Ammonia Spike to 1.0ppm - Need Advice Please

[It’s the Grim Reefer]

Hey Reefers,

I finished cycling my tank a few weeks back and I added 2 clowns and 3 nassarius snails post cycle. I waited nearly 3 weeks and the ugly phase was in full effect. I then added a lawnmower blenny, 3 astraea snails and 2 sand shifting starfish.

All was going well and tank is looking much cleaner now but a few days after adding the new livestock, I’ve had an ammonia spike which has peaked at about 1.0ppm. I thought this was from the additions, but I believe it’s user error now as I noticed dKH was down about 6.8 a few days ago so I dosed to KH Coralline Gro to boost it up. Instructions required 34ml and I stupidly dosed the full amount into the sump all at once. I’m now certain that the dKH spike caused stress to the livestock, resulting in the ammonia spike.

I’ve managed to pull out two of the nassarius snails and they both look very ill. Mucus coming from their body as seen in attached image. Can’t find the third one still.

Ammonia is still sitting around 0.75ppm a few days later, I’ve done a decent 25-30% water change. The remainder of the livestock is hanging in there, but I’m concerned about how long they can endure this spike.

I’ve learnt my lesson from this mistake, which is the silver lining. But I guess I’m seeking feedback on where to from here.
- How long can I expect the ammonia spike to last?
- Is there anything else I should/could be doing to try keep my livestock alive and lower the ammonia?
- Shall I assume the nassarius snails are done for?
- Any other feedback/thoughts?

Last thought, through research, I discovered that the ammonia from the API test kits is total ammonia. Using calculations to determine the NH3/NH4 ratio, my NH3 is sitting right on the cusp of dangerous (0.052), hence why my little guys might be hanging in there to this point.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

 

[Dan_P]

Hey Reefers,

I finished cycling my tank a few weeks back and I added 2 clowns and 3 nassarius snails post cycle. I waited nearly 3 weeks and the ugly phase was in full effect. I then added a lawnmower blenny, 3 astraea snails and 2 sand shifting starfish.

All was going well and tank is looking much cleaner now but a few days after adding the new livestock, I’ve had an ammonia spike which has peaked at about 1.0ppm. I thought this was from the additions, but I believe it’s user error now as I noticed dKH was down about 6.8 a few days ago so I dosed to KH Coralline Gro to boost it up. Instructions required 34ml and I stupidly dosed the full amount into the sump all at once. I’m now certain that the dKH spike caused stress to the livestock, resulting in the ammonia spike.

I’ve managed to pull out two of the nassarius snails and they both look very ill. Mucus coming from their body as seen in attached image. Can’t find the third one still.

Ammonia is still sitting around 0.75ppm a few days later, I’ve done a decent 25-30% water change. The remainder of the livestock is hanging in there, but I’m concerned about how long they can endure this spike.

I’ve learnt my lesson from this mistake, which is the silver lining. But I guess I’m seeking feedback on where to from here.
- How long can I expect the ammonia spike to last?
- Is there anything else I should/could be doing to try keep my livestock alive and lower the ammonia?
- Shall I assume the nassarius snails are done for?
- Any other feedback/thoughts?

Last thought, through research, I discovered that the ammonia from the API test kits is total ammonia. Using calculations to determine the NH3/NH4 ratio, my NH3 is sitting right on the cusp of dangerous (0.052), hence why my little guys might be hanging in there to this point.

Thanks in advance for your thoughts.

I wouldn’t expect to see any ammonia in a system with the uglies because micro and macro algae are excellent consumers of it. Also, I find it odd that the ammonia level is lasting so long. All this makes me question the test result.

Where you did make a mistake is placing two sand sifting sea stars in a new system. They will likely starve. In fact you might want to keep an eye on them to make sure they don’t die unnoticed and rot unseen buried in the sand.

Keeping the pH under 8 is the easiest way to keep the amount of unionized ammonia to a minimum if the ammonia test result is real.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Even if ammonia is accurate, it’s not as big of a concern as you think.

What is the alk now? FWIW, 6.8 dKH is fine.

 

[It’s the Grim Reefer]

I wouldn’t expect to see any ammonia in a system with the uglies because micro and macro algae are excellent consumers of it. Also, I find it odd that the ammonia level is lasting so long. All this makes me question the test result.

Where you did make a mistake is placing two sand sifting sea stars in a new system. They will likely starve. In fact you might want to keep an eye on them to make sure they don’t die unnoticed and rot unseen buried in the sand.

Keeping the pH under 8 is the easiest way to keep the amount of unionized ammonia to a minimum if the ammonia test result is real.

Hey Dan,

Yeah, good question. I have been wondering myself if the result is accurate. I used the same API test kit all through my cycling stage and it seemed fine but this persistent high reading has got me wondering. I've ordered one of the Seachem Ammonia Alerts to stick in the tanks and measure the NH3 specifically to determine if the figures are accurate.

The sand shifting stars were recommended by my LFS to help clean the 'ugly' phase. But I did wonder how they would fair in a new tank with minimal nutritional sources. Do you think i should return these guys? They're still moving around the tank now, but I am concerned their food sources will be scarce.

Thanks for the prompt response.

 

[It’s the Grim Reefer]

Even if ammonia is accurate, it’s not as big of a concern as you think.

What is the alk now? FWIW, 6.8 dKH is fine.

G'day Randy,

That is surprising as all I have read says this level of ammonia is a concern. But I do hope you're right. What's the reasoning/justification for it being less of a concern than most think?

Alk was 7.9 about 18 hours again when I last tested. Noting your comment about 6.8dKH being fine, gives me comfort in letting it sit without me feeling the need to intervene.

Appreciate your input and support.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I've ordered one of the Seachem Ammonia Alerts to stick in the tanks and measure the NH3 specifically to determine if the figures are accurate.

Just don't overreact to the words they use on the alert. The numbers may be accurate, but how they are interpreted can vary. Ammonia is not nearly as toxic as some folks think, and Seachem has an interest in getting folks to use their product to "detoxify" ammonia (which it doesn't apparently do, but that's another issue).

 

[BeanAnimal]

And yes - I would return the sand sifting stars. Given the insanely poor advice from your LFS, they are likely going to perish no matter what, but at least their demise will not be at your hand.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

That is surprising as all I have read says this level of ammonia is a concern. But I do hope you're right. What's the reasoning/justification for it being less of a concern than most think?

The historic reason is hard to say, but the fact of the matter is that most reefers think 2 ppm total ammonia is an immediate fish killer, and companies selling ammonia products (whether they do anything or not) have a vested interest in maintaining that fear.

Every time someone gets a reading of 2 ppm ammonia and they add a product like Prime, and the fish survives, they credit the product efficacy, rather than reevaluating how toxic ammonia is. Real studies show it takes more than 10 ppm ammonia to kill half of fish over several days.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/ammonia-is-our-friend.1080953/

 

[It’s the Grim Reefer]

Just don't overreact to the words they use on the alert. The numbers may be accurate, but how they are interpreted can vary. Ammonia is not nearly as toxic as some folks think, and Seachem has an interest in getting folks to use their product to "detoxify" ammonia (which it doesn't apparently do, but that's another issue).

Very interesting indeed. With your credentials, I am inclined to and will happily take your advice openly on this topic.

It also provides more clarity on what I'm visually seeing in my tank, which appears to be happy livestock who are behaving normally (or shall I say as expected), which I don't think would be the case if they were all suffering from some form of ammonia poisoning.

 

[It’s the Grim Reefer]

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/ammonia-is-our-friend.1080953/

Mate, this article is incredible. Thank you for sharing. I’ve been panicking the past few days essentially combing myself I was going to wake up each morning to belly up floating fish. After reading this, I feel much more comfortable that my little guys will be ok.

I will continue to monitor my parameters, but with far less emphasise on entering panic mode when ammonia is circa 1.0ppm.

I did do another test just now and I also did a blind trial with RO water in one test vial to see if the kit was faulty, but it’s quite obvious which is which. Nevertheless, far less cause for concern now.

I really appreciate the insight and input. Such good information. Learn something new everyday.

 

[It’s the Grim Reefer]

For those following along at home…
Everything still seems fine. Fish all behaving the same, colour looks good, feeding well. Nothing obviously abnormal. Only minor visual change is I’m starting to see slightly more green algae (circled red in photo)

I tested parameters today to stay on top of things:
Ammonia - 1.0ppm (still no change)
NH3 concentration - 0.0619ppm
Nitrate - about 6 (it was 0.5 a week ago when I added new livestock).
pH - 8.1
Temp - 26.3 C
Salinity - 35ppt
Alk - 7.1dKH

Based on the above, do you believe any actions are required or just stick the course? Is Alk fine at these levels, if so at what reading should I intervene?

Thanks all.