Considering getting my mag to the knife.

[Ardeus]

Some months ago my mag tried to split but didn't complete the process. Since then, its mouth has been extremely deformed.

I am not sure it's even able to eat and I think it's been on a very slow but steady decline over the past 6 months or so.

It used to bubble up everyday and it never did that since then.

I haven't seen any full deflation but sometimes maybe 20% of the tentacles are deflated.

I don't see it recovering without completing the split. Maybe I could help?

Any advise?

 

[fishguy242]

@OrionN @Eagle_Steve ??

 

[D-Nak]

Can you share more photos? Can you clearly see where the split started, and are you able to complete the split via a simple cut? The key is being able to see where the mouths are so you can split them in between. If there is only one mouth, then I tend to think that it's more of an injury than a split.

I had a magnifica that stopped splitting about 80% of the way through, where I could clearly see where it needed to be cut to finish the process. After waiting weeks for the nem to do it on its own, I decided to cut it. Both anemones survived.

 

[JoshH]

@Nemguy123 might be able to help here as well

 

[D-Nak]

I just reviewed your other threads (here and here) on this anemone (looks like you're posting monthly about this same issue), and watched the videos as well. One of the posts showed a video of the anemone with what appears to be an injury.

In all videos it looks like the anemone isn't completely healthy. Sometimes it doesn't have the typical stature of a magnifica where it "stands" on top of the rock and other times it looks partially deflated. The mouth is also overly inflated (possibly a feeding response?) but it should be closed most of the time.

Can you share photos of when you think it's at its best?

 

[Ardeus]

The mouth has been permanently in the state you can see in the photo. The anemone has been looking more or less like that all the time for many months.

Before the splitting attempt it would go through many changes throughout the day, balling up, etc, but since the split attempt, it looks the same all day.

There were many times early on when I though the split was almost complete, it was extremely stretched around the rock. I even thought that the rock was not large enough so it could stretch enough to rip itself apart.

There were times when I could see some open tissue in the foot, but it always quickly healed.

If don't do anything and it doesn't split on its own, I think it's going to continue to slowly decline. It hasn't shown any signs of wanting to split for a few months now.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

The mouth has been permanently in the state you can see in the photo. The anemone has been looking more or less like that all the time for many months.

Before the splitting attempt it would go through many changes throughout the day, balling up, etc, but since the split attempt, it looks the same all day.

There were many times early on when I though the split was almost complete, it was extremely stretched around the rock. I even thought that the rock was not large enough so it could stretch enough to rip itself apart.

There were times when I could see some open tissue in the foot, but it always quickly healed.

If don't do anything and it doesn't split on its own, I think it's going to continue to slowly decline. It hasn't shown any signs of wanting to split for a few months now.

The biggest thing clearly being able to see where the splitting is taking place. I have had mags take almost a year to split fully. Mouth puffed, but not gaping. Then it became 2 mouths and I could clearly see where it was happening. At that point, it was moved to a hospital tank, I took a scalpel,
helped it along and treated for 10 days with cipro. Both lived just fine. I have lost one this way also, by doing it in the DT and no treatment or hospital tank.

It may not have to be treated, but new clean water changed everyday for 10 days in a hospital tank is a minimum in my opinion. Again, my opinion, as others have done this in their DT and it was fine. My DTs are a mix of all kinds of nems, so not sure if that was the issue or what.

Either way, I would need a lot more pics from a lot more angles to see if a split is truly happening or if the nem has an injury, etc.

As @D-Nak said, I have looked at all the other posts/pi’s as well and have to agree something seems a little off with the nem. Nothing you may be doing wrong, but pics from different angles and a few focused directly on the mouth would be very helpful.

 

[Ardeus]

 

[Ardeus]

If I were to cut it, would this be the right way?

 

[Eagle_Steve]

If I were to cut it, would this be the right way?

I cannot say, as I cannot physically see 2 mouths. Try to get a pic facing the mouth directly.

 

[Ardeus]

I don’t know if there's already 2 mouths, it doesn't seem like it. In all this time I have never seen the mouth gaping or open.

I just tried puting a small piece of shrimp directly in the mouth area and a filefish stole it. I tried again and the female clown ate it.

That area is permanently swollen and extremely deformed.

I can't get a good picture facing the mouth, the glass will distort the image.

Some months ago it was definitely trying to split but it hasn't shown any signs again.

On one hand, I could let nature follow its course and maybe in a few more months it will complete the split.

On the other hand, It's still a large animal that has the potencial to nuke the tank if it decides to suddenly die or take off and meet a pump.

I have seen a very slow and steady decline and I'm very worried. If the best thing to do is to cut it, the sooner the better, before it becomes too weak.

 

[gig 'em]

I would venture to say that this anemone isn't splitting. It has a wide open mouth indicative of poor health or stress. I would recommend either treating it with antibiotics for a full week or moving it to a different tank to see if that changes it. I have seen this happen with mags before and ciprofloxacin usually resolves the issue.

I've never had one of my mags split on me, but when BTAs split they don't usually look like this. I would wager cutting it when it's already in distress would simply kill it.

 

[Ardeus]

Thanks @gig 'em.

It isnt splitting now, but the mouth became permanently distorted when it was trying to split. There were times when it almost completed the split, but it healed.

The rock where it's sitting is a bit small and I think it may have been a factor in preventing it from completing the split, so yesterday I put a rock on top and leaning against the glass. It now has a path to get to the glass where there's unlimited space to stretch.

Yesterday I went to the vet and I got the cipro and I will give it 10 days or so to check if it will move to the glass and show signs of splitting again. If not, I will use the cipro.

 

[D-Nak]

In all of your posts, you seem convinced that it was trying to split. Can provide more evidence of this?

Changing shape into what appears like a figure 8, is not an indicator of splitting, nor is a change in mouth shape.

The mag doesn't look "happy" and I think something is causing its demise. What are you water conditions like? I'm willing to bet that poor water conditions is the culprit. Or that lemonpeel angel is picking on it.

I would follow what @gig 'em suggested and move the anemone to another tank, or ideallt set up a QT tank for it. Give it pristine lighting and water, and I bet it'll perk up.

 

[Ardeus]

I have never watched a mag split, so I may have misinterpreted it. At one point I saw the foot ripping apart, but it healed. For a few weeks it stretched in many different ways around the rock, almost wrapping itself around it.

I don't do regular water changes, nitrates always below 5 ppm, phosphates have been usually around 0.15 - 0.30 but in the last month I decided to bring them down to around 0.1.

I feed the fish 6-7 times a day and I run a 55 watt UV.

There's around 30 bubbletips in the tank and recently they increased in number. I run carbon and replace it every 3 weeks.

I will follow your advise. The anemone is aware that there's a new rock higher but it hasn't moved yet. I will give it until after Christmas and if there's no evolution I will move it to an hospital tank and treat it with cypro.

I had to put it through cypro before, almost 3 years ago, because she did a couple of deflations a few days after I got it.

 

[Ardeus]

In all of your posts, you seem convinced that it was trying to split. Can provide more evidence of this?

Changing shape into what appears like a figure 8, is not an indicator of splitting, nor is a change in mouth shape.

The mag doesn't look "happy" and I think something is causing its demise. What are you water conditions like? I'm willing to bet that poor water conditions is the culprit. Or that lemonpeel angel is picking on it.

I would follow what @gig 'em suggested and move the anemone to another tank, or ideallt set up a QT tank for it. Give it pristine lighting and water, and I bet it'll perk up.

You mentioned the lemonpeels and it set off some alarm bells in my head.

Not about the lemonpeels (they're heraldis) but about the 3 bristle tail filefish. They nip at the xenias and bubbletips, but they're in balance. I have never watched them pick at the magnifica and the clowns chase them away because sometimes they try to eat their eggs. But I will keep a close eye on them. Thanks once again.

 

[D-Nak]

You mentioned the lemonpeels and it set off some alarm bells in my head.

Not about the lemonpeels (they're heraldis) but about the 3 bristle tail filefish. They nip at the xenias and bubbletips, but they're in balance. I have never watched them pick at the magnifica and the clowns chase them away because sometimes they try to eat their eggs. But I will keep a close eye on them. Thanks once again.

Oh yes -- definitely keep an eye on them! I have one that likes to pick on my gigantea.

 

[Eagle_Steve]

Oh yes -- definitely keep an eye on them! I have one that likes to pick on my gigantea.

They pick on haddonis also, but usually doesn’t end up well for them at least mine didn’t. Mine was pecking at my haddoni, it unstiffened one side of itself, wave maker flow hit, side flipped up, scared the angel down into it, and the angel was trapped and food.

 

[Ardeus]

Here's an update.

3 days ago I saw it deflate. I followed your advise and I took it out together with the rock and placed it in a bucket and started the cypro protocol.

It deflated one more time yesterday morning and today early in the morning it's splitting.



I turned off the flow to shoot the video.

If it doesn't finish the split by tomorrow, maybe it's a good idea to help it?

 

[Ardeus]