Carx regulator solenoid off when it shoudnt

[Michael Gray]

I woke up to a high ph. I went to just check everything and I noticed my bubble count was slowing down. I went on my profilux 4 and noticed my solenoid outlet was off. My ph probe was 6.67. my ph probe is set to 6.65 with .05 hystersis. My understanding it only turns off when it goes below 6.60?

As I was watching it and wondering why it was off. It clicked on when it hit 6.68 right In front of me.

Am I understanding this wrong? It should be on 24/7 unless it dropped but my pH says otherwise.

Also my solenoid outlet is set to ph value 1. Ph decrease.

My ph value 2 is disabled due to waiting on a new probe

 

[Ditto]

The PH Value above the nominal value will have the socket off, and when it falls below will turn the socket on. So technically it will turn off when it reaches 6.60 and will remain off till it drops below 6.58 or 6.57 and turn on and remain on till it gets to 6.60 and then turn off, this is all because you selected PH Decrease which is the right setup for the reactor. @Lasse and @Vinny@GHLUSA I believe my numbers are right..

Can we see a screen shot of your probe settings and the switch outlet.

 

[Lasse]

The PH Value above the nominal value will have the socket off, and when it falls below will turn the socket on. So technically it will turn off when it reaches 6.60 and will remain off till it drops below 6.58 or 6.57 and turn on and remain on till it gets to 6.60 and then turn off, this is all because you selected PH Decrease which is the right setup for the reactor. @Lasse and @Vinny@GHLUSA I believe my numbers are right..

Can we see a screen shot of your probe settings and the switch outlet.

Sorry - Ditto - I think it exactly the opposite

- little like this

The PH Value above the nominal value will have the socket on, and when it falls below will turn the socket off.

If your nominal value is 6.65 and H= 0,05 and function decrease - it will switch on the socket at 6.675 (around 6.68 mostly) - continue to be on till the ph reach 6,625 (or mostly 6.62) - then it switch off and will be off until the pH rise to around 6.68 again. This is if you have operation mode controller as two position controller. You will have the pH move between 6.62 and 6,68. If you want i stable change operation mode controller to pulse variable and put the values like this

This controller above have the nominal value as 6.37 and during last week it differ 0.01 unit. It was stable around 6.39 - 6.40. In order to come closer to 6.37 we could play with pause time - lower it. But it is stable enough for us

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Michael Gray]

Sorry - Ditto - I think it exactly the opposite

- little like this


If your nominal value is 6.65 and H= 0,05 and function decrease - it will switch on the socket at 6.675 (around 6.68 mostly) - continue to be on till the ph reach 6,625 (or mostly 6.62) - then it switch off and will be off until the pH rise to around 6.68 again. This is if you have operation mode controller as two position controller. You will have the pH move between 6.62 and 6,68. If you want i stable change operation mode controller to pulse variable and put the values like this

This controller above have the nominal value as 6.37 and during last week it differ 0.01 unit. It was stable around 6.39 - 6.40. In order to come closer to 6.37 we could play with pause time - lower it. But it is stable enough for us

Sincerely Lasse

You just confused me. This is my settings.

 

[Michael Gray]

So why was my co2 solenoid stopping co2 of it never dropped below 6.66???

 

[Michael Gray]

It's not always off. But this is the second time I woke up to it being off. I noticed by bubble count slowing down and stopping. (No co2). And this morning I noticed it click on as I was watching it. But looking at ph graff it has never dropped below 6.65 ever. It basically stays 6.66-6.67 all the time . Still trying to dial it in. As yesterday kh was 7.6 all day. Woke up 8.1. So that's what made me drop my kamoer by 2ml/min and then noticed co2 is off.

 

[Lasse]

Can you show the pH graph?

If it stay at 6.66 - 6.67 - it works. Remember it is a very, very short period the valve is open. maybe only some seconds, Lower pH is a very fast process Whats is your sample period? (for the graph)

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Michael Gray]

Can you show the pH graph?

If it stay at 6.66 - 6.67 - it works. Remember it is a very, very short period the valve is open. maybe only some seconds, Lower pH is a very fast process Whats is your sample period? (for the graph)

Sincerely Lasse

I posted it up top. My question was why was the co2 outlet shut off. Unless I don't understand. I thought as long as ph is in range the co2 remains on constantly??

 

[Ditto]

@Lasse thanks !! Forgot opposite

 

[ingchr1]

I posted it up top. My question was why was the co2 outlet shut off. Unless I don't understand. I thought as long as ph is in range the co2 remains on constantly??

The pH could have been out of range and not captured by the graph. The graph only records data on a certain frequency, it is not continuous. The minimum recording frequency is 1 minute.

 

[Lasse]

I posted it up top. My question was why was the co2 outlet shut off. Unless I don't understand. I thought as long as ph is in range the co2 remains on constantly??

Nope. If it rise to over 6.68 it switch on - when it decrease to 6.62 it switch off. Probably it is only on for some seconds. It depends on how open the CO2 adjust valve is. The only help you have from the bubble counter is that it shows that there is gas coming when the solenoid valve is open. And the amount of bubbles per time unit also show how much CO2 is coming in. If it is many bubbles / minute the adjustment will go fast - if it is few the adjustment goes slow. A frequencies of 1 bubble per sec (or per every second secound) could be a good start. Remember - it is the pH meter that control the amount of CO2 coming in with help off opening and closing the solenoid. The bubble rate is of minor importance because if the pH get to low, the solenoid shout of the gas stream.

In the example I show in the other post above - the solenoid is open for around 1 - 4 seconds each time.

If you are steady around 6.66 your system is working the way it should

Your sample period seems to be around 1 Hour. You will not catch fast reactions like this with that sample rate. The pH could have gone down to the threshold during the other 59.99 minutes during the sample period. If you put the sample period t 1 minute - you will have more chance to se when it open or close

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Michael Gray]

Nope. If it rise to over 6.68 it switch on - when it decrease to 6.62 it switch off. Probably it is only on for some seconds. It depends on how open the CO2 adjust valve is. The only help you have from the bubble counter is that it shows that there is gas coming when the solenoid valve is open. And the amount of bubbles per time unit also show how much CO2 is coming in. If it is many bubbles / minute the adjustment will go fast - if it is few the adjustment goes slow. A frequencies of 1 bubble per sec (or per every second secound) could be a good start. Remember - it is the pH meter that control the amount of CO2 coming in with help off opening and closing the solenoid. The bubble rate is of minor importance because if the pH get to low, the solenoid shout of the gas stream.

In the example I show in the other post above - the solenoid is open for around 1 - 4 seconds each time.

If you are steady around 6.66 your system is working the way it should

Your sample period seems to be around 1 Hour. You will not catch fast reactions like this with that sample rate. The pH could have gone down to the threshold during the other 59.99 minutes during the sample period. If you put the sample period t 1 minute - you will have more chance to se when it open or close

Sincerely Lassec

Should I changee it to read every minute for graph.

I turned co2 to slow down. It's not roughly 1 bubble every 1.8seconds. Guessing with timing with my eye and phone. But now ph is showing 6.73-6.74 when I log in at work.

 

[Michael Gray]

After slowing bubble rate down to roughly 1 bubble per 1.8s. Awhile ago today ph climbed to 6.74

Settings

 

[Lasse]

When you should open the valve and rise the rate of bubbles. Just now you are managing it with the bubble rate and the solenoid is open all the time. It will be overheated - sooner or later. If you use a solenoid - it should be the one that manage the Carx - and let the pH control manage the Carx with help of the solenoid.

At least - that´s the way I would run it. If you are going to run the Carx with help of bubble rate - you do not need either the pH control or the solenoid valve. IMO

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Michael Gray]

I'll work on slowly turning the co2 more to just get into the range then. I heard the idea spot was to keep it in range. Without switching on a and off....... I gotta find truth to that. I heard having it on and off on off burns it out?

Ill add more co2 tonight. I'll maybe go to 1.50 seconds per bubble instead of my 1.8. And see where that goes. It's hard the knob on my bubble counter. A full turn doesn't even change the bubble rate. It's like super super small increments.

 

[Lasse]

I heard having it on and off on off burns it out

IMO - it is the total opposite. They are build for open and close. If it is open the whole time (with a solenoid that open when you get current to it) it will overheat - they get very warm. I have run a lot of these systems - always let the solenoid manage the pH (not as you do) - nema problema. But it is your system and solenoid - you do as you want - but it is wrong IMO

Sincerely Lasse

 

[Michael Gray]

ill bring it back down.. because one bubble on my system at 1.8ish seconds.. my PH now climbed inside reactor to 6.77

 

[Michael Gray]

The pH could have been out of range and not captured by the graph. The graph only records data on a certain frequency, it is not continuous. The minimum recording frequency is 1 minute.

does 1 minute work for you constantly... if i set it to one.. it doesnt do 1 minute set point constantly.. it might do a few.. then it starts doing 15 or so.. then eventually stops recording.. does it stop for any specific reason??

 

[ingchr1]

does 1 minute work for you constantly... if i set it to one.. it doesnt do 1 minute set point constantly.. it might do a few.. then it starts doing 15 or so.. then eventually stops recording.. does it stop for any specific reason??

I rarely look at my graphs, but just took a look through the webserver and there's not a reading every minute as I have it set. Very random.

 

[Michael Gray]

I rarely look at my graphs, but just took a look through the webserver and there's not a reading every minute as I have it set. Very random.

Ya minute doesn't work. I wonder what the lowest is