Fishes Cycle No Nitrites

[Bubblebass]

excellent


Neon
when ammonia moves down, no zero required, in the presence of surface area to attach to, you're cycled. no zero needed

we can find total confirmation in this way:

-ammonia motion down, from any prior setpoint, after dosing suspected live bacteria is indeed done by that method there's no other removal option within a short timeframe, bac were precisely matched to this param /nh3 for us is all we care about nowadays, its all MACNA cares about when starting a massive convention of skip cycle.

-nitrite can be skipped as well, a little nitrate shown here, anything other than hard zero, confirms us two for three

its ok to wait until all params line up, but by then we're waiting out a regular cycling chart not written for bottle bac speed cycling; we are paying extra to wait 30 days?

Am I reading that you’d add fish to a tank that measured ammonia because it’s moving down?

 

[NeonRabbit221B]

Am I reading that you’d add fish to a tank that measured ammonia because it’s moving down?

He lost me there too. I would wait until you have 0 ammonia before adding anything alive. I think what he was trying to get at is that the tank is "cycled" once you see a measurable drop in ammonia

 

[brandon429]

your tank here

and every tank there, likely meets the timeframes stated on the directions of the bottle bac.

why the revolt??



in the end each of us is debating whether or not live bottle bac were dead/dud, its even written here.

in the end all we're debating is if a rating of .25 or .5 means anything we can bank on in reefing. (we show the movement down is all that's required for full proofing...that and surface area to attach to for bacteria performing this motion)

clearly after reading the thread, we only add fish after proofing and timeframes.

we show how to prove that bottle bac are nearly always alive and fine, and that no cycle sticks or stalls in reefing.

I have never, ever ever seen dead bottle bac in my work threads *although Dr. Reef has seen two or so in his testing. unrefrigerated fritz was one.

 

[schuby]

I used Dr Tim's One and Only to cycle my 150 gal tank last year. If I remember correctly, you are supposed to raise the ammonia level to 2ppm and then add the appropriate size bottle of One and Only. Did you do this? I don't understand how you got to a level of 4ppm of ammonia. That much ammonia, more than 2ppm, can stall the entire process.

I also use One and Only every time I set up my QT tank for new fish. Works every time.

 

[Bubblebass]

be sure and click the link, we already have.


we proofed the system before adding, of course. We dont use the same proofs you do.

your tank here

and every tank there, meets the timeframes stated on the directions of the bottle bac.

why the revolt??



in the end each of us is debating whether or not live bottle bac were dead/dud, its even written here.

in the end all we're debating is if a rating of .25 or .5 means anything we can bank on in reefing. (we show the movement down is all that's required for full proofing...that and surface area to attach to for bacteria performing this motion)

clearly after reading the thread, we only add fish after proofing and timeframes.

we show how to prove that bottle bac are nearly always alive and fine, and that no cycle sticks or stalls in reefing.

I have never, ever ever seen dead bottle bac in my work threads *although Dr. Reef has seen two or so in his testing. unrefrigerated fritz was one.

No revolt, friend. Just trying to understand what you are doing, as I know you have a high level of experience here.

 

[Bubblebass]

I used Dr Tim's One and Only to cycle my 150 gal tank last year. If I remember correctly, you are supposed to raise the ammonia level to 2ppm and then add the appropriate size bottle of One and Only. Did you do this? I don't understand how you got to a level of 4ppm of ammonia. That much ammonia, more than 2ppm, can stall the entire process.

I also use One and Only every time I set up my QT tank for new fish. Works every time.

I followed his instructions explicitly. They are a bit confusing where it says in one part “do not add ammonia until you get a reading of 2 ppm” and then in another area “skip the next addition of ammonia if nitrate or ammonia is over 5ppm”. At this point, no matter what, I think I’ll just wait it out.

 

[92Miata]

Go out an buy a bottle of BioSpira at petco. Pour it in the tank. Be done with it.

The vast majority of these "I'm a week into dosing ammonia and my tank hasn't done anything" threads are Dr. Tim's. Either his stuff is really slow - or they've got some sort of transport issue that's killing/maiming their bacteria - because every other brand seems to just work - and his is often this big multi-week process that often seems to take longer than the old fashioned way.

 

[jgirardnrg]

Go out an buy a bottle of BioSpira at petco. Pour it in the tank. Be done with it.

The vast majority of these "I'm a week into dosing ammonia and my tank hasn't done anything" threads are Dr. Tim's. Either his stuff is really slow - or they've got some sort of transport issue that's killing/maiming their bacteria - because every other brand seems to just work - and his is often this big multi-week process that often seems to take longer than the old fashioned way.

^^This

 

[NeonRabbit221B]

^^This haha

 

[Bubblebass]

Go out an buy a bottle of BioSpira at petco. Pour it in the tank. Be done with it.

The vast majority of these "I'm a week into dosing ammonia and my tank hasn't done anything" threads are Dr. Tim's. Either his stuff is really slow - or they've got some sort of transport issue that's killing/maiming their bacteria - because every other brand seems to just work - and his is often this big multi-week process that often seems to take longer than the old fashioned way.

I’m going to do ^^^ This

 

[brandon429]

How to unstick any seemingly stuck cycle

non digital ammonia test kit readings (api, Red Sea, nyos, seachem badges) make you think you aren’t cycled when indeed you are if you owned a $200 expensive seneye meter, you’d never be doubting your cycle status. since .01% of the reefing population owns these, we need a way to help the...

www.reef2reef.com

I referenced the wrong link above, that added to confusion

that one right there is where we unstick cycles using ammonia motion, w some examples on file building up.

Biospira is awesome, but, lets check your current setup I bet that extra purchase isn't necessary.

 

[schuby]

I'd recommend getting your ammonia down to 2ppm or less. To do this, you could remove 50% of your water and then put in 50% fresh salt water (fully remove 50% first to get full dilution effect). From what I've read, the stalled cycle, due to too much ammonia, can take a very long time to complete. Once ammonia gets to zero, then you can add more ammonia (maybe even up to 2ppm). After nitrites read zero again, your tank will be able to support just about any fish-level bio-load.

 

[brandon429]

I am very against redundant bottle bac purchases in reefing its my recent new soapbox.


*if this tank cannot demo ammonia movement in the current arrangement we want that on file, we think this cannot occur.

how many days was this tank underwater currently? nitrate?

 

[Bubblebass]

I am very against redundant bottle bac purchases in reefing its my recent new soapbox.


*if this tank cannot demo ammonia movement in the current arrangement we want that on file, we think this cannot occur.

how many days was this tank underwater currently? nitrate?

7 days. Nitrate looks to be 2. What are your recommendations?

 

[Bubblebass]

Ammonia around 4

 

[jgirardnrg]

I overdosed my 60g cube with bacteria when I started it up (live sand/dry rock).

I added 12 vials of Prodibio startup and a bottle of Bio-Spira with no UV or skimmer running. Waited 24 hours and dosed Dr Tims ammonia. Once ammonia hit 0 3x in a row within 24 hours I added 3 fish (2 clowns and a royal gramma) along with another half bottle of Bio-Spira. 48 hours later I fired up the skimmer and have been off and running since. Took maybe a week. Once diatoms starting appearing I added a small CUC of Trochus snails and blue legged hermits.

 

[brandon429]

from that thread we think if you used the current ammonia reading as a baseline and then dosed up liquid ammonium chloride to a tiny increment darker, then waited 24-48 hours, it'd go down Bubblebass
if not, its stuck

per Dr. Reef's bottle bac thread, most all mixes were ready (can withstand a 100% water change, and still oxidize ammonia, hard locked set) by day ten

we're on day seven here after dosing speed cyclers people use for fish in cycles, successfully.

plus we have some nitrate, the tank certainly has rocks and sand to attach to, see how it legit moves up start dates so we can make conventions work on time?

but setting up a tank full of life by guessing is crazy, nobody would do that. they use nh3 movement as the proof, before putting in real animals. we dont expect these kits to show zero, we're needing them to show thousandths ppm and they're just not that sensitive/color card subjectivity etc.

so we make 'em stand out by dosing up, looking for motion down.

 

[schuby]

The reason that I waited for my nitrite-levels to drop to zero, after ammonia dropped to zero, is because the nitrite-to-nitrate bacteria multiply slower than the ammonia-to-nitrite bacteria (my understanding from reading articles on internet). Once nitrite got to zero, then I had more confidence that my tank was ready for my first set of fish.

 

[Alenya]

Don’t add any more ammonia. If you add too much when it’s processed you’ll have a ton of nitrate in your tank.


With Dr Tim’s I found nitrite never showed.

I monitored my nitrates and when my ammonia dropped to 0 did a 1ppm dose of ammonia to check how well it processed. Big water change and away.