Dosing questions, trying to get it going without FLS input monthly.

[RyanTheSquid]

My LFS helped me with a dosing schedule based off me bringing in spin tests in the past. I'm now doing my own salifert testing for Mag, Calcium, Alk, and Nitrates. Just the last few days I am trying daily testing to see my nutrient uptake. Recently added 13 frags to my 40g all in one tank so I am expecting more uptake but really don't know how much to expect. So far, a lot more than I expected, unless I am testing wrong somehow. The text at the top of the note was my old dosing, I want to move to daily dosing for more consistency but I don't know what that looks like yet, and I don't want to have to do daily dosing for long. It seems my mag and cal got low and I am trying to bring them up. The test from the 12 was before adding 15mL of the mag and I saw a drop in mag in under 24 hours after taking that test. Any input would be great. For reference, I only have 3 hard corals, all small frags, a maxima clam.

 

[coralboi56]

Whatever you figure out, I HIGHLY recommend an automated doser as compared to hand dosing. Doesers are more calculated than humans and can dispense the same amount you want over a 24 hour period, making the corals MUCH happier. I have an sps dominated nano and was dosing 30mL alk, 30 mL calc, and 50 mL mag per week via hand dosing but when I switched to an automated doser, the Acros are a lot more colorful and the polyp extension on the other sps is phenomenal.

 

[RyanTheSquid]

Whatever you figure out, I HIGHLY recommend an automated doser as compared to hand dosing. Doesers are more calculated than humans and can dispense the same amount you want over a 24 hour period, making the corals MUCH happier. I have an sps dominated nano and was dosing 30mL alk, 30 mL calc, and 50 mL mag per week via hand dosing but when I switched to an automated doser, the Acros are a lot more colorful and the polyp extension on the other sps is phenomenal.

Those dosers are far out of my budget right now sadly, thats the dream one day though. I'm running this 40g AIO, coming from a 25g AIO and the dosing has increased quite a bit, like I said i want to go to daily dosing for more consistency that I can get but I'm not sure how quickly I can safely raise these lower numbers. And I find it odd my mag would drop after doing more than double the usual dose.

 

[CHSUB]

Magnesium is not readily used, only around 8% of calcium consumption. What you are seeing is test error. WC will maintain it without testing or dosing until your calcium consumption becomes huge. If you want to save money and dose daily, get a brs Drew’s Doser and a cheap timer and dose kalkwasser nightly. You could do this for a couple of years before you would need adjustment and maybe never. You could do this for under a $100 and maintain both Alk and calcium while elevating ph during nights when ph drifts low.

 

[RyanTheSquid]

Magnesium is not readily used, only around 8% of calcium consumption. What you are seeing is test error. WC will maintain it without testing or dosing until your calcium consumption becomes huge. If you want to save money and dose daily, get a brs Drew’s Doser and a cheap timer and dose kalkwasser nightly. You could do this for a couple of years before you would need adjustment and maybe never. You could do this for under a $100 and maintain both Alk and calcium while elevating ph during nights when ph drifts low.

What do you mean when you say magnesium is not readily used? I do the salifert tests the same way each time, I think part of the issue was water level was low when i did the test on the 12th and I topped off the tank and test on the 13th. That being said, I still need to dose calcium and magnesium on a regular basis, correct? Ive been doing so for about 2 years now and havent had numbers go out of whack.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

I do not recommend home testing for magnesium because it is too inaccurate to guide dosing.

I recommend just dosing it at 5-10% of the ppm of calcium dosed:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/just-say-no-to-magnesium-testing-rmm-is-born.1017528/

 

[exnisstech]

I've never tested magnesium. I test alk, NO3 and PO4. Calcium every month or two because I've never had to make adjustment. This tank runs on AFR only. I use a doser because my demand is high and I was also forgetting to dose. When consumption was low I dosed manually. AFR is slow to release so manual dosing is perfectly fine in many tanks. I doesn't get much easier.

 

[RyanTheSquid]

I've never tested magnesium. I test alk, NO3 and PO4. Calcium every month or two because I've never had to make adjustment. This tank runs on AFR only. I use a doser because my demand is high and I was also forgetting to dose. When consumption was low I dosed manually. AFR is slow to release so manual dosing is perfectly fine in many tanks. I doesn't get much easier.

I have AFR, stopped dosing at LFS input. I guess he is a sales man and I don't think he stocks AFR. How do I find a baseline for dosing it?

 

[Uncle99]

Your SG posted was 1.027.
This can skew test results.
Since your not far out, just dose daily pro-rata to your twice weekly and before testing, ensure 1.026 SG.

So daily, that would amount to 2ml per day for Alk and 2-3 mls per week on MG.

Then retest.

Your tank is looking good so stick with what is working, just make your dosing as frequent as possible. This lowers fluctuations which is a BIG plus.

Test Alk daily.
Test N and P weekly
Test CA monthly.

Record findings and look for trends.
Don’t worry about every test result, work with trend.

Looks nice.

 

[exnisstech]

I have AFR, stopped dosing at LFS input. I guess he is a sales man and I don't think he stocks AFR. How do I find a baseline for dosing it?

You'll need to determine your daily alk consumption then dose to replenish that. TM has a recommended dosage calculator but is by water volume instead of consumption which I don't like so I choose not to use it. They also recommend to dose by calcium consumption instead of alk which I do not agree with. My method may not be the best but what I do is once I know my consumption I use a calculator like the one at BRS and choose ESV 2 part as my supplement. Then I multiply the recommended dosage x 1.7 and use that as my dosage. IIRC @Randy Holmes-Farley recommended that formula when I asked how much AFR it takes to match ESV 2part strength. I haven't been able to find a calculator for AFR based on alk daily consumption.
I'm not a chemistry person but this has worked for me on the tank I posted for over 2 years.

 

[RyanTheSquid]

Your SG posted was 1.027.
This can skew test results.
Since your not far out, just dose daily pro-rata to your twice weekly and before testing, ensure 1.026 SG.

So daily, that would amount to 2ml per day for Alk and 2-3 mls per week on MG.

Then retest.

Your tank is looking good so stick with what is working, just make your dosing as frequent as possible. This lowers fluctuations which is a BIG plus.

Test Alk daily.
Test N and P weekly
Test CA monthly.

Record findings and look for trends.
Don’t worry about every test result, work with trend.

Looks nice.

The salinity was tested with their spin test and the water had cooled by then and sat for an hour or so. I test it at home and its around 1.025. And just to make sure I'm understanding, you're suggesting I dose AFR daily, in addition to the dosing I do on Mon/Tues/Thurs/Fri? I really want to turn that dosing into a daily regimen, so just divide the total dosed by 7 and that shpuld be fine, right? From the sounds of @Randy Holmes-Farley post, I should be decreasing my mag dosing substantially?

 

[Uncle99]

The salinity was tested with their spin test and the water had cooled by then and sat for an hour or so. I test it at home and its around 1.025. And just to make sure I'm understanding, you're suggesting I dose AFR daily, in addition to the dosing I do on Mon/Tues/Thurs/Fri? I really want to turn that dosing into a daily regimen, so just divide the total dosed by 7 and that shpuld be fine, right? From the sounds of @Randy Holmes-Farley post, I should be decreasing my mag dosing substantially?

What I’m saying is dose smaller quantities more frequently is better than larger infrequent ones.

I understood (maybe incorrectly) that you dosed AFR twice a week at 7ml. So 14ml per week or 2ml per day.

Not sure why you’d dose MG if your using AFR.

You should be able to dose Alk CA and MG daily to maintain your reef. AFR has all three.

I think maybe your test results are out.

Or Maybe I’m just confused.

I run MG at 1450ppm.

 

[RyanTheSquid]

The salinity was tested with their spin test and the water had cooled by then and sat for an hour or so. I test it at home and its around 1.025. And just to make sure I'm understanding, you're suggesting I dose AFR daily, in addition to the dosing I do on Mon/Tues/Thurs/Fri? I really want to turn that dosing into a daily regimen, so just divide the total dosed by 7 and that shpuld be fine, right? From the sounds of @Randy Holmes-Farley post, I should be decreasing my mag dosing substantially?

What I’m saying is dose smaller quantities more frequently is better than larger infrequent ones.

I understood (maybe incorrectly) that you dosed AFR twice a week at 7ml. So 14ml per week or 2ml per day.

I run MG at 1450ppm.

No AFR at all right now, it's being reccomended. I would rather a single product dosing than 2 or more. Makes it easy.

 

[Uncle99]

No AFR at all right now, it's being reccomended. I would rather a single product dosing than 2 or more. Makes it easy.

Great.
The starting point if I remember was 5ml per 100 litres tested twice weekly. You should be able to see the uptake. Adjust dosage from there.

I discontinued AFR as I could never get Alk or CA to my desired level.

I prefer to manage each separately with my $80 three head Doser.

Two part was Way way easier for me.

Now I dose on the hour, every day.

I fill once a week and let the Doser do the rest.

 

[RyanTheSquid]

No AFR at all right now, it's being reccomended. I would rather a single product dosing than 2 or more. Makes it easy.

Great.
The starting point if I remember was 5ml per 100 litres tested twice weekly. You should be able to see the uptake. Adjust dosage from there.

I discontinued AFR as I could never get Alk or CA to my desired level.

I prefer to manage each separately with my $80 three head Doser.

Two part was Way way easier for me.

Now I dose on the hour, every day.

I fill once a week and let the Doser do the rest.

I want to get there eventually but have very limited space, and I am just trying to get into the testing and chemestry of it all. Eventually haha.

 

[Uncle99]

Each method is different and has pros and cons.
I have specific levels I keep and AFR just didn’t get me there.

Many support it and have great success, but, both are better to deploy frequently, like an ATO, no way to keep salinity pinned without that tool.

 

[Mebbid]

Check out Jebao dosers on amazon. They are very affordable and for their price are pretty good.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Each method is different and has pros and cons.
I have specific levels I keep and AFR just didn’t get me there.

Many support it and have great success, but, both are better to deploy frequently, like an ATO, no way to keep salinity pinned without that tool.

What parameter did not get where you want?

 

[Uncle99]

What parameter did not get where you want?

Just a matter of preference I’d say.

For me I could not dial in Alk (it was fluxing) and MG seemed low, but no idea why. Testing error? Incorrect mix? IDK.

I wanted to try mixing up my own as it was cheaper. So AFR seemed worth a try.

At the end of the day, it was easier just to revert back to premix two part, the concentration seems same each and every time and stays in solution, I can target each independently but, is more expensive.

I’ve never had success mixing powders.

Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

My targets are
Alk 11dkh
CA 465 ppm
MG 1450 ppm

Using Seachem fusion 1 and 2 seven years.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley Verified Community Expert]

Like any system, AFR can only estimate how much mag any tank uses, and they estimate just below my 5-10% of calcium recommendation. Especially if coralline is a significant user of alk, it may be short on magnesium added.

It should be able to match alk demand, however. :)