According to the specs on this website, the pumps inlet and outlet are 1-1/4" and pumps 2100 gph.
Choke all that down to 3/4" lines and it's no wonder there isn't much flow.
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I hope the suction line isn't 3/4".
A few things. First of all, your pump has a 1.25" outlet. I would up-size it to 1.5" to reduce friction loss as much as possible. Use swept 90, or dual 45's for each turn. Line locs are fine, but you will get a lot of friction from them, unless you keep the plumbing large and only reduce it right before it goes into each unit. Next, is head pressure. If the inlet end of the pump and the outlet end of the pump are both in the display, you do not have to worry about vertical distance. Think about it. If you shut off your return pump, what does it do? It siphons back into the sump until it draws in air and breaks the siphon. If you cut off your closed loop pump, what does the water do? Nothing, it just stops, because there isn't any water height difference between the inlet and outlet. The only thing that creates head pressure at that point is the friction loss from the plumbing. Again, oversize the plumbing and don't use standard 90's...ever...One more comment...the way they calculate flow for a power head and how they calculate flow for an inline pump are completely different. For a powerhead, they put the powerhead in water and use a device to measure water velocity in a 3d grid all round the power head, then calculate total flow. This calculates how much water is actually being moved around in the tank. For an inline pump, they measure the velocity of water inside the outlet pipe, and from that, using a specific plumbing size, calculate how much water is flowing through the pipe. The problem with this is that it isn't apples to apples. When the water comes out of a plumbing outlet, it creates an area of low pressure behind the edge of the pipe that draws in water from around the outlet, moving more water than just what was inside the pipe. People don't use closed loops much anymore, so no one has taken the time to calculate them, but I can say with confidence that 3000 GPH coming out of a pipe will produce a lot more in tank flow than a powerhead rated at 3000 GPH. So keep that in mind when trying to estimate your total system turnover. For a 300DD, I would start with atleast 2 DC style pumps. 2 Ecotech L2 pumps would be a good place to start and as it fills in, you may need to add more...
A few things. First of all, your pump has a 1.25" outlet. I would up-size it to 1.5" to reduce friction loss as much as possible. Use swept 90, or dual 45's for each turn. Line locs are fine, but you will get a lot of friction from them, unless you keep the plumbing large and only reduce it right before it goes into each unit. Next, is head pressure. If the inlet end of the pump and the outlet end of the pump are both in the display, you do not have to worry about vertical distance. Think about it. If you shut off your return pump, what does it do? It siphons back into the sump until it draws in air and breaks the siphon. If you cut off your closed loop pump, what does the water do? Nothing, it just stops, because there isn't any water height difference between the inlet and outlet. The only thing that creates head pressure at that point is the friction loss from the plumbing. Again, oversize the plumbing and don't use standard 90's...ever...One more comment...the way they calculate flow for a power head and how they calculate flow for an inline pump are completely different. For a powerhead, they put the powerhead in water and use a device to measure water velocity in a 3d grid all round the power head, then calculate total flow. This calculates how much water is actually being moved around in the tank. For an inline pump, they measure the velocity of water inside the outlet pipe, and from that, using a specific plumbing size, calculate how much water is flowing through the pipe. The problem with this is that it isn't apples to apples. When the water comes out of a plumbing outlet, it creates an area of low pressure behind the edge of the pipe that draws in water from around the outlet, moving more water than just what was inside the pipe. People don't use closed loops much anymore, so no one has taken the time to calculate them, but I can say with confidence that 3000 GPH coming out of a pipe will produce a lot more in tank flow than a powerhead rated at 3000 GPH. So keep that in mind when trying to estimate your total system turnover. For a 300DD, I would start with atleast 2 DC style pumps. 2 Ecotech L2 pumps would be a good place to start and as it fills in, you may need to add more...
Suction side plumbing needs to be at least as big as the pumps suction side.It is ..... ?
With the current pump i have now i should open up the diameter much larger and probably run 1 pump for each side ? Add another for the other side ?
That would be ideal. I would increase the plumbing size to 1.5" if you could. That is one size larger than the outlet of the pump. Run them both in ramping modes, so they can create some random flow. Closed loops are really cool, I don't understand why more people don't use them on larger systems.
This is spot on and a perfect explanation of the best way to set up a CL and not be disappointed. My closed loop was set up exactly like this. Spa Flex and a Dolphin Amp Master pump driving an Oceans Motions 4 way valve. When I added the large MRC 6100's to my system, I put 2 online from the sump and removed Dolphin amp master under the tank and changed the Oceans motions valve to run from the second MRC 6100 in the garage sump.I wonder how many people here have actually used a CL? There is no head loss on a CL - they are closed systems. There is friction and pipe loss. I cannot believe that people are suggesting DC pumps. DC pumps are a joke on a CL unless they are powerful like a Abyzz. They only move the advertised water with no restrictions whatsoever and they slow down significantly with any type of back pressure. There is no way around this.
Suggesting DC pumps for a CL (there are a few at $1000+ price point) is almost as ridiculous as suggesting DC pumps for 30 foot head applications - you are going to end up with a AmpMaster (or the like) or else you will be unhappy, just like high head people end up with Iwaki or PanWorld or else they are unhappy.
I used to use spa flex for CLs to cut down on friction and elbows and stuff. Don't forget your unions near the pump so that you can take it out if you ever need to. Eductors can provide lots of flow if you have a strong pump - they are amazingly effective if you have velocity out of the nozzle. If you want 4 outlets and don't have the flow to keep the velocity strong, then look at an Ocean's Motion 4 way.
If you don't want to pay for a strong AC pump, then get some gyres and in-tank pumps and save yourself some trouble.
I wonder how many people here have actually used a CL? There is no head loss on a CL - they are closed systems. There is friction and pipe loss. I cannot believe that people are suggesting DC pumps. DC pumps are a joke on a CL unless they are powerful like a Abyzz. They only move the advertised water with no restrictions whatsoever and they slow down significantly with any type of back pressure. There is no way around this.
Suggesting DC pumps for a CL (there are a few at $1000+ price point) is almost as ridiculous as suggesting DC pumps for 30 foot head applications - you are going to end up with a AmpMaster (or the like) or else you will be unhappy, just like high head people end up with Iwaki or PanWorld or else they are unhappy.
I used to use spa flex for CLs to cut down on friction and elbows and stuff. Don't forget your unions near the pump so that you can take it out if you ever need to. Eductors can provide lots of flow if you have a strong pump - they are amazingly effective if you have velocity out of the nozzle. If you want 4 outlets and don't have the flow to keep the velocity strong, then look at an Ocean's Motion 4 way.
If you don't want to pay for a strong AC pump, then get some gyres and in-tank pumps and save yourself some trouble.
And your suggesting JUST the AmpMaster pump to run the 4 lines like i have it ? or do i still need to increase the diameter of the pipes to the loc-lines ?I wonder how many people here have actually used a CL? There is no head loss on a CL - they are closed systems. There is friction and pipe loss. I cannot believe that people are suggesting DC pumps. DC pumps are a joke on a CL unless they are powerful like a Abyzz. They only move the advertised water with no restrictions whatsoever and they slow down significantly with any type of back pressure. There is no way around this.
Suggesting DC pumps for a CL (there are a few at $1000+ price point) is almost as ridiculous as suggesting DC pumps for 30 foot head applications - you are going to end up with a AmpMaster (or the like) or else you will be unhappy, just like high head people end up with Iwaki or PanWorld or else they are unhappy.
I used to use spa flex for CLs to cut down on friction and elbows and stuff. Don't forget your unions near the pump so that you can take it out if you ever need to. Eductors can provide lots of flow if you have a strong pump - they are amazingly effective if you have velocity out of the nozzle. If you want 4 outlets and don't have the flow to keep the velocity strong, then look at an Ocean's Motion 4 way.
If you don't want to pay for a strong AC pump, then get some gyres and in-tank pumps and save yourself some trouble.
Here is their website. They have been around forever. fabulous product and company, but most people moved away from CL's and these 4 ways, the birth of internal pumps like Ecotech and Tunze have most hobbyist going in that direction.The Oceans motion 4 way is that a stand alone pump ? or do i need something else with this ?
The CL should be all 1" line coming out, the suction side from sump should be 1 1/2". you also may want to look at the MRC pumps I sent a link of. Very quiet, and a very impressive build quality.And your suggesting JUST the AmpMaster pump to run the 4 lines like i have it ? or do i still need to increase the diameter of the pipes to the loc-lines ?
That video was cool , and i see that this will need a separate pump to feed this unit however it will push water thru only one side at a time which is a nice alternating flow ( if i were to get that size unit ) , the one in the video was a 4 wayHere is their website. They have been around forever. fabulous product and company, but most people moved away from CL's and these 4 ways, the birth of internal pumps like Ecotech and Tunze have most hobbyist going in that direction.
Oceans Motions | Reef Tank Water Flow | Water Flow Diverters
At OceansMotions, we wish to serve the finest reef tank water flow directors and accessories to our clients. Our products are crafted to simulate the ocean’s dynamic environment and help your aquarium’s species thrive healthily.www.oceansmotions.com
I wonder how many people here have actually used a CL? There is no head loss on a CL - they are closed systems. There is friction and pipe loss. I cannot believe that people are suggesting DC pumps. DC pumps are a joke on a CL unless they are powerful like a Abyzz. They only move the advertised water with no restrictions whatsoever and they slow down significantly with any type of back pressure. There is no way around this.
Suggesting DC pumps for a CL (there are a few at $1000+ price point) is almost as ridiculous as suggesting DC pumps for 30 foot head applications - you are going to end up with a AmpMaster (or the like) or else you will be unhappy, just like high head people end up with Iwaki or PanWorld or else they are unhappy.
I used to use spa flex for CLs to cut down on friction and elbows and stuff. Don't forget your unions near the pump so that you can take it out if you ever need to. Eductors can provide lots of flow if you have a strong pump - they are amazingly effective if you have velocity out of the nozzle. If you want 4 outlets and don't have the flow to keep the velocity strong, then look at an Ocean's Motion 4 way.
If you don't want to pay for a strong AC pump, then get some gyres and in-tank pumps and save yourself some trouble.
I do not consider anything that Reef Builders says to be either objective or accurate, although it is not necessarily inaccurate - if you pay him and advertise with them, they will love on your stuff.
Eductors are the real deal if you can get some velocity going through them.
For your situation, how about a 1" sea swirl with an eductor and a single pump that can power through?