What the heck am I doing wrong with SPS?

[kdx7214]

First thing right off. I test my water weekly and the parameters are staying within the proper range according to reading a vast amount of stuff @Randy Holmes-Farley

I have Noopsyche LED lights, and a 2400gph gyre in the tank. Tank is two years old and is a 75g with 40g sump.

I've tried and tried for decades now and have never been able to keep them alive. What the heck am I doing wrong??

I've attached two pictures of the next likely fatality. It's a turbinaria. I didn't bother to get them under all white lights because they're doing the same thing all the others have, and nobody has had any suggestions other than "check your parameters" which is singularly unhelpful when they are in range and remain stable. You'll notice that something munched on the center, but the white areas around that are the part that continues to happen before they die.

 

[Viking_Reefing]

So…what are your parameters? A full tank shot generally also helps to get a better view of what’s going on.

 

[MoshJosh]

Assuming parameters are fine (though I do think it would be helpful to know them), it could be any number of things. My first though is, what munched it? and what came first, the munching or the dying? If there is something taking a bite out of your SPS it could killing them outright or stressing them enough that they die. What is your current stocking including CUC?

Also, do you know your PAR readings, or have a general guess based on manufacturer data?

Also, what is the flow like in the area where the SPS are dying? Your gyre may produce enough flow, but will depend heavily on scape and coral placement.

Have you done ICP testing and do you run carbon?

 

[fish farmer]

What other SPS have you tried?

Do they do ok for a bit or do they struggle from the start?

 

[Mr. Mojo Rising]

Do you know the par level? The coral seems pale, like it's losing colour, I question if it receives enough light?

And only one gyre in that big tank? I have 2 gyres (2k each) in my 40 breeder.

As you say, all params are in line, so that leaves light and flow.

 

[BOYERZ]

Your pics look like Chalice. Lps

Have you tried stylos or Psammocora?

 

[kdx7214]

Assuming parameters are fine (though I do think it would be helpful to know them), it could be any number of things. My first though is, what munched it? and what came first, the munching or the dying? If there is something taking a bite out of your SPS it could killing them outright or stressing them enough that they die. What is your current stocking including CUC?

Also, do you know your PAR readings, or have a general guess based on manufacturer data?

Also, what is the flow like in the area where the SPS are dying? Your gyre may produce enough flow, but will depend heavily on scape and coral placement.

Have you done ICP testing and do you run carbon?

I need to run them again. I usually do them on Sunday but ran out of the calcium reagent for my Hannah and am waiting for that to arrive.

I have no idea what munched this one. Previous ones have not been picked on at all, but still had the white area appear just before they died.

Current stocking is a bunch of various types of snails from a CUC package I bought. There are some hermit crabs included although I have no idea what types they are (again from the CUC package). Fish wise I have a firefish goby, lawnmower blenny, yellow sleeperhead goby, an unknown goby or blenny, and a yellow coris wrasse.

The gyre is set to directly flow onto the coral. In the past when I tried them I didn't have the gyre and had an older, much lower flow pump, with the same results.

 

[kdx7214]

So…what are your parameters? A full tank shot generally also helps to get a better view of what’s going on.

Full tank shot is in another reply. Just so people will quit harking on it, here's the last parameters.

Temp: 77F
Salinity: 1.026
pH: 8.07
Alk: 8.7
Ca: 405
NO3: 5.0
PO4: 0.11
Mg: 1320

 

[kdx7214]

Assuming parameters are fine (though I do think it would be helpful to know them), it could be any number of things. My first though is, what munched it? and what came first, the munching or the dying? If there is something taking a bite out of your SPS it could killing them outright or stressing them enough that they die. What is your current stocking including CUC?

Also, do you know your PAR readings, or have a general guess based on manufacturer data?

Also, what is the flow like in the area where the SPS are dying? Your gyre may produce enough flow, but will depend heavily on scape and coral placement.

Have you done ICP testing and do you run carbon?

Also, I've not run an ICP as I don't have that much cash sitting around. It's possible the Hannah checkers are wildly off, but I've compared them to some ATI tests and some paper test strips and they always seem to be in the right neighborhood.

 

[kdx7214]

What other SPS have you tried?

Do they do ok for a bit or do they struggle from the start?

I've tried a lot of them over the years. Enough that I can't begin to name them all. Some of the more recent ones came from Tidal Gardens and I understand they're a really good source.

They do seem to look great for 1-2 weeks, then go downhill rapidly.

 

[kdx7214]

Do you know the par level? The coral seems pale, like it's losing colour, I question if it receives enough light?

And only one gyre in that big tank? I have 2 gyres (2k each) in my 40 breeder.

As you say, all params are in line, so that leaves light and flow.

I'm running two Noopsyche K7 Pro III LED fixtures right now. I previous had a 6-bulb T5 fixture with three each of the coral blue and coral+ lamps. Same results. No idea on the PAR.

The weird thing about this coral in that at the shop it was a fluorescent red with yellow bits. It's been this color since it was put in the tank.

 

[BOYERZ]

Set gyre to flow at or near surface.

Po4 is a bit high

 

[vetteguy53081]

First thing right off. I test my water weekly and the parameters are staying within the proper range according to reading a vast amount of stuff @Randy Holmes-Farley

I have Noopsyche LED lights, and a 2400gph gyre in the tank. Tank is two years old and is a 75g with 40g sump.

I've tried and tried for decades now and have never been able to keep them alive. What the heck am I doing wrong??

I've attached two pictures of the next likely fatality. It's a turbinaria. I didn't bother to get them under all white lights because they're doing the same thing all the others have, and nobody has had any suggestions other than "check your parameters" which is singularly unhelpful when they are in range and remain stable. You'll notice that something munched on the center, but the white areas around that are the part that continues to happen before they die.

Looks like a product of too much light, low calcium, high phosphates, change in salinity and high alk - A few things to check and verify

 

[kdx7214]

Your pics look like Chalice. Lps

Have you tried stylos or Psammocora?

I've had varying IDs of that particular coral. It was sold to me as a monti, but people on here seemed to think it was a turbinaria. I really don't know what it is, other than I was told it's easy to care for and hardy lol.

I've not tried Psammocora, but have tried stylos with the exact same result. Strangely I had the exact same situation with birds nest and I'm told those things are dang near indestructible.

 

[kdx7214]

Set gyre to flow at or near surface.

Po4 is a bit high

The gyre is at the surface right now. I posted a video and pic of the full tank. As for the PO4, Randy said that 0.08 to 0.12 is the normal, so that's what I shoot for.

 

[BOYERZ]

I've had varying IDs of that particular coral. It was sold to me as a monti, but people on here seemed to think it was a turbinaria. I really don't know what it is, other than I was told it's easy to care for and hardy lol.

I've not tried Psammocora, but have tried stylos with the exact same result. Strangely I had the exact same situation with birds nest and I'm told those things are dang near indestructible.

I think flow might be the issue.

Trying to help. Maybe pests.

 

[kdx7214]

Looks like a product of too much light, low calcium, high phosphates, change in salinity and high alk - A few things to check and verify

I posted the last results of testing I did. PO4 is normal per @Randy Holmes-Farley from other threads. An alkalinity of 8.07 is too low? I wonder if part of the problem is that there are a hundred different ideas what it's supposed to be. I've always gone by Randy's threads because he seems to be fully educated in the area. That doesn't mean his numbers are right though.

I have no idea how much light is too little/much. I don't have access to a PAR meter. The LFS doesn't have one and the nearest one that might is 2+ hours away by car. BRS offers them, but I don't have the cash for the "deposit" required to get one.

If I can come up with the funds somewhere I'll get an ICP test, if I can figure out which ones give reliable data and have decent procedures. From what I've read on here there are a lot of them that may or may not be reliable.

 

[kdx7214]

I think flow might be the issue.

Trying to help. Maybe pests.

So you think more flow would make a difference? I would have thought 2400gph in a 75 would be enough. When I get the $$ I'll try another gyre.

 

[crazyfishmom]

I spent the first few months killing birdsnest left and right. They were definitely not indestructible in my hands that’s for sure.

I can’t tell you the one single thing that might be wrong unfortunately and it may a combination of a couple of things. Things turned around for me when I started carbon dosing and using bacteria as a food source for my corals and now I can definitely keep SPS including Acropora.

It’s hard to tell from the picture but is that bleaching or is it STN? Is the coral losing tissue or color?

 

[GlassMunky]

Are you able to keep any other corals?
I don’t see much of anything in the tank other than the gsp on the back wall and some macro.

Have you tried easier corals like soft corals or lps? Can you keep those alive?