Anemone help. I know... very original

[JumpingFlea]

So... I was hoping that I would never have to ask this and reading of all the stories of anemones dying due to non-mature tanks, but here I am. I just want to help the little guy. The tank is 3 months old (yes I should have waited until 6 months but at best more) He is a Green BTA that I got about two weeks ago.
Here’s a pick of him now:

Parameters:
Nitrate: 0ppm
Phosphate: .25ppm
Calcium: 400ppm
Alk: 10.2 DKH
Magnesium: 1150ppm
Salinity: 1.025 sg
I will take any advice.
Thank you.

 

[Llyod276]

Learn it's all you can do. You should be ok till it looks like one of mine from back in the day. Then just toss it.

 

[mindme]

I put my RBTA in a 2 week old tank, and it's now going on a year and a half. But my parameters were always stable and I'm not trying to keep other corals alive with it. The entire tank was just anemone and 2 clownfish.

What other livestock do you have? Do you have any clownfish that are trying to get hosted by it? Sometimes they can irritate smaller ones.

As for your water parameters, Do you have corals or anything to justify the 10.2 ALK? I'd be dropping that to between 8 and 8.5. I let me alk get up to 10 on my reef tank once and it was not good for many corals. All of them are happy in the 8 - 8.5 range. And your magnesium seems kind of low, especially for an alk that high to me.

Your phosphate is way high. I'd find something that can drop that down below 0.1, but do it slowly. Seems odd your phosphate is that high and your nitrate that low.

I'd make sure my tests were accurate.

But to be honest, I never test these parameters on my RBTA tank, but I know my alk is not that high for sure. I bet my alk is probably around 7, because when I do water changes I get a little burst of coraline and then it disappears as the urchins eat it and doesn't grow again until I do another water change. But on my mixed reef, I keep my alk between 8 and 8.5, and phosphates under 0.1.

In the end, stability is most important.

Is it attached to the rock?

 

[outhouse]

I will take any advice

You dont want that, you want good advise.

You have 2 possible issues, water or lights. Most new people fry them with to much light, but for a new tank water looks suspect.

In your shoes I would do large water changes, to get it as clean a water as possible.

but first, what kind of light and how much intensity are you using.?

 

[agame2021]

Honestly I think it comes down to not having the mature bacteria and algae to keep the water stable… I know it sounds just like everyone says but I waited a while and 2 of my 4 are dead and the other 2 have disappeared. There was a crazy spike after both deaths and then they turned to jelly… I did water changes but then I got a bacteria bloom. It just seems to me like the bacteria and algae need time to grow in the tank for 8+ months unless you are using everything that has been live for atleast that long.
Furthermore I believe that water volume has a lot to do with it. Let’s say your live rock is started in a brute trash can. It becomes stable after 3-4 months and after 8 months you are ready to plop them into your tank and start filling it up with corals/fish. Well that rock has only cycled the volume of the trash cans water and will still need a little time to ramp up if it’s a bigger volume. Same with your tank and sump.

I decided not to add my sand at first and let my tank cycle for around 2.5 months. It was good and cycled and ready for some fish. Well I said I kinda want sand but I also want fish so I decided to get a fire fish and a fox face. Fox face ate all the hair algae and water stayed super clear. I thought well I don’t like seeing the bottom of my tank and I would love the look of sand. I throughly raised my used sand and put it in there. It was clear for 4 more weeks and then I started getting a second ugly stage… I felt like the rock had a good handle on the water and keeping it balanced however by adding sand I allowed a huge surface area for algae and bacteria to culture on. Now I had too much and went into a second ugly stage. Right before the 2nd ugly stage I had been offered 4 BTA’s for my soon to be harem tank. This looked great because it was right before all the problems with too much surface area. They did fine for about 3-4 weeks then slowly started dying.

since then I have seen that my zoa frag just keeps growing. My fish are doing alright and the bloom is still going. I have been dosing a competitive bacteria which lessened the bloom for a little bit but now it’s back up. I now see why they say wait! It’s easier to keep everything balanced when you slowly build or you wait a year.

this is just my opinion on what happened but I won’t be getting anything more until I can keep it well balanced and I can also prove balance over time! Not just with the testing. But hopefully with the stuff I am not able to test for like bacteria as well.

good luck with your reef!
Agame.

 

[JumpingFlea]

You dont want that, you want good advise.

You have 2 possible issues, water or lights. Most new people fry them with to much light, but for a new tank water looks suspect.

In your shoes I would do large water changes, to get it as clean a water as possible.

but first, what kind of light and how much intensity are you using.?

I suspect water, but I’m using NICREW 150 watts at 80% white and 60% blue.

Also I was talking about the High alk and low mag and cal on my monti thread. Trying to fix that without irritating the corals that are doing really well except the goni that is always closed.

 

[JumpingFlea]

Honestly I think it comes down to not having the mature bacteria and algae to keep the water stable… I know it sounds just like everyone says but I waited a while and 2 of my 4 are dead and the other 2 have disappeared. There was a crazy spike after both deaths and then they turned to jelly… I did water changes but then I got a bacteria bloom. It just seems to me like the bacteria and algae need time to grow in the tank for 8+ months unless you are using everything that has been live for atleast that long.
Furthermore I believe that water volume has a lot to do with it. Let’s say your live rock is started in a brute trash can. It becomes stable after 3-4 months and after 8 months you are ready to plop them into your tank and start filling it up with corals/fish. Well that rock has only cycled the volume of the trash cans water and will still need a little time to ramp up if it’s a bigger volume. Same with your tank and sump.

I decided not to add my sand at first and let my tank cycle for around 2.5 months. It was good and cycled and ready for some fish. Well I said I kinda want sand but I also want fish so I decided to get a fire fish and a fox face. Fox face ate all the hair algae and water stayed super clear. I thought well I don’t like seeing the bottom of my tank and I would love the look of sand. I throughly raised my used sand and put it in there. It was clear for 4 more weeks and then I started getting a second ugly stage… I felt like the rock had a good handle on the water and keeping it balanced however by adding sand I allowed a huge surface area for algae and bacteria to culture on. Now I had too much and went into a second ugly stage. Right before the 2nd ugly stage I had been offered 4 BTA’s for my soon to be harem tank. This looked great because it was right before all the problems with too much surface area. They did fine for about 3-4 weeks then slowly started dying.

since then I have seen that my zoa frag just keeps growing. My fish are doing alright and the bloom is still going. I have been dosing a competitive bacteria which lessened the bloom for a little bit but now it’s back up. I now see why they say wait! It’s easier to keep everything balanced when you slowly build or you wait a year.

this is just my opinion on what happened but I won’t be getting anything more until I can keep it well balanced and I can also prove balance over time! Not just with the testing. But hopefully with the stuff I am not able to test for like bacteria as well.

good luck with your reef!
Agame.

Oh for more info it’s a 150 gallon with 40 out of 110 pounds of rock that was used in my 55 reef for 3 months. I have a foxface, wrasses, powder blue, scopas, that are very new, 2 clownfish that don’t seems to have any interest in the anemone and a Wyoming white that hosted a fake anemone in QT but has not shown interest in the real one in the DT. I have a Starry Blenny that loves hanging next to it and sometimes just rubs against it. I have water ready for a water change but the salinity is a little low so trying to fix that. I haven’t been able to feed it because it lived inside of a rock for the 2 weeks and just recently started to come out and do this.

 

[agame2021]

Oh for more info it’s a 150 gallon with 40 out of 110 pounds of rock that was used in my 55 reef for 3 months. I have a foxface, wrasses, powder blue, scopas, that are very new, 2 clownfish that don’t seems to have any interest in the anemone and a Wyoming white that hosted a fake anemone in QT but has not shown interest in the real one in the DT. I have a Starry Blenny that loves hanging next to it and sometimes just rubs against it. I have water ready for a water change but the salinity is a little low so trying to fix that. I haven’t been able to feed it because it lived inside of a rock for the 2 weeks and just recently started to come out and do this.

Feeding it now will only stress it out. IMO don’t try feeding it in its weakened state because it takes far more energy to digest food than it does to heal and use the sugars from its bacteria coating slime. From how I see it you have 2 options, you can either keep it and watch it and try and stabilize the tank to the best of your ability. Or you can pass it onto someone else who has a more stable tank until your tank is ready. I think the next 2-3 weeks will be able to help you gauge which would be best for the anemone.

 

[outhouse]

NICREW

not a good light for nems, but im still going with water quality

 

[agame2021]

not a good light for nems, but im still going with water quality

What brand should I get for nems then?

 

[jt8791]

Probably loads of lighting options that would work. Good in between option that won’t break the bank are the reefbreeders photon line, 3w and 5w leds. Ideal seems to be 5w Cree leds but a mixture of 3w and 5w is better than most budget lighting. If your budget is tight there’s always the black boxes, not sure which leds they run or the quality and longevity.

Gets tricky mixing nems and corals, betting a new tank will make it even more complicated. Should probably do some consistent water changes to get your parameters in line but you might have to dose nitrates after. I have read 5-10 seems to be best range for bta’s.

 

[Duncan62]

I put my RBTA in a 2 week old tank, and it's now going on a year and a half. But my parameters were always stable and I'm not trying to keep other corals alive with it. The entire tank was just anemone and 2 clownfish.

What other livestock do you have? Do you have any clownfish that are trying to get hosted by it? Sometimes they can irritate smaller ones.

As for your water parameters, Do you have corals or anything to justify the 10.2 ALK? I'd be dropping that to between 8 and 8.5. I let me alk get up to 10 on my reef tank once and it was not good for many corals. All of them are happy in the 8 - 8.5 range. And your magnesium seems kind of low, especially for an alk that high to me.

Your phosphate is way high. I'd find something that can drop that down below 0.1, but do it slowly. Seems odd your phosphate is that high and your nitrate that low.

I'd make sure my tests were accurate.

But to be honest, I never test these parameters on my RBTA tank, but I know my alk is not that high for sure. I bet my alk is probably around 7, because when I do water changes I get a little burst of coraline and then it disappears as the urchins eat it and doesn't grow again until I do another water change. But on my mixed reef, I keep my alk between 8 and 8.5, and phosphates under 0.1.

In the end, stability is most important.

Is it attached to the rock?

Splitting? The first rbta I got looked like that before he split. Just watch him.

 

[tjohnson3]

not a good light for nems, but im still going with water quality

Have to disagree here... I run the same light on my nem tank. I even have the 50W version on my 13.5 over my black widow…

having “been there done that” with nems in the past, I’m 100% going with water quality/stability here. If it was the lighting, it would either move to a darker spot if it was too much, or climb to the top to try and reach it if it weren’t enough. Nems need an established system… by that I mean closer to a year than 6 months. I agree with comments above that you need to get this guy out of that tank into an established system until yours is if you want it to survive.

 

[Duncan62]

Have to disagree here... I run the same light on my nem tank. I even have the 50W version on my 13.5 over my black widow…

having “been there done that” with nems in the past, I’m 100% going with water quality/stability here. If it was the lighting, it would either move to a darker spot if it was too much, or climb to the top to try and reach it if it weren’t enough. Nems need an established system… by that I mean closer to a year than 6 months. I agree with comments above that you need to get this guy out of that tank into an established system until yours is if you want it to survive.

Good advice. tjohnson3 has a nice nem.
Nice collection of favorites with nem. Very pretty.

 

[JumpingFlea]

Have to disagree here... I run the same light on my nem tank. I even have the 50W version on my 13.5 over my black widow…

having “been there done that” with nems in the past, I’m 100% going with water quality/stability here. If it was the lighting, it would either move to a darker spot if it was too much, or climb to the top to try and reach it if it weren’t enough. Nems need an established system… by that I mean closer to a year than 6 months. I agree with comments above that you need to get this guy out of that tank into an established system until yours is if you want it to survive.

I will be doing a water change later today to try to help restore the levels a bit. I have a friend at my lfs with a 300 gallon established tank, so hopefully, he can hold on to it. Until then, what else can I do for him?

 

[JumpingFlea]

Here he is this morning. Hard to get a picture of him. He’s in an awkward angle

 

[Duncan62]

Here he is this morning. Hard to get a picture of him. He’s in an awkward angle

I think he might be OK. Looks like he's found a hole he likes. The look terrible when splitting. Hope he's OK.

 

[Jekyl]

I'd agree to get the nitrate up. As far as looking horrible during splits, I've never seen that with my nems.

 

[JumpingFlea]

I'd agree to get the nitrate up. As far as looking horrible during splits, I've never seen that with my nems.

How can I get my nitrates up? More feeding?

 

[agame2021]

Have to disagree here... I run the same light on my nem tank. I even have the 50W version on my 13.5 over my black widow…

having “been there done that” with nems in the past, I’m 100% going with water quality/stability here. If it was the lighting, it would either move to a darker spot if it was too much, or climb to the top to try and reach it if it weren’t enough. Nems need an established system… by that I mean closer to a year than 6 months. I agree with comments above that you need to get this guy out of that tank into an established system until yours is if you want it to survive.

Well they all went into hiding… then one was trying to get to the light. Then one detached and hit the powerhead when I wasn’t home. I got a covering for it and then somehow another one found away to get caught in it still.
Those two didn’t recover. Since then my tank has been a nightmare! I can not even find the other two now… maybe hiding in the rock?! Anyways I learned my lesson and have decided to wait a long while to introduce another anemone. This being because weekly water changes weren’t enough at 30 gallons to keep it stable with the bacteria bloom that happened and also the algae outbreak.