Can't figure out what exactly is wrong with my tank
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I used to have a hybrid aquatic life 48" fixture with 4 T5s and 2 ai primes. A few weeks ago I replaced it with the photon pro v2. I used a PAR meter to adjust the new light to the same levels as there used to be. Haven't noticed any reaction from the corals, so I tend to not suspect the light.
The nitrates are already pretty low, and I'm working on phosphates. I'd prefer eventually the refugium to export N and P rather than me doing water changes more often.
Regarding pH, my hope is to bring phosphates to the proper level (and maybe fix something else, which I don't know yet), add more corals, and once the Ca and Alk intake increases - I'll switch to Kalkwasser and it will fix the pH issue.
I really hate the idea of paying for media that only fixes the consequences of me breathing in the same room with the tank.
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dedragon
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i use all for reef powder right now because i am trying to cut down on all the stuff i used to dose (2 part plus red sea abcd before) now just all for reef and chaetogro and we will see in a month how the levels have changed (right now ca; 420 alk 8.2 mag 1280 phosphate .018 nitrate 5 ) im gonna use an icp test for it
Lavey29
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Just trying to help you understand why your corals are deteriorating quickly. If you are satisfied with lights and flow that only leaves water parameters and available nutrients. Your corals lack nitrates and your phosphate is slightly elevated. This is why new LPS corals struggle.
Spare time
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Given the realistic error range on kits, it could be 0. Typically tanks with very low nitrate numbers require daily feedings of the corals with appropriate food or very heavy fish feeding.
The paper I know of notes high phosphate creating very fragile skeletons in their study, but did not show visible health impacts on the coral https://www.sciencedirect.com/scien...ZsGPIlCa5sV1jLetQuU7nUq34s4JBmVBnRNLrr2FOmeBG
Spare time
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1. 1-2 is within the possible realistic range of error on a test kit (not sure which you are using). Corals in low nitrate tanks need feeding of the appropriate food or heavy fish feeding. This is why I prefer 5ppm nitrate just to be safe.
2. This below is a study on phosphate on an acro species and essentially says that elevated phosphate leads to brittle skeletons but doesn't seem to show distress in the coral
Effects of phosphate on growth and skeletal density in the scleractinian coral Acropora muricata: A controlled experimental approach
Phosphate contamination can negatively affect corals, modifying growth rates, skeletal density, reproduction, mortality, and zooxanthellae. We determi…
outhouse
Valuable Member
Its lights, or water quality period. I know your water is junk, algae tells me you dont know how to take care of the basics here. And a thriving chaeto tank tells me your water is nasty. if anyone tells you your water is to clean they dont know what the f their doing.
But first I want to know what intensity are you running those reefbreeders?
First thing I would do is a 50% water change with reef crystals, and stop adding anything to the tank unless its a little bit of vibrant. Your going to need to step up and do more changes, you cant cheat your way around this. I would also use a little GFO. what ever two part your using, stop and use much much less. you need a new start.
First thing is major water changes to get stability back with PH, and lower nitrates and phosphates, get rid of algae. you could probably run some fluconazole, followed by major water changes
Ive had my tank crash a few times, each time algae grows and coral starts to die. Only major water changes is your friend. You cant fix this without doing it, go buy a few 200g boxs of reef crystals, and use it.
make you water good again, so coral actually try jumping in your tank because its such a good home, it will be the opposite of what you have now.
outhouse
Valuable Member
Good possibility, I had the same carpet algae when my lights were set to high
It factually is also part of it. Its not just phosphates, there some chemical imbalances going on as well. id stop the red sea loyalty. There is no reason and they dont have the best long term reputation
outhouse
Valuable Member
With this right here, there is no way you have low nitrates and phosphates. I dont need test kits to figure this out.
this is possible evidence your intensity is set to high
I appreciate your willingness to help.
My point is, there are probably hundreds if not thousands of threads on this forum alone about the right levels of nitrates/phosphates/their ratios etc. There are successful tanks with nitrates as low as 0.5ppm as well as in the twenties and maybe higher. And that's why a bare statement like "Nitrate should be 5 to 10 for coral nutrition" without a supporting argument why this certain tank will benefit from having nitrates in the exact 5-10 range and not in the 1-2 range doesn't sound compelling, I'm sorry.
outhouse
Valuable Member
Yes, I doubt its what you really have. many test kits suck and give you information with little value
Yes and no, I see you have coralline algae, which a tank plagued with low PH does not always get like you have, which is a positive sign. Id still try and fix this with major water changes.
Yes it can
outhouse
Valuable Member
You are correct here. Its absurd and just not true. I have no detectable nitrates and phosphates and have amazing color and growth. This is a common theme that has been abused the last 5 years and spread like a rumor out of context. Only in the cleanest SPS tanks, and only the most minute small adjustments are made by the best people in the business of taking care of water, their water management skills are over what most in this hobby can do.
And even then they have perfect healthy coral, and their just looking for a slight increase in color and growth.
The trick which is not easy, is riding a very thin line between adding nitrates and phos and NOT having bad algae. Its danged tricky and not for the average guy growing softies. Ive been doing this for 30 years and its tricky for me, and id never add that crap to my tank. We feed our fish, thats more then enough.
I measured about 120-130 PAR on the bottom. I tend to attribute the algae carpet to higher nitrates (10+) and phosphates (up to 0.6) a few months ago.
I use the same salt and additives for my other 20-gallon tank, and there are no problems with coral growth. Although the other tank is 3 years old and I don't regularly track the numbers there.
BTW, I just recalled, the last time I measured phosphates in the other tank, it was ~0.35 too.
Note on test kits I use:
Ca - Red Sea + Salifert,
Alk - Red Sea,
Nitrates - Red Sea Nitrates Pro + Salifert,
Phosphates - Hanna phosphate, non-url (reagents expire in 2024),
pH - Apex (last calibrated a month ago).
I think I can trust every kit but phosphate, as I haven't tested the water with anything but Hanna.
Ca - Red Sea + Salifert,
Alk - Red Sea,
Nitrates - Red Sea Nitrates Pro + Salifert,
Phosphates - Hanna phosphate, non-url (reagents expire in 2024),
pH - Apex (last calibrated a month ago).
I think I can trust every kit but phosphate, as I haven't tested the water with anything but Hanna.
outhouse
Valuable Member
the measurement artificial, par does not always grow coral sometimes it cooks it. lots of ways for those to not be accurate, from one device to another, to testing conditions themselves. That is a lot of par for softies, thats good SPS par, and you have mainly fish in your tank. Turn that crap down.
I asked you a question trying to help you, I didnt ask for par numbers, I asked for intensity. Fk your stubborn and just like me, and you wont learn unless its the hard way. Better hope those numbers are wrong, cause thats too much light.
I have similar lights, and I had issues and problems like you for years, until I turned my lights down, and growth took off and the tank went from looking just like yours to a green full tanks of coral in 6 months. I swear to you 6 months ago I had that same algae only one inch deep everywhere.
I have ocean revives, they are similar colors and spread out like reefbreeders, and at 60 and 80% I had major issues like you are experiencing.
When i turned my lights down to 8% blue channel and 1% white, growth took off. when I say that I mean took off, like crazy good growth.
Par meters are great for SPS tanks, not so much for LPS, and I grow branching hammers professionally. Thats after buying 5 heads 30 years ago, and growing a few thousands heads since then off my first five.
I have had many tank crashes for separate reasons, high mag, dirty water, and lights to bright. It all can be cured by water changes and turning lights way the f down.
outhouse
Valuable Member
what good has all that testing done you? Your failing and have been doing so for a long time. its time to get out of your own head, cause yours is just screwing things up.
Stop testing and start changing water. Get 2 cheap garbage cans if you dont have them now or a 100g stock tank, and do a real change, a 70g change wont hurt
outhouse
Valuable Member
In 30 years I have battled every kind of algae, you have the same stuff I just beat, and I only had it once, and water changes did not get rid of it. You could do 100% water changes, its not going anywhere. That stuff is brutal, and even fluconazole did not kill it right away, nor did major water changes. Not your baby butt small water changes, real 100g changes, before and after fluconazole, and once my water got perfect I started using vibrant.
You do know, you can have perfect water, and if your lighting is jacked, your tank will grow algae?
I didnt even mess with adding two part for a few months, I did so many water changes my water was always fine, and for the few small pieces you have in a 100g tank, save two part for when you get your algae issues fixed
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