Dinoflagellates! What should I do?

[Nano Gabe]

Hey so I’ve been reefing for about 2 years now and I’ve had dinoflagellates before but this outbreak seems a little worse then I’ve experienced. I went on vacation and went 11 days without a water change I typically do one every 7 days. When I got back the dinoflagellates were just starting to populate. I did my water change and vacuumed some of them off the top layer of sand. Within the next two days I noticed my soft corals such as leathers, gsp and zoa’s closed up and the Dinoflagellates were in full effect. I added fresh carbon, changed my filter pad and stirred the sand bed to get them in the water Column. The next day they came back and the corals were still closed, so I stirred the sand again. Today they are still present and I found a dead snail. I’ve read dinoflagellates can be toxic to invertebrates. Not sure what I should do now. I’ve read doing a 3 days blackout would help but I’ve done this before in my previous tanks and as soon as I turned the lights back on they came back.... I have a uv sterilizer that I got for free about 6 months ago from a friend but it seems like a cheaper model. I would appreciate some suggestions!

Another point is my tank naturally sits low in nitrate. Hardly ever detectable I don’t do anything fancy or chase numbers it’s just where the tank sits and I have read this also contributes to getting dinoflagellates.

I was thinking to add a larger bag of carbon to my tank to combat the toxins, run the uv, and do a 3 day blackout... so far this is all I can think of doing.

 

[Bryson.bobby]

Sounds like a good plan. I would also dose no3

 

[RandyC]

Do you have a microscope? Knowing what strain of dinos is key. A UV sterilizer will only work against those dinos that move about in the water column.

Also, a UV sterilizer will only work if properly sized for your tank. What model/brand do you have, what's its wattage and what is the total water volume of your tank?

 

[amazongb]

Are you running a skimmer? Refugium? If so, maybe remove the skimmer cup and lower the time of the refugium. I'm in the same boat and it's working. I'm also adding UV which you mention you are, which is good.

 

[Nano Gabe]

I am running a skimmer I was thinking it would help remove them from the water? While I’m doing the black out should I stir the sand to help get them in the water column? How badly will the blackout affect coral?

 

[Nano Gabe]

It’s 16w UV and a 45g tank

 

[3000kelvin]

I got hit with Dinos and followed the recipe card I linked below and it looks like I’m in the clear.

https://s3.amazonaws.com/brsinstructions/brsDrTims/DrTims_Dinoflagellate_Recipe_BRS.pdf

 

[Nano Gabe]

So I did the 3 day black out, added a nitrifying bacteria and shut down the skimmer. I was in the clear for about 1 week then they came back but it’s much more mild. I’ve been reading up on it and I’m getting some conflicting information some articles say the reason you got Dino’s is because of excess nutrients and to treat them like any other algae and to drop nutrients and phosphate... but other articles are saying that I need more nutrients and to increase phosphate. Well so far I’ve followed the theory that nutrients and phosphate is a good thing and I’ve tried giving some competition to the Dino’s with the nitrifying bacteria. That didn’t work so I’m thinking to run some gfo in a reactor and drop my phosphate level super low to see if that would work and if not then I’m going to Dino x route. The only reason I feel like it might be a phosphate issue is because I’m seeing some green algae on some of my rocks but I have a tang so that might be why I haven’t noticed the algae before.

 

[Aquanautical]

Yeah man I'm confused too I've read both as well about nitrates and phosphates. Right now I have some building up on the rock that is very high par (400-550). Been testing zero nitrates for a week right before they started establishing I don't know whether to raise them or to reduce feeding it's very confusing getting conflicting info

 

[Nano Gabe]

Yup I’m in the same boat and I did a 3 day black out they disappeared for about a week and then came back. I’m trying to lower phosphate right now with a reactor we’ll see how that works. I just feel like there’s no clear way of beating it. Like I said if this doesn’t work I’m done fighting I’m going to used the Dino x chemical and hopefully that takes care of it.

 

[saltyhog]

There are lots of things that look like dinos that aren't. IMO that's the reason some of the "cures" seem to work once in a while but usually don't. Dino X has not been very effective if you read the big thread in the Nuisance Algae forum. Blackouts and decreasing photoperiod can help but only if you have an appropriate UV running. One of the experts has kept dinos alive and happy in culture for many weeks without light. The reduced light can seem to make a few species that otherwise wouldn't, go in to the water column. This makes them susceptible to the UV. Some species like ostreopsis can be wiped out literally over night with UV. Others are hardly affected at all due to their lifestyle. A microscopic diagnosis is really important for most folks.

Almost universally dinos seem to happen in low nutrient situations. Dosing NO3 and PO4 helps. Keep NO3 above 5 and PO4 0.08-0.12. Dosing silicate can also help by increasing diatom numbers which can compete with the dinos. Biodiversity with pods and bacteria can help but you don't want to bottom out nutrients with them.

Good luck, this is one of the worst problems I've ever had in reefing. Visit the nuisance algae forum and post pictures there. Lots of guys/gals who know their stuff there. @taricha, @reeferfoxx

 

[reeferfoxx]

@Nano Gabe Do you have any pictures? Also, how was the tank fed during vacation and do you dose anything?

Typically nutrient deficiencies queue dino blooms but so do increased trace elements. If your phosphates are going up that can cause nitrates to fall creating almost an imbalance. Same goes for the opposite. High nitrates can lower phosphates. Black outs can help reduce the dino appearance but is a short lived bandaid. You have to get to the source. Since you are skimming, you can do some deep sandbed cleaning and micro bubbling to help lift and export any detritus that might be increasing phosphates. However, if you don't have a phosphate measurement, that may not be the problem.

 

[Scooter90254]

Just dealt with them a few months ago.
I tried everything but this is what worked.


Took off skimmer cup, fed heavy, added a 24w UV sterilizer, dosed bacteria and start dosing NO3 and PO4. No water changes.

Tank started getting a ton of Cyano and other algae. It looked terrible. But sure enough the Dino’s started to go away.

Once they were gone did a big water change and slowly brought the nutrients down.

Tank looks great now.