another apex flaw? is it a money grab? lets talk about that

ddc0715

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allow me to set the tone of this thread with the following image. is the neptune apex flawed when wanting to add more tanks to one unit?

1674058687559.png

1674058584423.png
I have three tanks, a reef tank, a fowlr tank and my wife’s new Epyllia tank. I also have a full apex already, which includes

4 dos pumps, a ddr, breakout box, 3 eb's and so on, good system love it. I LOVE IT SO MUCH. Its time to add temp, orp, sal and ph monitoring to my wifes 6 month old Euphyllia tank, which is in the another room, right across a hallway, next to my reef tank room and current apex.. it seems that the only way to do this is to buy another apex...after a lot of research on how to do this I find the only presented solution is stupid/unpractical and lacking merit… what is that solution? Buy all four probes and two pm1 modules and one pm2 modules WHATTTTTTT that’s nuts.

Since I already have one APEX that can be expand 100 different ways from Sunday and three tanks. logic says; combine all three tanks into one controller SIMPLE SIMPLE SIMPLE. concept.. I could have 10 eb’s, 10 dos pumps, etc. we can have ALLLL that, for multiple tanks, but we cannot have just 4 additional probes per tank? I mean why?

You see, the only way to achieve my goal of adding only temp, orp, sal and ph monitoring to my wife’s office tank, using one apex, is, again; to buy all four probes and two pm1 modules and one pm2 modules. this valid work around, would cost almost as much as a new apex, 760.97 to be exact and provide me 1 sal port, 1ph port, 1 orp port and 3, COUNT THEM 3 temp ports. I do not need three temp ports. someone may. not me.

Marketing of the apex leads us to believe that the apex is supposed to be the only controller (not controllers) you need. With addon’s galore... clearly this is and is not true, some say its capitalism. that’s fair. I am not a fan of capitalism (I’m not a dem either) I believe it’s a hush hush secret (lets force hobbyist into buying more apex units as a whole) like I said --- capitalism----- they know it, people dont question it and follow along it’s a dirty secret in my opinion and most just accept it as the way it is. I don’t. I think is bs. IF THEY ARE TRULY ALL ABOUT MAKING THE HOBBIST LIFE EASIER why put us in this position just to add temp, orp, sal and ph monitoring to each addtional tank we have ata higher price.

So, I would like to debate WHY this problems exists? why are they pushing use to buy additional apex’s just to monitor 4 (only 4) items (ph, temp, orp, sal), that a new apex offers? Did you buy another apex just to monitor these 4 things on your tank?if so did you think that was the right thing to do? (sorry have to be blunt) aka keeping it 100.
 
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dlsorensen

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Wow! I never really thought of this until recently since I only had 1 tank. I am getting ready to set up a frag system though and have been thinking about how I am going to monitor it. It pretty much comes down to either I buy another Apex or look into Hydros.
 
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ddc0715

ddc0715

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switching is sound advice im several 1000's in so switching is not an option.... finding solutions is appreciated thanks, but not really the point of this thread. debating the existance of this apex flaw/problem is the subject matter.
 

Enderg60

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I ran into the same problem and completely agree. I have 3 systems I wanted on my apex.

Ended up being cheaper and easier to setup to just get a used apex head unit rather than the multiple PM's.

How hard would it be to just have a "Probe" block. Why make me spend $100 or more, plus the probe itself, for each extra probe I want to use?

It is 100% capitalism at its finest. Each part isnt tooooo expensive, but when you need to get 30 extra modules and probes its just stupid.

Im honestly surprised they put the new FMM ports in the A3 Apex.
 

Cthulukelele

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allow me to set the tone of this thread with the following image

1674058687559.png

1674058584423.png
I have three tanks, a reef tank, a fowlr tank and my wife’s new Epyllia tank. I also have a full apex already, which includes

4 dos pumps, a ddr, breakout box, 3 eb's and so on, good system love it. I LOVE IT SO MUCH. Its time to add temp, orp, sal and ph monitoring to my wifes 6 month old Euphyllia tank, which is in the another room, right across a hallway, next to my reef tank room and current apex.. it seems that the only way to do this is to buy another apex...after a lot of research on how to do this I find the only presented solution is stupid/unpractical and lacking merit… what is that solution? Buy all four probes and two pm1 modules and one pm2 modules WHATTTTTTT that’s nuts.

Since I already have one APEX that can be expand 100 different ways from Sunday and three tanks. logic says; combine all three tanks into one controller SIMPLE SIMPLE SIMPLE. concept.. I could have 10 eb’s, 10 dos pumps, etc. we can have ALLLL that, for multiple tanks, but we cannot have just 4 additional probes per tank? I mean why?

You see, the only way to achieve my goal of adding only temp, orp, sal and ph monitoring to my wife’s office tank, using one apex, is, again; to buy all four probes and two pm1 modules and one pm2 modules. this valid work around, would cost almost as much as a new apex, 760.97 to be exact and provide me 1 sal port, 1ph port, 1 orp port and 3, COUNT THEM 3 temp ports. I do not need three temp ports. someone may. not me.

Marketing of the apex leads us to believe that the apex is supposed to be the only controller (not controllers) you need. With addon’s galore... clearly this is and is not true, some say its capitalism. that’s fair. I am not a fan of capitalism (I’m not a dem either) I believe it’s a hush hush secret (lets force hobbyist into buying more apex units as a whole) like I said --- capitalism----- they know it, people dont question it and follow along it’s a dirty secret in my opinion and most just accept it as the way it is. I don’t. I think is bs. IF THEY ARE TRULY ALL ABOUT MAKING THE HOBBIST LIFE EASIER why put us in this position just to add temp, orp, sal and ph monitoring to each addtional tank we have ata higher price.

So, I would like to debate WHY this problems exists? why are they pushing use to buy additional apex’s just to monitor 4 (only 4) items (ph, temp, orp, sal), that a new apex offers? Did you buy another apex just to monitor these 4 things on your tank?if so did you think that was the right thing to do? (sorry have to be blunt) aka keeping it 100.
Once you're locked into somebody's architecture they're going to do whatever they can to milk you. Simple as that.

Also liked for the Good Mythical Morning image lol
 

_AV

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We buy subsidized printers and spend a small fortune on cartridges. We buy subsidized game consoles and spend a small fortune on games. Addons always cost more. That's where the money is.
There was certainly a careful consideration given to the selection of Apex modules to maximize the profit.

Hey, at least they haven't switched yet to a monthly subscription model to use their equipment.
 
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ddc0715

ddc0715

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Once you're locked into somebody's architecture they're going to do whatever they can to milk you. Simple as that.

Also liked for the Good Mythical Morning image lol
GMM RULES. i wanted to insure that people did not view this as an attack on neptune by using them to set the mood, hopefully weed out the ones that would call me a hater, i want to draw in a unbias problem solving audience.
 

Tamberav

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We buy subsidized printers and spend a small fortune on cartridges. We buy subsidized game consoles and spend a small fortune on games. Addons always cost more. That's where the money is.
There was certainly a careful consideration given to the selection of Apex modules to maximize the profit.

Hey, at least they haven't switched yet to a monthly subscription model to use their equipment.

Do not give them ideas... if they start a monthly subscription, I am out. Apex can go find a new home.
 

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If it had the ability to process the data from that many probes it would be twice the size and cost more. Computers that do more cost more. The logical solution is offer expansion modules for the 1 in 10 reefers that want that rather than build the base unit to do so.
 
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ddc0715

ddc0715

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If it had the ability to process the data from that many probes it would be twice the size and cost more.
it does have that ability for everything but these 4 items imo why do they offer so many add ons if it did not have that ability. they tell you all time just plug it in, plug this in plug that end etc.
 

spsick

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it does have that ability for everything but these 4 items imo why do they offer so many add ons if it did not have that ability. they tell you all time just plug it in, plug this in plug that end etc.
Right but the module board essentially processes the data for the apex to understand. The base Apex has the modules built in for 3 probes.
 
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ddc0715

ddc0715

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Right but the module board essentially processes the data for the apex to understand. The base Apex has the modules built in for 3 probes.
right right right. so whats your theroy on why they can make modules for two probes but not one for all four?sure it would be beef in size but smaller then the head unit
 

Steven Garland

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Or just get PinPoint monitors. Probably just as much if not more to add to the Apex with the modules,probes ect ect.

Ph- $90-$110 ($77-$94 on sale right now)
Salinity- $140 ($118 on sale right now)
Temp- $25 ($21 on sale right now)
ORP- $115 ($97 on sale right now

Just the 3 probes alone from Apex are more than the listed above. Plus not having the need for wifi and all that is a super plus. And run on 9V batteries so no need for a extra power bar or using needed plug spots up.
 
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vetteguy53081

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Preface... I'm am a big fan of the Neptune Apex!

I agree the lack of a "Additional Tank Expansion Module" is a flaw... from your perspective. But I suspect a very large percentage of there customer base will never feel this is a limitation. How many could they sell? Once you add up the cost of design, production tooling, and parts, then factory in the low sales volume it might cost more than a base unit.

Also, there is often a limitation in new product resource, if you have given amount of time and money for development and a list of possible new products, you are going to work on the highest volume/most profitable ones first.

I only have one (saltwater) tank, and I certainly would like to see many other things before an "ATE" Module.
 

Sean Clark

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Not a solution but just wishful thinking:
We need a SSM separate system module.
This would be a module that would do a few main things.
1. It would provide pH, orp, salinity, and temp for a separate system (maybe sold as a kit with all probes) that plugs into your current setup like any other module.
2. It would identify that module and anything connected beyond it as a separate system on the aquabus network and in Fusion (up until it sees another SSM which would become the third system on the network.

This "should" be cheaper for the user and help with managing multiple systems within Fusion. Maybe you could select each system separately in Fusion much like if you had multiple Apex heads.

Just daydreaming.
 

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