Fallow Period FAIL

[kerbfish]

Depressing…..

i just added fish into DT after treating ich outbreak. Technically I did fallow period of 75 days. I added my only tang back on day 77 (powder blue). Fish looked better than ever going back in, colors were richer…no parasites. 3 days later I see two spots on pectoral fin. Today possible one spot on belly.

Looks to me that fallow did not work. All fish were removed treated by copper power at about 2ppm for 30 days. Antibiotic for various infections that my male anthias developed in treatment. Last time I had to take out every last rock to catch fish…..coral came out for a few hours. Did vacuum some areas under rocks to address any possible anoxic zones where cysts may be hiding.

reef medic hasnt worked for me in past. This is the earliest i have seen any of my outbreaks. All fish survived last treatment except leopard wrasse after 2 months.

Only added several coral frags during fallow. Which I know is a risk. All inverts i brought pre quarantined.

anything i can do besides do everything all over again…? What is most likely source of ich in this situation. Dont chime in unless you have been through this please. Hahaha.

i ordered a dna test kit too see if i can confirm what i have even though it doesn’t really matter. I wondered if in a miracle i could catch powder blue and it was only one infected (was still carrying parasite) if that could work….(I already know answer) ahhhh!!!!! Could slight sub therapeutic have caused something to slip through on powder ?

any input welcome

 

[Spare time]

30 days is not the minemum required for marine ich (45 days)

 

[Jay Hemdal]

Depressing…..

i just added fish into DT after treating ich outbreak. Technically I did fallow period of 75 days. I added my only tang back on day 77 (powder blue). Fish looked better than ever going back in, colors were richer…no parasites. 3 days later I see two spots on pectoral fin. Today possible one spot on belly.

Looks to me that fallow did not work. All fish were removed treated by copper power at about 2ppm for 30 days. Antibiotic for various infections that my male anthias developed in treatment. Last time I had to take out every last rock to catch fish…..coral came out for a few hours. Did vacuum some areas under rocks to address any possible anoxic zones where cysts may be hiding.

reef medic hasnt worked for me in past. This is the earliest i have seen any of my outbreaks. All fish survived last treatment except leopard wrasse after 2 months.

Only added several coral frags during fallow. Which I know is a risk. All inverts i brought pre quarantined.

anything i can do besides do everything all over again…? What is most likely source of ich in this situation. Dont chime in unless you have been through this please. Hahaha.

i ordered a dna test kit too see if i can confirm what i have even though it doesn’t really matter. I wondered if in a miracle i could catch powder blue and it was only one infected (was still carrying parasite) if that could work….(I already know answer) ahhhh!!!!! Could slight sub therapeutic have caused something to slip through on powder ?

any input welcome

That's too bad. You did everything pretty much by the book. Are you confident of the diagnosis of ich?

Some people find that copper power at 2 ppm (the label instructions are at that level) isn't high enough and they treat at 2.5 I'm always hesitant to go against label instructions, so I recommend coppersafe, which out of the bottle is dosed at 2.5

Any other way your biosecurity could have failed? I had one case where the fallow period failed, and then digging deeper, I discovered the person had left a goby in the tank because "they couldn't catch it" (grin). Other biosecurity failures are a bit more subtle - adding some coral or CUC during the fallow period, etc.

In the end, 75 days fallow is way longer than it truly needs to be, at 81 F., people are going as short as 45 days. Remember the 75 day period was a result of a single study where ich tomonts were found to be viable that long in cool xeric cultures....and that simply isn't the same as in our aquariums.

Jay

 

[Tamberav]

What temperature was the tank?

Some have had good luck with an experimental UV + peroxide dosing in the display...

How To - Peroxide (H2O2) dosing for parasites in reef tank

***Current dosing recommendation for active outbreaks, using 3% hydrogen peroxide*** (a TLDR for people who just need to know how to get started) Week 1: 1mL/8g, 3x per day Week 2: 1mL/5g, 3x per day Week 3: 1mL/5g, 3x per day, plus overnight dosing. Continue the week 3 dosing regimen for a...

humble.fish

I would confirm it is actually ich though.

 

[threebuoys]

That's too bad. You did everything pretty much by the book. Are you confident of the diagnosis of ich?

Some people find that copper power at 2 ppm (the label instructions are at that level) isn't high enough and they treat at 2.5 I'm always hesitant to go against label instructions, so I recommend coppersafe, which out of the bottle is dosed at 2.5

Any other way your biosecurity could have failed? I had one case where the fallow period failed, and then digging deeper, I discovered the person had left a goby in the tank because "they couldn't catch it" (grin). Other biosecurity failures are a bit more subtle - adding some coral or CUC during the fallow period, etc.

In the end, 75 days fallow is way longer than it truly needs to be, at 81 F., people are going as short as 45 days. Remember the 75 day period was a result of a single study where ich tomonts were found to be viable that long in cool xeric cultures....and that simply isn't the same as in our aquariums.

Jay

I don't know when a change might have been made by the vendor, but, the Copper Power bottle now specifies 2.5 ppm and recommends 1 ounce per 20 gallons of water. I always use the Hanna check to zero in on 2.5 for QT.

 

[Jay Hemdal]

I don't know when a change might have been made by the vendor, but, the Copper Power bottle now specifies 2.5 ppm and recommends 1 ounce per 20 gallons of water. I always use the Hanna check to zero in on 2.5 for QT.

The bottle I tested was from back in April I think, but I bought it online, so it could have been older.
Jay

 

[jmichaelh7]

Is it possible you cross contaminated the display??

I mean, this is one of the stories that gives everyone false hope .. but quarantine does work i would like to believe

 

[mehaffydr]

I see a couple of concerns
1. You say about 2ppm on the copper did it ever go below 2ppm, My understanding is if it goes below the 2 ppm you have to start over
2. You say you added several coral. Did you dip the coral? Could something have come in on the coral?

 

[jmichaelh7]

I see a couple of concerns
1. You say about 2ppm on the copper did it ever go below 2ppm, My understanding is if it goes below the 2 ppm you have to start over
2. You say you added several coral. Did you dip the coral? Could something have come in on the coral?

Good point. Coral need to be quarantined - fallow

 

[kerbfish]

Thanks for the response @Jay Hemdal . Yes, 100% no fish were left in. I also believed that 75 days was way more than necessary in the system. I didnt raise to 81 because by time i saw study i was already way in. Yes it did dip below 2.0 at some point perhaps, but i was being instructed Drreef @ quarantined fish whom i get all pre treated fish from.

Humble fish also didnt make a big to do about treating at 2.0 and said you could drop to as low as 1.5 on his site. I did dip all coral going in….but yes that could have been a culprit.

lastly its not confirmed ich yet. Just im getting kinda used to it. This same fish was completely covered before i treated and it cleared up quick. Im looking at one spot on body. And suspect 3 spots on pectorals.

 

[LAReefer4Life]

Sorry for your troubles. Maybe get some photos and post? As you mentioned it might not be ich. Adding corals during the fallow period seems like the only culprit. Adding anything wet can theoretically bring parasites.

 

[LeftyReefer]

I had success doing a 90 day fallow recently.
originally planned to do 76 days. About 30 days in, I found out that increasing temps can speed up the ICH life cycle, so I slowly increased temps to 81F in my DT and decided to go longer than originally planned. Went 90 days and returned all my QT'd fish to the DT. I also ordered two new quarantined fish from Dr. Reef, including a new tang. I put those fish directly into the DT and all fish remained ICH free. So fallow periods can work. Mine did, but I went 90 days just to be safe. I figured I had gone to all the trouble for 2 and half months, so another 2 weeks wouldn't hurt.

 

[kerbfish]

I had success doing a 90 day fallow recently.
originally planned to do 76 days. About 30 days in, I found out that increasing temps can speed up the ICH life cycle, so I slowly increased temps to 81F in my DT and decided to go longer than originally planned. Went 90 days and returned all my QT'd fish to the DT. I also ordered two new quarantined fish from Dr. Reef, including a new tang. I put those fish directly into the DT and all fish remained ICH free. So fallow periods can work. Mine did, but I went 90 days just to be safe. I figured I had gone to all the trouble for 2 and half months, so another 2 weeks wouldn't hurt.

Great to hear it worked out! I hope mine is false alarm. Just to be clear I dont believe was from Dr. Reef. I actually ordered one fish from another vendor…naso….fish never ate….and died from ich, powder was covered before there were visible signs on naso.

but i was nervous cause i just lost a fish in Quarantine. We’ll see how things develop…

 

[kerbfish]

Anyone have any concerns about running 81 degrees on mixed reef ??

 

[LeftyReefer]

Anyone have any concerns about running 81 degrees on mixed reef ??

My tank seemed fine. Only thing I noticed was a increase in my daily ATO usage due to more evaporation. Corals and inverts (snails and shrimp) were fine.

 

[SMSREEF]

Humble fish also didnt make a big to do about treating at 2.0 and said you could drop to as low as 1.5 on his site. I did dip all coral going in….but yes that could have been a culprit.

This is from humble’s site:

 

[Steve180]

30 days is not the minemum required for marine ich (45 days)

30 day Copper treatment is correct. 45 days fallow period is recommended but he went 77 days

 

[kerbfish]

H2O2 dosing looks interesting although i don't own a UV Reactor to help out.

 

[Spare time]

30 day Copper treatment is correct. 45 days fallow period is recommended but he went 77 days

Ah ok so I am a bit confused. The fish were treated in copper for 30 days and kept out of the tank for 77 days? The ich could have lived through the 30 days of copper which is my concern.

 

[kerbfish]

Mostly correct, technically first fish went in on day 75….tang on 77. And i would say copper prob was even a few days over 30. Again, I did not treat full strength but maybe i am unlucky with copper resistant strain….keep posted once i confirm its ich.