Gold Torches a Scam?

[Billys_reef]

Over the past year I have collected a handful of gold torches but it seems like some of them always end up turning brown.

Purchased this as a 24k Gold Torch and here is the before and after pic.

Purchased as reverse holy grail before and after pic

Not all of them turn brown and here is a picture of my full collection.

It seems like they change colors within a couple weeks of putting them in my tank and some of the torches doesn't have that vibrant gold as compared to when I first got it. They are all thriving and growing well the past year and I have fragged off a couple heads already as they were getting too big.

I have tried low nutrients - 0-5ppm nitrates , 0-0.3ppm phosphates and also higher nutrients at 15-25ppm nitrates , 0.1-0.15ppm phosphates but they don't seem to affect the colors. Par is around 200-300 with low - moderate flow. Have also tried broadcasting amino acids and reef roids for a couple months when I was bringing my nutrients higher but it doesn't seem to improve the colors at all.

Any insight would be much appreciated!

I have attached the latest ICP test and I do have some elements low but nothing seems to be too much of a concern.

 

[royaleFork]

What lights do you use and what spectrum are they getting? I've been reading a lot of talk about higher uv leads to longer term coral color changes, but not sure it would be this much of a change?

 

[Reefing102]

@VintageReefer any thoughts?

 

[VintageReefer]

I have not experienced this with gold or yellow torch’s

Reverse holy grail is a made up name for a dragon tamer
I’ve had this one 1.5 years

If they change colors it’s your system but I don’t know what does it. Nutrients and par most likely

The only real color shifts I’ve experienced is holy grail losing the yellow and becoming green and I don’t know why :(

 

[Goaway]

The only real color shifts I’ve experienced is holy grail losing the yellow and becoming green and I don’t know why :(

My lfs tells me it's the royal blues. He gets the yellow out of the grails very easy under the radions, they sit under 350 par. I have one and I can only see the yellow when the lights kick on or are about to go off, so full windex mode.

It's probably the most difficult color to pull out of coral for me.

 

[VintageReefer]

My lfs tells me it's the royal blues. He gets the yellow out of the grails very easy under the radions, they sit under 350 par. I have one and I can only see the yellow when the lights kick on or are about to go off, so full windex mode.

It's probably the most difficult color to pull out of coral for me.

Full windex doesn’t pull the yellow in my grail. It’s gone.

Have no issue with yellows in other torches

The green torch on the left is/was a grail and this is full blue pic

But my others

No issue retaining yellow

 

[Goaway]

Full windex doesn’t pull the yellow in my grail. It’s gone.

Have no issue with yellows in other torches

The green torch on the left is/was a grail and this is full blue pic

But my others

No issue retaining yellow

I dont have bananas or radions like my lfs. I run noopsyche . Grails are meon green, neon yellow. I really think that complicates things.

I know i need orange lenses or something.



But, i lost my rapunzel who almost turned solid gold . Torches just seem to change under certain settings. Its so weird to me.

 

[Billys_reef]

What lights do you use and what spectrum are they getting? I've been reading a lot of talk about higher uv leads to longer term coral color changes, but not sure it would be this much of a change?

My main lights are currently the g4 radions xr30 running ab+ for 5 hours and then all blues for another 5 hours. I do have some supplemental aliexpress blue leds just to give it some extra pop. It seems like there is something in my system that some gold torches don't seem to like and it changes colors rather quickly in a couple weeks after adding it to my system. It reminds me of how some wild rainbow acans don't seem to hold their rainbow colors in captivity and they turn into a single color.

 

[VintageReefer]

Now that I think more, this did happen to me. I bought a sun god and it was solid yellow. And after a few weeks it started developing purple and eventually ended up looking like a Knicks and it lost most of the gold. In fact, it looked just like your first pic and ended up like the second. I never could figure it out. I talked to the vendor, then I identified his wholesaler and spoke with them also. Both had no advice or clue. I wasn’t able to figure it out either

Other torches unaffected. I assumed “bad genetics”

 

[VintageReefer]

I was wanting a solid yellow/gold torch and saw this, and confirmed with seller it was solid yellow so I bought it

It came in and was solid yellow

But in a few weeks I noticed this

It got worse

And turns into this

And eventually it became the big guy on the left…

It was a nice torch but I would have saved 200$ and bought a Knicks from the start. I put tons of research into this trying to stop/reverse it. Reached out to strangers. Wholesalers. Vendors that specialize in torches. I got tips. Suggestions. Nothing ever had an impact

I bought another Sungod, and it never happened to the new one.

 

[royaleFork]

I was wanting a solid yellow/gold torch and saw this, and confirmed with seller it was solid yellow so I bought it

It came in and was solid yellow

But in a few weeks I noticed this

It got worse

And turns into this

And eventually it became the big guy on the left…

It was a nice torch but I would have saved 200$ and bought a Knicks from the start. I put tons of research into this trying to stop/reverse it. Reached out to strangers. Wholesalers. Vendors that specialize in torches. I got tips. Suggestions. Nothing ever had an impact

I bought another Sungod, and it never happened to the new one.

Was it wild or aquacultured?

 

[VintageReefer]

Was it wild or aquacultured?

That particular one source was unknown to me. Here is the vendor

 

[KrisReef]

I was wanting a solid yellow/gold torch and saw this, and confirmed with seller it was solid yellow so I bought it

It came in and was solid yellow

But in a few weeks I noticed this

It got worse

And turns into this

And eventually it became the big guy on the left…

It was a nice torch but I would have saved 200$ and bought a Knicks from the start. I put tons of research into this trying to stop/reverse it. Reached out to strangers. Wholesalers. Vendors that specialize in torches. I got tips. Suggestions. Nothing ever had an impact

I bought another Sungod, and it never happened to the new one.

It’s difficult to deal with coral colors, they do what they want .

How could you know it was a NYNicks fan until it started showing its true colors?

I just gave my LFS a dozen or more heads of a torch that was amazing when I got it and I gave no idea what it was when I took it in?

The thing I see is that these corals trade zooxanthellia (like I changed the spelling) and they can color change significantly in the process over time.

They are optimizing growth and survival potential and are not concerned with the colors that produces.?

 

[Goaway]

Most of these coral are maricultured/wild collected.

Now i wonder if its diet based or favorite team....

No more tv for my reef.

 

[Billys_reef]

I was wanting a solid yellow/gold torch and saw this, and confirmed with seller it was solid yellow so I bought it

It came in and was solid yellow

But in a few weeks I noticed this

It got worse

And turns into this

And eventually it became the big guy on the left…

It was a nice torch but I would have saved 200$ and bought a Knicks from the start. I put tons of research into this trying to stop/reverse it. Reached out to strangers. Wholesalers. Vendors that specialize in torches. I got tips. Suggestions. Nothing ever had an impact

I bought another Sungod, and it never happened to the new one.

Oh wow that is exactly the same experience I'm having right now with some of the torches. Either it's something in our water that changes their colors or it's just part of their genetic makeup. This is making me hold back on buying any future high end gold torches as it seems like a gamble.

 

[VintageReefer]

Oh wow that is exactly the same experience I'm having right now with some of the torches. Either it's something in our water that changes their colors or it's just part of their genetic makeup. This is making me hold back on buying any future high end gold torches as it seems like a gamble.

Thats why for high end I moved to yellow torches.

If torch has any purple in the stem I feel like there is a risk the purple will become dominant for reasons beyond my control. Now I get yellow torches like bananas - no purple, no problem haha

Or I get other colors like green. I just avoid purple. It seems to be a wildcard

[

 

[nickng]

The ones that I see retain a true bright gold yellow is the real Aussie 24k fat head torch. I will add a picture when I get back. Problem is it’s a very finicky torch ie reputation of dying easily.
Other torches like indo 24k, indo gold, holy grail are gold with some purple bits or green bits. And it depends mostly on lighting which color becomes more dominant ie the gold or purple or green.
The next most yellow one is the Malaysian banana torch, again not a hint of green or purple, just yellow and some translucent bits. But the tips are more sky blue/teal color than true blue

 

[nickng]

Also the yellow on Malaysian/ phillipines banana yellow torch is a touch less brilliant compared to true Aussie 24k

 

[VintageReefer]

For new HG and it shows the yellows even in day spectrum

No issue with golds/yellow on these - banana and banana grail

This banana grail I bought as single head 2.5 years ago, still bright yellow

 

[nickng]

Here’re some pics I took a few minutes ago
(1) Indo gold(maybe, unknown indo that I rescued from dying drag in its), cc21 tails
(2) Indo24k gold
(3) Aussie 24k gold
(4) both Malaysian/philiphines banana

Lights are radion under AB+

I’ve adjusted the pictures so that it looks closer to real life images