Can't Figure Out Acros

[CoopsCoralReef]

Hey everyone. So, this is another one of your typical threads about not being able to keep acros healthy; a pearlberry I put in last Friday has had mesenterial filaments since (also has slight polyp extension). My pink lemonade frag appears to be STNing from the base. And in general colors are lost slowly.


A little about my tank. It's a Red Sea reefer 250 and has been setup for 10 months. Last August I added my first acros: a blue tenuis, garf bonsai, pearlberry, and SSC. All we're doing great and maintaining good coloration. At this time my Alk was 9-9.3, nitrates were 2ppm, phosphates .02, and temp ranged from 78-79. After a month of them doing great, I bought a frag pack from battlecorals. I had a few RTN within the first few days, but other than that, they did great too for the first few weeks.

At this time, I had hair algae that I wanted to reduce, so I began dosing NOPOX for 3 weeks. I didn't see any reduction of my algae, but did see a loss in color of my acros (as seen by the pearlberry pictures, good growth, loss of color).

I then discovered Vibrant, and started dosing it over the next few months. It worked, too well. Algae was gone, and my acros were gone. I had no nitrates, and no phosphates. So basically I was back at the start.

I added some potassium nitrate to up my nitrates to 2ppm, which has maintained, and increased fish feedings, which has brought phosphates up to 0.02. My Alk is now stable at 7.7-8 (test multiple times a week at different times). Temperature is the same. My lights are now 3 AI prime, and two T5 (coral+ and blue+), which were recently added. I also added a Gyre 230, so now I run 2 MP10s at 65% reef crest and the Gyre at 40% random.

In terms of husbandry, I perform weekly 5g water changes. At the same time, I change filter socks and add 5ml of Vibrant. About once a week I add 1.5ml of potassium nitrate. I also dose 5ml of vibrant in the middle of the week. I change carbon every month (Rox carbon).

Sorry for the long post. I'm just not sure what to do. I'm considering sending water in for Triton testing to see if I have anything going on with my water. Lighting and flow don't appear to be an issue. Alk is stable. Temp is stable. Any help would be appreciated!!

 

[Daniel@R2R]

#reefsquad #spsexperts

 

[TUSI]

Well I give it a try. From reading above I can think of few things. First when you had hair algae and started dosing nopox everything was good.,in my opinion your alk was a little high to dose nopox. I like doing it with stable alk at 7-8 dkh as what you have right now. Secondly your water temp seemed little to warm and fluctuating to much. 76-77 dog is what I keep mine steady with a chiller. If you are removing nitrates with a chemical just make sure that other chemicals that other dosing that might be doing don't interact with it. no pox is a carbon source so it won't hurt if you were to add some bacteria every two weeks or so. You killed everything cause it seemed that every thing got stripped and corals got stressed. One thing sps don't like is drastic changes. Keeping po .2 and nitrates 2 ppm I'm not sure that USA good ratio. Po at .10 with 2ppm nitrate is better and colors should be just as good maybe not as much polyp extension. Obviously every tank is different but if you move forward with sps again find an area of numbers a stick by it. Stability is the key. Good luck and keep reef ing we all learn together

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Stop dosing VIbrant. Stop using no pox
Remove algae manually or with grazers.

 

[Rick.45cal]

How much ROX carbon are you using. That stuff is SUPER agressive activated carbon. It might be too agressive.

 

[CoopsCoralReef]

Rick. I use about 3 tablespoons of Rox carbon and replace it every month.

Salty, I have considered stopping the Vibrant. I am getting a kole tang for algae control, although there isn't much now. My thought is the Vibrant may be having a negative impact on the zoo of the acros? I have attached a few pictures of one of my acros. It has purple/blue undertones, but is brown, and appears to be bleaching.

 

[CoopsCoralReef]

My parameters have been stable since January. Alk 7.7-8, temp 78-79, nitrate 2ppm, phosphates 0.02-0.04. My only other thought is that something may be leeching a metal into the tank.

 

[ws6kid]

Well I give it a try. From reading above I can think of few things. First when you had hair algae and started dosing nopox everything was good.,in my opinion your alk was a little high to dose nopox. I like doing it with stable alk at 7-8 dkh as what you have right now. Secondly your water temp seemed little to warm and fluctuating to much. 76-77 dog is what I keep mine steady with a chiller. If you are removing nitrates with a chemical just make sure that other chemicals that other dosing that might be doing don't interact with it. no pox is a carbon source so it won't hurt if you were to add some bacteria every two weeks or so. You killed everything cause it seemed that every thing got stripped and corals got stressed. One thing sps don't like is drastic changes. Keeping po .2 and nitrates 2 ppm I'm not sure that USA good ratio. Po at .10 with 2ppm nitrate is better and colors should be just as good maybe not as much polyp extension. Obviously every tank is different but if you move forward with sps again find an area of numbers a stick by it. Stability is the key. Good luck and keep reef ing we all learn together

I think the important thing is stability like Tusi stated. I personally test my alk numbers daily, with mag, nitrate, and po4 weekly. .02 po4 and nitrates around 5 is ideal for me running alk higher around 9.3. Alk is so important to test frequently as it is consumed more rapidly as corals grow and can cause a lot of damage with just a few point drop. It is so important to me that I test the bucket with new water for a water change to be sure it matches the 9.3 that I want in the tank. Also, saying that alk was measured at 7-8 again is a huge swing for most SPS. You need to keep it within a few points of your target all of the time.

For me, the additives like carbon dosing, mixed with running Rox carbon (I think ROX is too aggressive personally), filter socks, skimming, and vibrant, create too many variables that are unknown. Getting RTN out of the bag from most reputable guys like BC is probably from a stark difference in alk from their tank to yours. A .5 dkh instant change is enough to RTN most SPS. If he runs a 9 and you run a 7, that difference will kill a lot of stuff. Even drip acclimating for an hour probably is not enough to compensate for that amount of change.

My tank is 77-79 degrees throughout a day. I don't think that is the root of the issues, but once corals or fish are stressed, any small changes can cause more harm than usual.

Hope that helps!

 

[CoopsCoralReef]

I think the important thing is stability like Tusi stated. I personally test my alk numbers daily, with mag, nitrate, and po4 weekly. .02 po4 and nitrates around 5 is ideal for me running alk higher around 9.3. Alk is so important to test frequently as it is consumed more rapidly as corals grow and can cause a lot of damage with just a few point drop. It is so important to me that I test the bucket with new water for a water change to be sure it matches the 9.3 that I want in the tank. Also, saying that alk was measured at 7-8 again is a huge swing for most SPS. You need to keep it within a few points of your target all of the time.

For me, the additives like carbon dosing, mixed with running Rox carbon (I think ROX is too aggressive personally), filter socks, skimming, and vibrant, create too many variables that are unknown. Getting RTN out of the bag from most reputable guys like BC is probably from a stark difference in alk from their tank to yours. A .5 dkh instant change is enough to RTN most SPS. If he runs a 9 and you run a 7, that difference will kill a lot of stuff. Even drip acclimating for an hour probably is not enough to compensate for that amount of change.

My tank is 77-79 degrees throughout a day. I don't think that is the root of the issues, but once corals or fish are stressed, any small changes can cause more harm than usual.

Hope that helps!

This does help. However, my Alk only fluctuates by 0.3 dkh. I was testing daily until this was stabilized, and it has been stable since I introduced new acros; and now I test every few days, and before and after water changes (don't dose Alk on water change days). I will slow my Rox carbon reactor to a crawl, and stop dosing Vibrant and potassium nitrate.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Your aggressively removing nutrients and then dosing them back in.

 

[CoopsCoralReef]

Your aggressively removing nutrients and then dosing them back in.

Salty, are you referring to the Vibrant dosing and then adding potassium nitrate?

As I remember. My best growth and colors were before I started getting rid of algae. Nitrates were 2-4, phosphates were 0.04, and Alk was 8.8-9.1. This was last August

 

[Rick.45cal]

I'd continue to maintain your nutrients with KNO3 if you have to. That shouldn't be the cause of this problem.

 

[Rick.45cal]

I had vibrant do some very strange things to some of my acros. My WWC Blueberry fields acro (garf bonsai) had the same threads you describe after dosing vibrant. It systematically digested all of it's green polyps, then it digested a giant hole in the soft tissue on the frag. After stopping vibrant, it has since healed and is actively growing, and now is one of my favorite corals simply for how amazingly resiliant it is.

Just out of curiosity how are you testing your alkalinity? What test kits, and are you using a secondary kit occasionally to back up your readings?

 

[CoopsCoralReef]

I had vibrant do some very strange things to some of my acros. My WWC Blueberry fields acro (garf bonsai) had the same threads you describe after dosing vibrant. It systematically digested all of it's green polyps, then it digested a giant hole in the soft tissue on the frag. After stopping vibrant, it has since healed and is actively growing, and now is one of my favorite corals simply for how amazingly resiliant it is.

Just out of curiosity how are you testing your alkalinity? What test kits, and are you using a secondary kit occasionally to back up your readings?

Rick, I appreciate your help and have noticed this all started when I tried to eliminate algae. I use the Red Sea Alk test. I haven't used a second one to verify. This morning before adding 12ml of Alk solution (Red Sea B) it was 7.7. I tested an hour after adding and it was 8 dkh. I have done this numerous times and the results are consistent, although they could be higher or lower I'm sure. But the swing of 0.3 is alright, I would think?

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

Salty, are you referring to the Vibrant dosing and then adding potassium nitrate?

As I remember. My best growth and colors were before I started getting rid of algae. Nitrates were 2-4, phosphates were 0.04, and Alk was 8.8-9.1. This was last August

Yes. We know it reduces nutrints. I see no reason to continue if the algae is gone. I consider it an aggressive algae treatment and takes a systems nutrints out of balance.

So keep checking the nutrints as suggested but I would avoid methods that educe them

 

[CoopsCoralReef]

Thank you everyone for your inputs. I will stop dosing Vibrant; which should reduce the amount of KNO3 I need to add. I will add more fish if the nitrates begin to drop

I think one other issue may be my Alk. I had the best growth and color when it was at 9, and it seems that where most keep it at. The acros I got last week were kept at 9, so I can see that the 9 in the previous tank to 8 in my tank would cause stress. Which may be evident in my pearlberry having a lot of mesenterial filaments. I will slowly raise this up over the course of several weeks.

 

[mps026]

I added an enclosed refugium to my 50 gal and once the macroalgae started growing no nutrients left for the hair algae. This worked for me.

 

[CoopsCoralReef]

A quick update for anyone reading. My pearlberry has STN'd pretty severely. I don't think it's gonna make it. As has my red planet. I installed a BRS doser and am dosing Alk 10 times a day for one minute, at 1.85ml. Alk is stable at 8.5. I may add one additional dose during the night. It's quite frustrating seeing corals suffer and not being able to figure out why

 

[Maacc]

You don't run any GFO, do you? On the advice of Adam I took it off my tank and it took about 3 months or so but everything looks a lot happier. If you are stable, the next step would be to send some water off for a triton test.

 

[CoopsCoralReef]

No sir. I haven't ran GFO in at least six months. I am thinking a triton test may be next. All of my parameters are stable. 5 ppm NO3. 0.04 PO4. Calc 400. Mag 1360. Temp swings are less than 1F a day. More around 0.5. I don't expect Alk to swing by more than 0.2 or so now that I have an automatic doser. I run 4 T5 (2 Blue+ and 2 Coral+) and 3 AI Primes (run blues only on these). So I don't think lighting is an issue. 2 MP10s and a Gyre 230. I don't have any dead spots from what I can tell when I feed frozen food.