Dinoflagellates - dinos a possible cure!? Follow along and see!

[Paullawr]

Sounds great. I have read that sodium or potassium nitrate is used to raise NO3. Their are people that favor S or P . Having difficultly deciding which direction to take and when. What do you suggest?

I use potassium nitrate. For basically the same reasons that @drawman uses sodium the potassium element isn't enough to ever become overdosed. What potassium is in the water is readily absorbed by corals helping with improved colouration.

I do though use sodium phosphate for the P balance. Again the sodium added is minuscule and nothing a smal water change would t take care of.

If really worried remove what you add from tank and replace with fresh h20.

Honestly though will be fine.

So no Osteo dinos for two months. Some amphidium hanging in but not sufficient to create even a bubble let alone Dino poo stains on surface.

Talking of which been three weeks sand free.

Had to scrub tonnes of hair algae off rocks over last week, it went nuts. Enough left to filter water.

 

[mcarroll]

So no Osteo dinos for two months. Some amphidium hanging in but not sufficient to create even a bubble let alone Dino poo stains on surface.

Talking of which been three weeks sand free.

Had to scrub tonnes of hair algae off rocks over last week, it went nuts. Enough left to filter water.

This is great news!!!

 

[Cscultho]

Definitely get that scope ($12 – easy peasy!) but you can pretty safely assume they are co-habitating. That seems to be a somewhat common stage for lots of algae and this is one of the main ways that N makes its way back into the ecosystem.

Keep encouraging it!

Dumb question here @mcarroll....Im receiving my $12 scope today so what do i look at under the scope? sample of the water or the algae itself??

My P&N are still elevated for the last week or so 0.1 & 20ish respectively. Im still getting every other day a slight dusting of what i believe are stringy web-like algae Dinos and then i stir the sand bed up and they go away for another day or 2....Not sure where to go from here? My UV has been running strong for several months....I just introduced into my DT some cheato to try and outcompete the dino bloom....hope this works

 

[mcarroll]

Look at anything and everything.

Definitely look at a sample of any algae blooms – especially the dino's – so we can hopefully confirm what kind(s) and if there's anything else with them.

Also try scraping the glass.....sampling in the sand bed or from the live rock....sample the water column....etc.

You will eventually want some cover slips,BTW.

 

[Cscultho]

Does anyone with Dinos have a UV sterilizer running and it not showing any results, I'm fixing to purchase a very high dollar UV unit to try and battle these dinos

Ive been running a 24w UV in my 55g and it doesnt seem to help a whole lot in my case.

Ive always wondered if UV truely does help? The sun is the biggest UV source and still oceans frequently breakout with dino blooms?

 

[Velcro]

Ive been running a 24w UV in my 55g and it doesnt seem to help a whole lot in my case.

Ive always wondered if UV truely does help? The sun is the biggest UV source and still oceans frequently breakout with dino blooms?

If the sun produced anywhere near the type of concentrated UV-C (that wasn't filtered by the atmosphere) we'd have some real problems.

 

[Cscultho]

Look at anything and everything.

Definitely look at a sample of any algae blooms – especially the dino's – so we can hopefully confirm what kind(s) and if there's anything else with them.

Also try scraping the glass.....sampling in the sand bed or from the live rock....sample the water column....etc.

You will eventually want some cover slips,BTW.

what's interesting is the algae in my tank doesnt creep onto my glass. it is right now only on the sand bed and as the day goes on i can start to see tiny bubbles accumulate all over the rocks. Its at that point i start blowing things around and stirring the sand. I dont want the dinos to take hold like they did a month ago.

One interesting note, when my dino breakout came on strong about 3-weeks ago I started double dosing N&P and about a day or 2 later the dinos began to turn white and subside. Ever since that point my algae has not been as strong but it still lingers....

 

[mcarroll]

There's no cure here......heading back to Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether?

 

[chevegan]

sorry for the crappy quality. quickly picked up a 12 dollar microscope and my cell. need an id to see if the nitrate and phosphate method will work. Mostly on my sand and go away every night.

 

[mcarroll]

@chevegan it would be awesome if you could post in Dinoflagellates – Are You Tired Of Battling Altogether? instead.

This thread doesn't cover microscope use or nutrient control.....this is the "miracle cure" thread. Better off not posting here.

 

[sfin52]

I think it's virtually impossible to be 100% sure they won't be back no matter what you do so in my view the option is to clean up and sterilize everything (tank and equipment) as much as possible, with bleach and fresh water, run the tank on FW for several days and go from there. Old sand has to go. Rocks, they have to go too unfortunately, unless you do some bleach/acid/fresh water treatment to them and take your chances. I would think what becomes critical at that point is not to re introduce the bug. No old sand/rocks, dip corals and fish, all that. Try to have good bacteria, algae, good critters well established before introducing fish and corals. And yes, pray for the best...

I honestly think we are seeing this massive increase in dino invasions because we import the bugs in frags and rocks and because we muck around with our tanks too much (the myth of the perfect parameters, zero nitrates and phosphates, we dose all kinds of things, we see some algae so we get rid of them eliminating competition) creating conditions for them to become dominant. That's my current state of mind. In my tank, right now, no matter what I do, I can't get any algae! Even if I overfeed, dose nitrates. Nothing. Green is nowhere to be seen. Water has never been clearer. The other day I realized 2 or 3 weeks had gone by without me having to clean the glasses.

I remember reading someplace that the old reefs believed that having some algae in the tank was a sign of a healthy tank. We now view any algae in the DT as a bad thing. Maybe we should revisit this idea.

 

[sfin52]

Do we know for sure that dinos enter the water column at lights out or do they retract into the sand?

Depends on type

 

[drawman]

A quick update for anyone interested. It has been over 22 days since I finished my bleach dosing regimen and thankfully still no signs of dinos. I have made it a point to do pretty much nothing with this tank other than keep the ATO filled. I have also been dosed Microbacter7 and some phytoplankton a couple of times but that's about it. The reason being is that I wanted to see if it would be successful while trying to minimize the risk of reintroduction. Nothing used will go back in this tank without going through a bleach bath first. I think the smallest thing could potentially risk reintroduction (ie testing syringes, algae scrapers, etc.) or at least I am treating it that way.

Dinos had decimated my acros in this tank before I decided to bleach dose so really the only coral I have left is a small hammer coral frag. It has browned some since the bleach dosing but is so much more open than before I started and overall looks so much better (I wouldn't doubt dinos and toxins were irritating it). Snails have all done well and pods are still present in the tank. Overall I'm at a good spot as I was pretty much ready for the teardown.

My next step will be to do a big water change in the near future and get parameters back on track. Once everything is where I want it to be I will add some test coral.

 

[scardall]

Can fish introduce Dino's? Or maybe a clam? PO3= 0ppm PO4 = .06ppm alk. 6.5dkh average Ca. 420ppm Ph 8.16 to 8.51 Dosing NOPOX and Amino's WT Hay??? If you don't do water changes for a long period could that bring the dino's
?

 

[drawman]

Can fish introduce Dino's? Or maybe a clam? PO3= 0ppm PO4 = .06ppm alk. 6.5dkh average Ca. 420ppm Ph 8.16 to 8.51 Dosing NOPOX and Amino's WT Hay??? If you don't do water changes for a long period could that bring the dino's
?

Anything with a drop of water sure could. A lot of people experience blooms after water changes.

 

[sfin52]

That metro sounds interesting. Will look into it. Buying a UV is likely not in the cards.

I'm on my third day of metro and I'm stating to see some coralline algae in areas coming back. I was instructed to run gfo and I'm doing and I have stripped all phosphate out of the tank. Another reason to remove the gfo. Seems like I've been doing all the wrong things.

 

[scardall]

Anything with a drop of water sure could. A lot of people experience blooms after water changes.

Getting very minor out breaks is normal for me. never last more than a week or so, with a copapod population increase. This time Dino's hit me like a nuclear bomb. A turkey baster is literally saving my corals. My LED lighting is 3 years old now. The only thing that I'm aware of that changed alot from normal was my alk. was 5.9dkh for months (old Test kit told me it was 7dkh for 2 of those past months) New Hanna put me on to the alk. issue. I'm wondering could this be a major contributor of this out break?

 

[drawman]

Getting very minor out breaks is normal for me. never last more than a week or so, with a copapod population increase. This time Dino's hit me like a nuclear bomb. A turkey baster is literally saving my corals. My LED lighting is 3 years old now. The only thing that I'm aware of that changed alot from normal was my alk. was 5.9dkh for months (old Test kit told me it was 7dkh for 2 of those past months) New Hanna put me on to the alk. issue. I'm wondering could this be a major contributor of this out break?

What are your PO4 and NO3 levels at? When PO4 hits zero that can be a huge driver of outbreaks.

Also I would verify that Alk value with another test kit. The reagents could be off and I would hate to see you overcorrect especially if everything is doing well.

 

[sfin52]

I know this is going to sound crazy. When I first started my reef I was using tap water. I never had a Dino problem I had hair algae. So I switched to ro water and running gfo and my hair algae disappeared. Fast forward 8 months I stated to have I now know is Dino's. Been dealing with it ever since and can't have much clean up crew either.

I'm setting up a refugium and going back to tap. We'll see how it goes.

 

[scardall]

What are your PO4 and NO3 levels at? When PO4 hits zero that can be a huge driver of outbreaks.

Also I would verify that Alk value with another test kit. The reagents could be off and I would hate to see you overcorrect especially if everything is doing well.

PO4 = .06ppm NO3= 0ppm and I discovered the alk. issue because I bought a new Hanna alk. tester 1 month ago. I had a bad kit previous to this one.