adhesive they use to install windshields in cars.if i recall correctly it is a UV cured adhesive.they also do use acrylic for eurobraces on glass tanks.the adhesive again is a special adhesive and is not silicone.

ianiwane,where are you getting this"normally eurobraces are 4" on glass tanks" from?so your saying that a small glass tank uses 4" eurobraces?the eurobraces size is dependant on the tanks size.there is no standard size.it is based on lenght,width,and height.

 

[stuckey_t]

AGE doesnt groove the bottom.my buddy has a 4x4x2 rimless that AGE made.the pvc sheet is dattoed at the bottom edge,not groved.the glass is flush with the pvc sheets outer edge and has NO groove.they use a special adhesive to bond the pvc to glass.it isnt silicone but more along the lines of the type of adhesive they use to install windshields in cars.if i recall correctly it is a UV cured adhesive.they also do use acrylic for eurobraces on glass tanks.the adhesive again is a special adhesive and is not silicone.

ianiwane,where are you getting this"normally eurobraces are 4" on glass tanks" from?so your saying that a small glass tank uses 4" eurobraces?the eurobraces size is dependant on the tanks size.there is no standard size.it is based on lenght,width,and height.

Well, this makes me think I am headed in the right direction now I just need to "discover" what this adhesive might be? In my, opinion it opens up a whole world of ideas on what can be done with tank construction. I'm not sure if I need to test some different ones and gamble or someone might have an idea of what it could be....

 

[stuckey_t]

glue/ adhesive

I was considering trying this adhesive but I'm just not sure....

Mr. Sticky’s® Underwater Glue: TAP Plastics

 

[stuckey_t]

Why not just eurobrace it with glass then? I know when AGE eurobraces their tanks they use a single piece of acrylic. Doing it like that has got to be way more expensive than using a bit of glass. I don't think a 2.5" eurobrace would be enough. Normally eurobraces are 4" on glass tanks.

A full sheet off 3/4" acrylic runs about $700 right now so that was the main reason not to cut it from a full sheet. I didn't want to use 1/2 acrylic because of bowing. I was looking for some tank strength in the bracing and mainly to keep water from slopping up over the slides like you see on some rimless tanks.

 

[JR's Reef]

you can't bond acrylic to glass.

It can be done :wink:

The AGE tanks are not acrylic bottoms but PVC schedule 80. The bottoms are CNC machined for a very close tolerance fit. IDK what adhesive they you, probably silicone. Since the glass fits down in the machined slots they don't move. You could do the acrylic to glass, as long as you have an outside type clamp brace to keep it from pulling apart.

Silicone wont stick to PVC either. Its a about a primer something that will let the silicone stick to it same with acrylic if a proper primmer is used silicone will stick to both

i could be wrong but aren't the overflows in our tanks made of acrillic? and aren't they siliconed to the glass? Maybe its just a water seal and not structural but it came to mind.

Correct they are they use a primmer to prep the acrylic so the silicone to stick to it long term

 

[stuckey_t]

It can be done :wink:


Silicone wont stick to PVC either. Its a about a primer something that will let the silicone stick to it same with acrylic if a proper primmer is used silicone will stick to both

Correct they are they use a primmer to prep the acrylic so the silicone to stick to it long term

Sounds like you know something about bonding acrylic to glass got any ideas or know what I should be looking at?