Can a DT really be disease-free?

Humblefish

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We've all heard it said, "Every tank has ich." And sometimes it does almost seem inevitable. o_O However, the truth is no new tank comes preinstalled with ich. ;) Cryptocaryon irritans aka "ich" is a ciliate protozoa that is either brought in on an infected fish or from water, rock, coral, etc. that was taken from an ich-infested environment. Let's break down all the different ways a disease can be introduced into your DT:
  1. A fish carrying parasites or worms - the most common way. And just like germs on another person's hand, parasites/worms cannot always be seen on a fish.
  2. Parasite tomonts or "eggs" encysted on a coral or invert. Parasites actually reproduce "off fish" - tomonts will stick to almost any hard surface, whether it's an SPS frag or exoskeleton of a shrimp.
  3. Aerosol transmission by housing DT & QT too close together: https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/aerosol-transmission.190292/
  4. Cross contamination by sharing equipment, hoses, feeding apparatus, etc. between two tanks. Anything wet (including your hands) can transport free swimming parasites from one tank to another.
  5. Water. How many of you are still buying SW from a LFS? The same LFS that is notorious for harboring diseases in their system. Do you really think LFS employees think twice before sticking their hand in a tank and then putting that same hand in the SW vat? :eek:
So as you can see, there are alternative explanations for how a disease can be introduced into an aquarium other than seeming to appear out of thin air. :D All tanks start out disease-free, unless it is "inherited" by using rock, sand, water, equipment, etc. from an already infected system. It must be "introduced" in some way - just like pods won't magically appear in your tank without a source (rock, chaeto, bottle of pods).

What about bacterial infections?

When you cut yourself, you apply a topical antiseptic or antibiotic to ward off the possibility of infection. Unfortunately, this isn't a very practical thing to do when a fish gets cut, stung or otherwise damaged. (Although there is a product called Bio-Bandage for just this purpose.) Unfortunately, the possibility always exists of a cut or wound getting infected. Fortunately, most harmful bacteria found in your tank water will be gram-positive bacteria, and these can be kept at bay by a healthy fish's natural immune system. Gram negative bacterial infections are usually only seen on new wild caught fish, which hopefully are in QT before being added to your DT. ;) Some gram-negative bacteria can even be spread to humans (like vibrio) so be mindful of that when working in the QT. :eek:

More info on bacterial infections here: https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/tank-terror-bacterial-infections-in-the-reef-tank.22/

So, can a DT really be disease-free then? Yes, but it is not easy. Knowing disease can only be introduced by a foreign source, you must do everything in your power to prevent that from happening:

#1 QT all new fish purchases, even your very first one: https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/how-to-quarantine.232/

#2 ISOLATE all new coral/invert purchases for 76 days in a fishless environment: https://www.reef2reef.com/ams/how-to-quarantine-coral-and-inverts.228/

#3 Aerosol transmission is a real thing! So, observe a 10 foot radius when housing any QT from your DT. It's also a good idea to do the same for separate QT systems.

#4 Be paranoid about cross contamination! Each tank should have its own dedicated equipment, water change hose, feeding apparatus, etc. Don't "share" anything between tanks without properly sterilizing it first.

#5 Make your own water! Cross contamination is just another reason to buy your own RODI, and not rely upon a LFS for freshly mixed SW. :rolleyes:
 

Kershaw

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I just wanted to say @Humblefish thank for continuing to beat this horse to death. It seems like know Matter how much this is talked about people still think ich is somthing you have to live with. It's not it can be cured. Although I do not practice ich eradication I hope one day I do. I believe my tank is ich free at the moment due the fact my tank has been up for 2.5. Years with no signs of ich I am aware it could show any moment with any new addition. I am tiered of hearing about all the instant in tank cures. Either practice good qt or deal with ich management, at the moment there are no other options
 

revhtree

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Great stuff as usual! I can't tell you how many times I have heard that you will always have ich or another disease in your tank.
 

roostertech

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I started out this hobby trying to have a disease free tank and try to put my fishes through TTM and QT. A few months in and an ich outbreak later I realize that I can't be as meticulous as it would require to be disease free and the process was too stressful to me. So I switched from prevention to management (feed tons of good food, keep them fat) and it has worked out better for me. I'm still QT new comer for at least 2 weeks to make sure they are eating well and put through rounds of prazi before introduction to DT. I think when picking strategy you have to be honest to yourself if you have the time/effort/diligence that it take to maintain a true disease free tank.
 

Jim C

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Since starfish do not have a hard surface, would one be risking anything by not quarantining them?
 
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Humblefish

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Since starfish do not have a hard surface, would one be risking anything by not quarantining them?

Tomonts cannot attach to urchins or starfish. However, you'd want to pour some tank water over it (and into a bucket to be discarded) to "wash away" any theronts which might have landed on it. OR you could just isolate it to a fishless environment for 48 hrs to be completely safe.
 

Jim C

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Tomonts cannot attach to urchins or starfish. However, you'd want to pour some tank water over it (and into a bucket to be discarded) to "wash away" any theronts which might have landed on it. OR you could just isolate it to a fishless environment for 48 hrs to be completely safe.
Is there risk of it carrying a bacterial infection?
 

MIchael10101

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If you aren't doing the tank transfer method, or mandatory 2 week copper dosing, can you be assured that crypto isn't on a fish? I've always thought that you didn't have to expose a quarantined fish to copper unless they are showing symptoms.
 

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If you aren't doing the tank transfer method, or mandatory 2 week copper dosing, can you be assured that crypto isn't on a fish? I've always thought that you didn't have to expose a quarantined fish to copper unless they are showing symptoms.

Some fish may be immune or not outwardly show symptoms, but still be able to infect others.
 
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Humblefish

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Is there risk of it carrying a bacterial infection?

Giving it a good rinse before placing in your DT should "wash away" any harmful free floating bacteria.

If you aren't doing the tank transfer method, or mandatory 2 week copper dosing, can you be assured that crypto isn't on a fish? I've always thought that you didn't have to expose a quarantined fish to copper unless they are showing symptoms.
Unfortunately, ich, velvet & flukes can harbor inside the gills out of sight. You may only notice the following behavioral symptoms:
  • Reduced or complete loss of appetite
  • Heavy breathing
  • Scratching/flashing
  • Head twitching/yawning (more a symptom of flukes)
  • Erratic swimming behavior
  • Swimming into the flow of a powerhead (unique to Marine Velvet Disease)
  • Acting reclusive (velvet causes fish to be sensitive to light)
 

ca1ore

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Conceptually yes, practically no. Some pathogens are going to be present. Whether there is active disease is a different question.
 

salty joe

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Tomonts cannot attach to urchins or starfish. However, you'd want to pour some tank water over it (and into a bucket to be discarded) to "wash away" any theronts which might have landed on it. OR you could just isolate it to a fishless environment for 48 hrs to be completely safe.

Would the same hold true for corals, assuming no frag plug?
 

JamesP

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If you aren't doing the tank transfer method, or mandatory 2 week copper dosing, can you be assured that crypto isn't on a fish? I've always thought that you didn't have to expose a quarantined fish to copper unless they are showing symptoms.
I think 4 weeks is recommended. I did 6 recently because im paranoid.
 

4FordFamily

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Well written writeup. I assure you folks it can be done, it's done in my system. It was in all of my systems:

The test?

Powder blue tangs or Achilles tangs. (Don't really use a fish to test but if it's there they'll be coated in a week or two)
 

justinm

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So is 76 days long enough for the fallow period? If I hold cupramine at .4 for 30 days and observe the remaining 46, I will be ich free?! I really want my system to be ich free! All fish are in HT now and I really want this as my end result.
 

chefjpaul

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Whats Ich? :D
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