Calcium reactor, which one?

[Davileet]

Wanting to purchase a calcium reactor for my 250g reef tank. Seems there is a lot of information to wrap my head around to make a good informed decision, and I feel somewhat lost in the nuances. Just looking for some advice.

I have stumbled across these automatic calcium reactors, which seem great in theory but the price is high and some users have had trouble getting these things fine tuned enough to stop alarming and behave nicely. Dastaco seems to be the only option of an auto carx at this time since Deltect 1500 is oos.

Standard reactors have a lower price points, but require fiddling with alk output for a bit. Geo seems to very popular, along with Tunze and Korralin. I think Lifereef or Avast could be a good option as well. Is there so little differences between these that it won't matter much which is chosen as they will all give simular results?

Is using a calcium reactor going to lower display tank pH so a CO2 scrubber or stirrer is going to be a necessity?
Also, I have never gotten on board with Apex, is now going to be the time I am forced to get a controller so that I can keep a constant eye on pH?
Is the $1k price difference between auto and standard carx worth it?

Any input is appreciated, thanks

 

[KrisReef]

You are on the right track. How much money do you have to spend? The lower end options combined with a Milwaukee pH controller and Bubble doser and Kamoer feed pump will work very well.

All options require diligence at setup, to verify that they are working correctly.

The basic reactor is a sealed tube with ports for in-out purposes. Not much to them if you control the CO2 & Water flow separately.

HTh

 

[Dburr1014]

Wanting to purchase a calcium reactor for my 250g reef tank. Seems there is a lot of information to wrap my head around to make a good informed decision, and I feel somewhat lost in the nuances. Just looking for some advice.

I have stumbled across these automatic calcium reactors, which seem great in theory but the price is high and some users have had trouble getting these things fine tuned enough to stop alarming and behave nicely. Dastaco seems to be the only option of an auto carx at this time since Deltect 1500 is oos.

Standard reactors have a lower price points, but require fiddling with alk output for a bit. Geo seems to very popular, along with Tunze and Korralin. I think Lifereef or Avast could be a good option as well. Is there so little differences between these that it won't matter much which is chosen as they will all give simular results?

Is using a calcium reactor going to lower display tank pH so a CO2 scrubber or stirrer is going to be a necessity?
Also, I have never gotten on board with Apex, is now going to be the time I am forced to get a controller so that I can keep a constant eye on pH?
Is the $1k price difference between auto and standard carx worth it?

Any input is appreciated, thanks

I look at it this way, it's daunting at first but once you do it it's very easy.
I've never had one of those automatic ones that you're talking about but I don't think you need one of them. There's plenty of videos and information here on how to set up a calcium reactor. I recommend you get a dual stage regulator if you do get one. Jda is on here at Reef to Reef he is a master at setting up calcium reactors and there's a thread on how to do it. You can always reach out to him if you have troubles.

 

[Davileet]

Well, I am the type of person who has always held the belief of crying once and buying once. I can make any option work with my budget, just want to make sure whatever I get it will be the product I want long term.

I was thinking that a simple pH monitor like a Milwuakee will be sufficient as my understanding is that I probably shouldn't use a controller to turn the thing on and off if its dialed in right anyway. It does seem the more I look at these things, the simpler it is appearing.

I think I might swing for a Geo. Is it worth having a secondary reaction chamber or is that more of a gimmicky kind of thing?

 

[Davileet]

I look at it this way, it's daunting at first but once you do it it's very easy.
I've never had one of those automatic ones that you're talking about but I don't think you need one of them. There's plenty of videos and information here on how to set up a calcium reactor. I recommend you get a dual stage regulator if you do get one. Jda is on here at Reef to Reef he is a master at setting up calcium reactors and there's a thread on how to do it. You can always reach out to him if you have troubles.

Thank you. I will look into this as I think it will be a better option than the carbon doser which seems to have a short lifespan for the cost, at least for some users.

And yes, it does seem very daunting

 

[Snoopy 67]

Started a conversation with you.

 

[HuduVudu]

Some thoughts:

Don't use a pH probe they are an unecessary expensive. Measuring effluent is easy and provides precision for tuning. Also pH probes will tempt you into closed loop automation. Resist this temptation it is dangerous because probes drift and ultimately fail by drifting too much. Probes do not fail catastrophically. This can lead to so really poor outcomes. For reference your effluent should be ~25dKH

Changing over the media in a reactor should not be a take down experience. Sadly many reactors including mine (Koralline) work this way. Geo seems to get this and I think this is why to some extent they are popular.

When a tank is low demand you will be adjust at a particular rate and as the tank ramps up demand you can get into a very weird situation where it seems like you are making huge adjustments just to keep up. You need to have a doser and regulator that will deal with this situation. You can use any doser. You don't have to use a continous doser. And IME most dosers easily push through the reactor.

Use a solenoid with your regulator. You want the solenoid to ensure that when the power goes out the CO2 shuts off. Do not keep the solenoid on a constant duty cycle or even a fast duty cycle like the carbon doser. this will just burn out the solenoid and provide a ton of heat under your tank. I run mine at 2 seconds on 5 minutes off. I have room in the on time and the off cycle to get a good adjustment for how much CO2 I am pushing.

Regulators suck ... ALL OF THEM. The problem is that the CaRx has no back pressure to really engage needle valves and other limiting devices. This makes fiddling with them a giant pain. I am working on this problem myself and I am in process for using a wood wafer sandwhiched between two fittings to provide back pressure to the regulator to give some real control over the output.

CaRxs are definitely the way to go, but they can be frustrating. Just know that up front.

 

[Davileet]

Some thoughts:

Don't use a pH probe they are an unecessary expensive. Measuring effluent is easy and provides precision for tuning. Also pH probes will tempt you into closed loop automation. Resist this temptation it is dangerous because probes drift and ultimately fail by drifting too much. Probes do not fail catastrophically. This can lead to so really poor outcomes. For reference your effluent should be ~25dKH

Changing over the media in a reactor should not be a take down experience. Sadly many reactors including mine (Koralline) work this way. Geo seems to get this and I think this is why to some extent they are popular.

When a tank is low demand you will be adjust at a particular rate and as the tank ramps up demand you can get into a very weird situation where it seems like you are making huge adjustments just to keep up. You need to have a doser and regulator that will deal with this situation. You can use any doser. You don't have to use a continous doser. And IME most dosers easily push through the reactor.

Use a solenoid with your regulator. You want the solenoid to ensure that when the power goes out the CO2 shuts off. Do not keep the solenoid on a constant duty cycle or even a fast duty cycle like the carbon doser. this will just burn out the solenoid and provide a ton of heat under your tank. I run mine at 2 seconds on 5 minutes off. I have room in the on time and the off cycle to get a good adjustment for how much CO2 I am pushing.

Regulators suck ... ALL OF THEM. The problem is that the CaRx has no back pressure to really engage needle valves and other limiting devices. This makes fiddling with them a giant pain. I am working on this problem myself and I am in process for using a wood wafer sandwhiched between two fittings to provide back pressure to the regulator to give some real control over the output.

CaRxs are definitely the way to go, but they can be frustrating. Just know that up front.

I appreciate this write up. When you say needing to have a doser and regulator to deal with demand that isn't being kept up, what do you mean specifically about the regulator?

Do you have a particular solenoid that you recommend? What are you using to control this?

Seems that dual regulators are popular, do these have the same issue with back pressure?

 

[oldmonk]

Hello
I am not the right person to tell you which one to buy as i don't use one , but it would be my humble request to you to stay away from Pacific Sun line of calcium reactors, even if you are getting it at a steal price.

I am seeing my friend break his head over this brand since the time he got one and still it's not working as intended.

Thanks

 

[HuduVudu]

When you say needing to have a doser and regulator to deal with demand that isn't being kept up, what do you mean specifically about the regulator?

What you find with the regulator is this. You have two modes for the CO2 1 bubble or so per second and 1000 bubbles per second with quite literally nothing in between worse still this happens with the most miniscule of turn on the metering/needle valve.

So if your demand goes up you don't have a lot of room with the regulator to get a bubble count that you might want. The soleniod helps immensely with this.

Do you have a particular solenoid that you recommend?

I just got mine off of EBay. It is important that you match the voltage with your power source and that your power source can handle the wattage. The wattage issue isn't usually a problem because the solenoids are pretty low consumers.

What are you using to control this?

I use a RobTank with ReefPi. Most controllers will have a DC port that you can use to controll with. Also if you get a controller that doesn't then you can buy a wall power supply of the correct voltage and splice the soleniod onto that. Connecting the soleniod to a power supply allows you to use a wall time to control. This is a less than desirable outcome because of the long on duty cycle but it is doable if you don't have a controller. If you do it this way you will probably be picking up soleniods more frequently.

Seems that dual regulators are popular, do these have the same issue with back pressure?

Yes. Dual regulators take the 900 or so psi down to 20 or so psi. If you have ever seen 20 psi on an open hose you will know that this is not very desirable when you are trying to get a certain bubble count. Metering valves or needle valves help some but they still don't fix the problem. One of the things you run into is that if you do manage to get the count you are looking for it ends up drifting because you have cut the orifices down so low that any debris will easily clog the it. So the situation is that you set it where you want it and two days later the CO2 flow either slows down but most likely just stops.

I set my bubble count pretty high so I don't run into this situation and can get a semi-consisten bubble flow. Then I use the soleniod to get the average count that I am looking for. TBF I just move the off cycle on the CO2 and then measure the effluent until I get in the 25 dKH range.

 

[Davileet]

What you find with the regulator is this. You have two modes for the CO2 1 bubble or so per second and 1000 bubbles per second with quite literally nothing in between worse still this happens with the most miniscule of turn on the metering/needle valve.

So if your demand goes up you don't have a lot of room with the regulator to get a bubble count that you might want. The soleniod helps immensely with this.


I just got mine off of EBay. It is important that you match the voltage with your power source and that your power source can handle the wattage. The wattage issue isn't usually a problem because the solenoids are pretty low consumers.


I use a RobTank with ReefPi. Most controllers will have a DC port that you can use to controll with. Also if you get a controller that doesn't then you can buy a wall power supply of the correct voltage and splice the soleniod onto that. Connecting the soleniod to a power supply allows you to use a wall time to control. This is a less than desirable outcome because of the long on duty cycle but it is doable if you don't have a controller. If you do it this way you will probably be picking up soleniods more frequently.


Yes. Dual regulators take the 900 or so psi down to 20 or so psi. If you have ever seen 20 psi on an open hose you will know that this is not very desirable when you are trying to get a certain bubble count. Metering valves or needle valves help some but they still don't fix the problem. One of the things you run into is that if you do manage to get the count you are looking for it ends up drifting because you have cut the orifices down so low that any debris will easily clog the it. So the situation is that you set it where you want it and two days later the CO2 flow either slows down but most likely just stops.

I set my bubble count pretty high so I don't run into this situation and can get a semi-consisten bubble flow. Then I use the soleniod to get the average count that I am looking for. TBF I just move the off cycle on the CO2 and then measure the effluent until I get in the 25 dKH range.

Thank you for the clarification, I really appreciate the information.

 

[gill7784]

I've used an older Vertex and now a Reef Octopus. The Reef Octopus is much easier to tune with its DC pump. Honestly, the whole system is pretty simple once you determine consumption. I don't particularly care what my pH is... I just adjust it to get an effluent that keeps my parameters stable. Once I know that value, I set my CO2 rate to rarely trigger the solenoid.

All this stuff is beside my tank hidden under a wooden cover and doubles as my work surface.