Cycle concerns

[BryGuy903]

14gal biocube
Skimmer off
No floss or floss/carbon in overflow/filter.
Lights off

Salinity spot on using refractor
Water temp 78
Rodi water, reef crystal salt
10lbs liferock (dry)
Live sand on 1” bed

I’m not new to hobby, but been gone for 20yrs.

Doing a fishless cycle and ran microbacter7 for a week before realizing I needed an ammonia source first, duh!!

I’ve added 3 doses of Dr Tim’s ammonia chloride.
Tested, shows zero after each time.
Tested nitrite and I’m getting zero there also.
Currently using SJ wave test strips.

I realize the microbacter would likely keep ammonia below 2ppm, but shouldn’t I be seeing some ammonia?
I’d also assume I’d see some nitrite if the microbacter is breaking down the ammonia.

What am I doing wrong here?

 

[FishLvR]

So no nitrates? Are you using API test kits? Dry rock should not have "live" in the name...LOL companies AMIRITE? Yeah so I keep it painfully simple. I tossed in fish food twice a day, and pretty much ignored the tank for three weeks. Then after I had some ammonia, I dosed MB7 and Probidio. Two days later I was able to get from 4ppm ammonia to nothing overnight I slowly added the fish, then after some uglies the corals.

 

[MikeReefs]

Make sure you added enough ammonia, it should be detectable almost instantly. The bacteria won’t consume it that fast. I will take about a week for nitrites to build and about another week or two for it to be converted to nitrate. I’ve cycled 3 tanks using Microbactor and they all took about 3 weeks to fully cycle

 

[Euphyllia97]

You know the ammonia is in the tank so change your ammonia test kit and if that one reads 0 aswell, you know you are good to go :) Keep it simple

 

[BryGuy903]

Make sure you added enough ammonia, it should be detectable almost instantly. The bacteria won’t consume it that fast. I will take about a week for nitrites to build and about another week or two for it to be converted to nitrate. I’ve cycled 3 tanks using Microbactor and they all took about 3 weeks to fully cycle

I’m following Dr Tim’s directions 4 drops per gallon. That makes 56drops.
I like the simple “throw some food in” idea. But bummed I spent $$ on the Dr Tim’s.
I guess I’m a little concerned the ammonia test strips are bad.

Were you adding microbacter while also adding an ammonia source?

 

[BryGuy903]

So no nitrates? Are you using API test kits? Dry rock should not have "live" in the name...LOL companies AMIRITE? Yeah so I keep it painfully simple. I tossed in fish food twice a day, and pretty much ignored the tank for three weeks. Then after I had some ammonia, I dosed MB7 and Probidio. Two days later I was able to get from 4ppm ammonia to nothing overnight I slowly added the fish, then after some uglies the corals.

To be fair it’s LIFE rock.
Anyone new to hobby may confuse it with live.. #m#matketingol

 

[FishLvR]

I’m following Dr Tim’s directions 4 drops per gallon. That makes 56drops.
I like the simple “throw some food in” idea. But bummed I spent $$ on the Dr Tim’s.
I guess I’m a little concerned the ammonia test strips are bad.

Were you adding microbacter while also adding an ammonia source?

Oh test strips! I mean they can be OK but how have they been stored? I would really get a kit. Forget about nitrites (the spike is easily missed anyway), we are looking at ammonia then nitrates. I fed the tank and did nothing else. When ammonia was showing on my test kit I added a dose of MB7 and one vial of Probido (I already had them around you can use any source). Kept on feeding. Daily MB7 weekly Probido. That's it. To test my theory I put ACE hardware ammonia ($3) up to 4ppm then tested in the morning when lights first went on. When the tank could consistently, about three days, covert that ammonia to nitrates, which at this point were 50, that's when I did a water change and added the test fish. He lived.

Now I am going to be honest, I used to just use Tetra Safe Start. This crap was amazing! You would see ammonia spike and then nitrates like in DAYS. For whatever reason they no longer make the product for saltwater. Tetra just sent a generic email that said it wasn't cost effective and I should go suck it. Sad face.

Edit to add, I have it written down it took 9 weeks total. I think mainly because I sort of just fed and only tested on month two. I probably could have sped it up if I had noticed the ammonia sooner but I had other things going on so I ignored the tank.

 

[BryGuy903]

I’m following Dr Tim’s directions 4 drops per gallon. That makes 56drops.
I like the simple “throw some food in” idea. But bummed I spent $$ on the Dr Tim’s.
I guess I’m a little concerned the ammonia test strips are bad.

Were you adding microbacter while also adding an ammonia source?

Oh test strips! I mean they can be OK but how have they been stored? I would really get a kit. Forget about nitrites (the spike is easily missed anyway), we are looking at ammonia then nitrates. I fed the tank and did nothing else. When ammonia was showing on my test kit I added a dose of MB7 and one vial of Probido (I already had them around you can use any source). Kept on feeding. Daily MB7 weekly Probido. That's it. To test my theory I put ACE hardware ammonia ($3) up to 4ppm then tested in the morning when lights first went on. When the tank could consistently, about three days, covert that ammonia to nitrates, which at this point were 50, that's when I did a water change and added the test fish. He lived.

Now I am going to be honest, I used to just use Tetra Safe Start. This crap was amazing! You would see ammonia spike and then nitrates like in DAYS. For whatever reason they no longer make the product for saltwater. Tetra just sent a generic email that said it wasn't cost effective and I should go suck it. Sad face.

Thanks a bunch!
So you are saying the Dr Tim’s and hardware store ammonia are identical. Oy’

I’ll grab some food and try that. I’m fine being patient.

 

[FishLvR]

Thanks a bunch!
So you are saying the Dr Tim’s and hardware store ammonia are identical. Oy’

I’ll grab some food and try that. I’m fine being patient.

Yeah ammonia is ammonia. I think people are scared to accidently get surfactants in their ammonia source. Dr Tim's is free of all that. Surfactants make water wet...so they clean better, but side effect can kill your corals and fish. You already have the tims so might as well use it. But yeah I have had the same bottle for about 10 years now. It was $3. ACE hardware is the one supposedly without surfactants, which should be listed if your ammonia has it. Shake the bottle. Foams, don't buy. HOWEVER, I have used the wrong ammonia ages ago that was my best tank...LOL!

 

[Fish Fan]

Dry rock should not have "live" in the name...LOL companies AMIRITE?

To be fair it’s LIFE rock.
Anyone new to hobby may confuse it with live.. #m#matketingol

I think CaribbSea is using an intentionally misleading name for their dry rock

I’m following Dr Tim’s directions 4 drops per gallon. That makes 56drops.
I like the simple “throw some food in” idea. But bummed I spent $$ on the Dr Tim’s.
I guess I’m a little concerned the ammonia test strips are bad.

Were you adding microbacter while also adding an ammonia source?

Dr. Tim's is great stuff, so is Microbacter...... Your test strips maybe not so good

Most here at R2R do not suggest using strips. Even if they say "aquarium" on them, they are often just rebranded swimming pool test strips, and as a pool owner those strips are not known to be accurate even for pools.

Get some better test kits so you can know for sure what's going on here. Salifert is excellent for an inexpensive test kit. API doesn't get a lot of love from members here at R2R, but honestly they are not that bad, much better than strips, in my opinion, and you can get them at your local PetCo or PetSmart and many other pet stores.

You can also bring a sample of water to your local fish store and ask them to test it.

What you want to look for here is nitrate starting to accumulate. If you've got nitrate, you know your cycle is working. Be aware the nitrite can cause a false high reading for nitrate, but you still want to see nitrate accumulating soon if not already.

The "test", so to speak, would be to dose more ammonium chloride until your tank gets to ~2.0ppm, using a reliable test kit. Just use the Dr. Tim's, you already have it (should have been like $5, right?), and it's not worth risking getting the wrong thing from the hardware store by mistake. Test your ammonia again after 24 hours, and if it's down to nearly zero, you're cycled. When a tank can process 2.0ppm ammonia to nearly zero in 24 hours, you're good to go. If necessary, do a large water change to reduce high nitrate, and start slowly stocking some hardy livestock.

I hope that helps!

 

[SoWhatNow]

I’m fine being patient.

 

[BryGuy903]

Dry rock should not have "live" in the name...LOL companies AMIRITE?

To be fair it’s LIFE rock.
Anyone new to hobby may confuse it with live.. #m#matketingol

I think CaribbSea is using an intentionally misleading name for their dry rock

I’m following Dr Tim’s directions 4 drops per gallon. That makes 56drops.
I like the simple “throw some food in” idea. But bummed I spent $$ on the Dr Tim’s.
I guess I’m a little concerned the ammonia test strips are bad.

Were you adding microbacter while also adding an ammonia source?

Dr. Tim's is great stuff, so is Microbacter...... Your test strips maybe not so good

Most here at R2R do not suggest using strips. Even if they say "aquarium" on them, they are often just rebranded swimming pool test strips, and as a pool owner those strips are not known to be accurate even for pools.

Get some better test kits so you can know for sure what's going on here. Salifert is excellent for an inexpensive test kit. API doesn't get a lot of love from members here at R2R, but honestly they are not that bad, much better than strips, in my opinion, and you can get them at your local PetCo or PetSmart and many other pet stores.

You can also bring a sample of water to your local fish store and ask them to test it.

What you want to look for here is nitrate starting to accumulate. If you've got nitrate, you know your cycle is working. Be aware the nitrite can cause a false high reading for nitrate, but you still want to see nitrate accumulating soon if not already.

The "test", so to speak, would be to dose more ammonium chloride until your tank gets to ~2.0ppm, using a reliable test kit. Just use the Dr. Tim's, you already have it (should have been like $5, right?), and it's not worth risking getting the wrong thing from the hardware store by mistake. Test your ammonia again after 24 hours, and if it's down to nearly zero, you're cycled. When a tank can process 2.0ppm ammonia to nearly zero in 24 hours, you're good to go. If necessary, do a large water change to reduce high nitrate, and start slowly stocking some hardy livestock.

I hope that helps!

I have a “master” api kit that had no ammonia or nitrite test. So useless for starting.
I ordered ammonia strips and it was almost same cost to get them with a batch of full test panels

I have a Hannah nitrate tester. I’ll give the api tests I have a run to get started after cycle.
Thanks for the help!!

 

[Uncle99]

Any of the decaying bacteria from Microbactor 7 initially dosed would have started the cycle.

So later, when you dosed ammonia, the cycle was already in place so just zeroed it out.

You seem cycled to me.

You have all the right things in place.

 

[Fish Fan]

I think you got the API Reef Master test kit, which you're right, does't comes ammonia. Their regular master kit does.

See what the Hanna says for Nitrate here.

 

[MikeReefs]

Yes I used dr Tim’s ammonia and cycled using Microbactor. Call me old fashioned but I use API to test ammonia and nitrite as well as an ammonia badge by seachem.
I am currently using this method as well as adding Fiji mud by aqua forest for bio diversity, I also added PNS purple bacteria. I’ve always used multiple bacteria’s for cycling. But you can use anything you please

 

[Fish Fan]

I have a “master” api kit that had no ammonia or nitrite test. So useless for starting.
I ordered ammonia strips and it was almost same cost to get them with a batch of full test panels

I have a Hannah nitrate tester. I’ll give the api tests I have a run to get started after cycle.
Thanks for the help!!

The API Saltwater Master kit comes with Ammonia, nitrite, nitrate, and pH:

https://www.chewy.com/api-saltwater-aquarium-master-test/dp/122076?utm_source=google-product&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=22429708310&utm_content=&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=22433258830&gbraid=0AAAAADmQ2V2ijYmsc42LkGnrO_PYYq4SH&gclid=CjwKCAjw4efDBhATEiwAaDBpbnl7bH5axKrlVBylQugWG3cAoMta2c5mnYwk227w3bkQn-B7trBfCBoCppMQAvD_BwE

The API Reef Master test kit comes calcium, alkalinity, phosphate and nitrate. This is a good kit to have for when you start keeping hard corals, so it's not a waste to have it:

https://www.chewy.com/api-reef-aquarium-master-test-kit/dp/122061?utm_source=google-product&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=22429708310&utm_content=&gad_source=1&gad_campaignid=22433258830&gbraid=0AAAAADmQ2V2ijYmsc42LkGnrO_PYYq4SH&gclid=CjwKCAjw4efDBhATEiwAaDBpbjJQqQSbZe3QMPa1dUIa3Z3X0T8Kons1t58X9VyXkhJSM6uFUmLwFxoChxIQAvD_BwE

But for now, just see what the Hanna kit says your nitrate is. That's a good indicator of what's going on here.