Dose Triton from another room with one dosing pump

[Brew12]

Finally got around to testing this concept. The POC worked so well that I went ahead and plumbed it into my DT:

I put the ALK and CA on one pump, MG on the other for now. I could have put all three (or more) on one pump, but I only ordered three solenoids for the test.
Rather than draw from an ATO reservoir (which is out in the garage), I ended up just running the "flush" line back into my sump. No need to worry about any kind of salinity swing that way.

This is about as good a visual I can provide on how it's working:

Each spike is either ALK or CA (they alternate) followed by a "flush" execution.
The dosing time and amount is controlled using an "OSC" (oscillate) command as you would for a normal dosing pump program. Except instead of turning on a pump, it opens the appropriate solenoid. Any time a solenoid is open, the dosing pump turns on. The "flush" procedure is based on a "Min Time" command - a virtual outlet is told to open any time either the CA or ALK are open, with an additional "Min Time" to ensure that the entire line gets flushed (the DOS defaults to 25ml/min when told to just be "on"). The actual "flush" solenoid is hooked up to that virtual outlet, but also told to remain closed if either of the other two are open. The net result of this is that it stays closed while dosing the additive, and opens as soon as it's closed - remaining open for the remainder of the "Min Time" defined. Finally; I added in sensors to check the container levels; if they are empty, the solenoid stays closed (and I get an alert).

In the POC, I had a flow meter on the "out" side of the pump, but it never registered any flow. I'm pretty sure (reading the docs) that is due to it requiring a minimum pressure/flow rate - and the dosing pump just isn't getting there. Ah well; I wanted the flow meter for my RO/DI anyways.

If all I were doing with this were dosing in 2-part like this, it likely wouldn't be worth it cost-wise. But I can extend this system to include the four Triton additives I'm planning on simply by purchasing the additional solenoids (and a 1Link in order to get two more 24V outlets; I have 2 open in my current setup currently). I also don't get all the detailed reporting that the DOS can support if you use the normal method of programming it. Had I not already had the DOS, I likely would have just picked up a BRS top-off dosing pump and adjusted the timing (cut the "open" time in half since it's a 50mL/day pump).

Very interesting concept. I would never do it with 2 part but I do like the idea for trace elements.

Right now I am dosing saturated Kalkwasser and I dose 60 times a day for stability. Once I reach the limit of what I can add safely because of evaporation I will start incorporating 2 part and let it dose many times throughout the day.
When I start dosing trace elements, I will likely just spend the $400 on another 4 head GHL doser. If I still used an Apex, I would seriously have to consider something like this. Nice work!

 

[DLHDesign]

I would never do it with 2 part but I do like the idea for trace elements.

The biggest concern I can think of with 2-part is with them blending, right? I've not seen any issue so far with the line not getting flushed enough, but I don't have anything in place right now to prevent mixing should a solenoid fail open. That's easily solved with a check-valve after each solenoid (as @67Incognito has drawn out in the original post). I have a bunch of these around; I just didn't add them in as I wanted to see how it did first (the odds of a solenoid failure in the near-term is low).

 

[Brew12]

The biggest concern I can think of with 2-part is with them blending, right? I've not seen any issue so far with the line not getting flushed enough, but I don't have anything in place right now to prevent mixing should a solenoid fail open. That's easily solved with a check-valve after each solenoid (as @67Incognito has drawn out in the original post). I have a bunch of these around; I just didn't add them in as I wanted to see how it did first (the odds of a solenoid failure in the near-term is low).

To me, the biggest concern is stability. I feel one of the biggest benefits of automated dosing is the ability to do many, small additions as opposed to a few larger additions each day.

I worry about that less with trace elements.

 

[DLHDesign]

I feel one of the biggest benefits of automated dosing is the ability to do many, small additions as opposed to a few larger additions each day.

I can see that. I'm actually doing some pretty small doses all throughout the day - 3.75mL of each additive every hour. There's plenty of room left in the day; I could easily cut the volume per dose in half (and double the number, obviously). I didn't do this because it would result in a slightly different total amount (either higher or lower) due to the inability to dose for sub-second times (understandable - that's not really a feature I would expect). My current dose time is 9s; cutting that in half would have to be either 4s or 5s. In either case; the dose time would drop from 1hr to 30min for each additive.

 

[reefwiser]

I run several dosers on my tank

If you are running Balling method which is what Triton uses you will need to run separate lines to the tank. As you cannot mix the chemicals in the lines as they will clog. The selnoids will have issues with the calcium and alk and would need to be cleaned on a regular basis. No this from the work I do in a food plant and dosing drains to keep Ph up in the sewer lines [emoji3]
One can spend a lot of time trying to do things that in practice are not a great idea.

 

[DLHDesign]

If you are running Balling method which is what Triton uses you will need to run separate lines to the tank. As you cannot mix the chemicals in the lines as they will clog.

That's the assumption that is being challenged, yes. The dosing line is being flushed with tank water until (conceptually) fully clear after every dose, so the chemicals never mix more than they would in the tank itself. During my POC tests, I used food coloring to visually identify how effective the flushing was and while a visual inspection does not really match a scientific measure, the lines were returned to clear (source water was clear) in between each dose. So while I don't claim that the line had totally cleared of the previous chemical, I do believe that the levels were reduced to the point where they would not conflict (that is; they were not significantly higher in concentration compared to what would be found in the tank itself).

Yes; cleaning the solenoids becomes a maintenance task. That is also going to be true of a dosing pump (if not as frequently, perhaps), so it's basically a wash. (See what I did there? <grin>) In any case; cleaning the solenoids is pretty easy - disconnect the solenoid from the dosing container, open it and the flush solenoid (which turns on the pump) and it'll be flushed with tank water. If needed, I could also pull it totally out of line, open it, and swish it around in some RO/DI. 1-2min per solenoid - something that could be done when refilling the dosing container.

 

[reefwiser]

Generally one doesn’t have to clean the lines but check for wear from the rollers squeezing the tubing over time.

When running cal thru a line then running alk you will no pretty fast if all the chemical is out of the line. [emoji3]
As someone who works with automated liquids a lot. I like to keep it simple. When the engineers do complicated stuff I end up having to take it all apart and make it simple again. [emoji3]

 

[Brew12]

That's the assumption that is being challenged, yes. The dosing line is being flushed with tank water until (conceptually) fully clear after every dose, so the chemicals never mix more than they would in the tank itself. During my POC tests, I used food coloring to visually identify how effective the flushing was and while a visual inspection does not really match a scientific measure, the lines were returned to clear (source water was clear) in between each dose. So while I don't claim that the line had totally cleared of the previous chemical, I do believe that the levels were reduced to the point where they would not conflict (that is; they were not significantly higher in concentration compared to what would be found in the tank itself).

Yes; cleaning the solenoids becomes a maintenance task. That is also going to be true of a dosing pump (if not as frequently, perhaps), so it's basically a wash. (See what I did there? <grin>) In any case; cleaning the solenoids is pretty easy - disconnect the solenoid from the dosing container, open it and the flush solenoid (which turns on the pump) and it'll be flushed with tank water. If needed, I could also pull it totally out of line, open it, and swish it around in some RO/DI. 1-2min per solenoid - something that could be done when refilling the dosing container.

He does raise an interesting concern. I would run a scale test alternating between the Alk and Calc with the flushing in between quite a few times. See if the chemicals stick to the inside of the tube. If it does, the tube will clog pretty quickly.

 

[jakeh22]

Dude whatttt