Am I crazy for thinking MH + t5 ?

[rtparty]

Yep just a bad bulb. Still... rotten luck! lol. And of course it was one of the actinic and the LFS is all out of them as I bought the last two. *sigh* Side note, based on the look of the coral plus and actinic I'm guessing I am going to end up running either 4x actinic or 2x actinic and 2x blue plus.

When I tried 2 actinic and 2 coral plus it looked terrible. Very purple and not very bright to the eyes. 2 blue plus, 1 actinic and 1 coral plus is my current combo

 

[Kmsutows]

What giesemann combo would you recommend for a 72x24tallx17? Too bad geisemann doesn't have a MH with blue led moon light option. I dont like all the blues so what MH bulbs are closest to sunlight in color?

 

[Velcro]

What giesemann combo would you recommend for a 72x24tallx17? Too bad geisemann doesn't have a MH with blue led moon light option. I dont like all the blues so what MH bulbs are closest to sunlight in color?

iwasaki 6500K

 

[bif24701]

LOL!
Grandis.

Some Kessils and maybe some MH for supplementation. Never mind, forget the MH.

 

[Centerline]

Did you all know that UVL makes Super Actinic in T5 as well as VHO? ...not many people do.

I did not. Might grab 4 of those. Honestly the best looking lights to me.

 

[Centerline]

Ok do I just have the worst luck or something? On my giesemann only one side of the T5s work. UGH. I do not want to have to ship back yet another faulty fixture.

Check those end caps. Have had a problem with mine.

 

[A. grandis]

Going to grab two TA. I could downgrade the radiums to 250w but then I think I'd have to run the T5 full time for the Extra PAR. I have several Coral colonies I grow that get mad if they get anything less than 350 PAR. So my fear is that 250w radium will not be enough?

Boom, your tank is way too shallow and 2 X 250W would take care of most regular shallow (18") water tanks easily.
800W of halides isn't necessary there... There is a limit for photosynthesis anyway.
Technically, with 2 X 400W you should let them on for less time than with 2 X 250W bulbs.
My halides were 2 X 250W over my 55gal. ;Wideyed Way overkill!!! LOL!
I could have 2 X 175W over that 55gal. and the tank would still be more than lit!
And my tank was about 18" deep.
Please don't let the blue Radiums make you think you have little wattage there... hehe...
And you still have the T5s... ha!!
Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

Going to grab two TA. I could downgrade the radiums to 250w but then I think I'd have to run the T5 full time for the Extra PAR. I have several Coral colonies I grow that get mad if they get anything less than 350 PAR. So my fear is that 250w radium will not be enough?

Use the True Actinic, man! That makes difference!

Before I forget... one thing I suggest is to keep the same corals you have there under the same lights you were keeping before.
Most likely your corals will change some of the colors due to the new light. Would be great to see the results side by side.

Back to the lights... I don't think you need to worry about it. You can run the 250W Radium and have the T5s on only before and after the MHs...I think it would be enough... specially because of the height of the tank.

Talking about True actinic... here is that blue video:


Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

I'd stay with the 400 watts so you don't have to run T5 as much.

Even with the 2 x 250W he could do the before after settings for the T5s.
All depends on the photoperiod.

Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

The only reason that True Actinic read lower PAR than a B+ is because the PAR meters do not read very well below 450nm and leave out a lot of the important spectrum. If you compensate for the spectrum, you can see that they are probably very close to the same. On a newer meter like an Apogee 510, which is still light on blue, purple and UV (but better), the gap has closed to almost nothing.

This is also why VHO always tested lower than T5 since the famed Super Actinic and Actinic White have so much output below 450. Even without compensation for the spectrum, on an Apogee 510, one single VHO bulb of either kind is within 1% of a pair B+ bulbs.

Use just about any T5 bulb with confidence that has spectrum from 350 to 720 - the PAR will be the same as another and is only limited in our minds by our cheap hobby-grade tools.

That is very interesting!!
Yeah, back in the days we all thought the Pure Actinic had so little PAR...
That was one of the reasons why I gave it one star on my review! ;Wacky
Thanks for this post!
Grandis.

 

[rtparty]

Use the True Actinic, man! That makes difference!

Before I forget... one thing I suggest is to keep the same corals you have there under the same lights you were keeping before.
Most likely your corals will change some of the colors due to the new light. Would be great to see the results side by side.

Back to the lights... I don't think you need to worry about it. You can run the 250W Radium and have the T5s on only before and after the MHs...I think it would be enough... specially because of the height of the tank.

Talking about True actinic... here is that blue video:


Grandis.

Jason Fox runs Actinic Blue bulbs aka Blue Plus not true Actinic. He talked about it in the current Reef Builders video

 

[A. grandis]

Most of the people that matter as far as the science behind lights go will tell you that the blue+ has plenty of actinic in it.

Yeap! Grimm himself told me that back in the day and I still had that in my mind not too long ago!!! LOL!
Not our faults, I guess. We couldn't measure the right way back then.;Nailbiting
Grandis.

 

[Velcro]

Yeap! Grimm himself told me that back in the day and I still had that in my mind not too long ago!!! LOL!
Not our faults, I guess. We couldn't measure the right way back then.;Nailbiting
Grandis.

You'd be hard pressed to prove that the pure actinics were the cause of new colors in corals vs. long term stability.

 

[A. grandis]

We know the bulb spec is 270w. They were referring the 300w setting of some E ballasts vs the 330w drive given to it by an M80.



Lol what is plenty? and who are 'the people that matter' Hilarious statement to make if you ask me. If you mean plenty for growing coral then you don't need 'actinic' at all really if we look at some early, yet effective LED systems. True actinic is a fantastic bulb for those that understand it's application.

I don't understand it's application.
I know it makes a difference in the production of some pigments and it is a good part of the spectrum for zooxanthellae.
Could you please let us know more?
Thanks,
Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

This is interesting. I have been running my eight bulb with 4B, 2C, 1P and 1A for a year. I swapped a couple bulbs last night and ultimately changed one C for another A. The look is hardly any more blue (kind of surprising) and it is very slightly dimmer (makes sense). I wouldn't mind a bit more blue to be honest but I know a few months ago I tried another B in place of a C (making 5/1/1/1) and it wasn't my favorite. I think if I want more blue I should swap the P for a C in the current setup but I really like the warmth of the purple bulb.

Yeah, that's another reason for my one star on that review. People used to say that they give the "pop" and I actually saw dimmed. LOL! I think the thing is that Pure Actinic a special light and the corals can "see" that difference, but our eyes can't.

There was a thread on T5 bulb comparisons on here a couple years ago where someone actually professionally measured the PAR of all the T5 bulbs at 0 hours and again at 100. Most were pretty consistent but the TA actually gained 100 par over the course of 100 hour burn in, which only put it about 15% lower than a B+. If people are testing them when the bulbs are new they are going to show a big drop in PAR which seems to come back later.

I would like to see that thread! Link, please?
Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

I ran that same fixture over a 120 I had. I never ran any fans. Changed bulbs every 12 months. Everything worked great

A pic of my old 120 with gieseman spectra. 2 250 watt 14k Hamilton's on a galaxy select a watt and 2 blue plus 2 purple plus with 2 blue reef Brite strips.

I'm sorry for replying one by one... if I do the other way I'll get confused..

Nice reef! I like that purple/yellow wrasse..
Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

Some Kessils and maybe some MH for supplementation. Never mind, forget the MH.

LOL!
Just another of those LED guys...

Grandis.

 

[rockskimmerflow]

I don't understand it's application.
I know it makes a difference in the production of some pigments and it is a good part of the spectrum for zooxanthellae.
Could you please let us know more?
Thanks,
Grandis.

There is no reason you NEED to use Actinic bulbs and if you really don't find the look appealing I don't suggest you use them. Enjoying the look of your tank is a large part of what this hobby is all about. Personally, I like the richness they add to the spectrum and especially the glow they bring out in certain corals without creating heavy 'blue' look in the tank.

That said, I encourage you to do some independent research into spectral ranges for chromoprotein activation as well as photosynthetic activation curves for various clades of zooxanthellae. I think you'll find the 390-430nm range has a lot more action going on the current dogma would have you believe. It hits right at the heart of why a metal halide that churns out less lumens/watt than a given LED/array of LEDs will smoke the diode(s) in terms of spectral quality and resulting coral health. It's very tricky to quantify a lamp's efficiency with regards to its effectiveness for coral reef tanks when using metrics such as lumens or PAR. There's far too much info out there to even cover in a cursory manner in a forum post, but you seem quite passionate about lighting and for that reason I trust you'll have the initiative to go seek that knowledge out - especially since metal halides seem to be your point of interest and they are quite effective at generating photons in the nm range targeted by the True Actinic bulb.

 

[A. grandis]

I did not. Might grab 4 of those. Honestly the best looking lights to me.

Where can we find them?
I thought they went out of business or something..
Grandis.

 

[A. grandis]

Jason Fox runs Actinic Blue bulbs aka Blue Plus not true Actinic. He talked about it in the current Reef Builders video

I know...
It's just to show the blue lights that I posted..
I'm not sure if actually his Actinic Blue are Blue Plus per say, though.
Jason Fox's 400g cube. He has 5 Reef Brites and 6 actinic blue T5s over this one:

... and the 700 gal with the 20K/ 250W halides, Blue actinic T5s and some blue Reef Brites too.
Jason uses a combination of metal halides, T5s and LEDs. He doesn't run LEDs only.
The LEDs are supplemental, but for longer periods of time. His main lights are the halides and T5s.
He says that he likes the T5/LEDs, not only LEDs.
The 250w 20K halides are on for only 3 or 5 hours a day.
The blue actinic T5s are on for 10 hours a day.
The blue LEDs are on for 12 hours a day.
But he does use some "white" approach couple hours a day, he says.
One of the vats has a Hydra 52 that he runs with whites, greens and reds for like 5 hours a day.
He didn't say anything about using true actinic bulbs, but blue actinics instead.
He does uses some "pink" bulb in one of the vats, I guess, but I'm not sure what bulb that is.
Grandis.