GOVERMENT SHoT DOWN

[Paul B]

comment from an old VietNam Vet,that and a dollar will get you a cup of coffee in some places still...upset!:tongue:

I am an Old VietNam Vet.

I have my true feeling about this and the Obama Administration, but if I tried to type it there would be more **** than anything else. So I shut up.

So do I, So I won't mention it or I could go on for hours. I think I will go and look at my fish now.:eyebrows:

 

[GHill762]

They say you should never talk politics in public and that's likely good advice, however I've never been one to always follow good advice

Politicians are votes, the ones elected got the most votes. The problem is simple - it's not the government or the politicians - it's the voters

Our Democracy ensures that everyone over the age of 18 has the right to vote whether they are informed about the issues or not. It upsets me every time I talk politics with people who do nothing but complain about the government, when many of them are not involved enough with the issues to even know what they're complaining about. So many people choose not to be educated on the issues of the day yet choose to talk the most.

Politics have become about money - get yourself a big money donor like the Koch brothers, complain about everything, threaten to shut down the government take your ball and go home, and cash in with a corporate job with them after your term is up for supporting all their anti regulation, anti union, anti avg ordinary american, platforms.

Hopefully one day people will wake up and discover that all these big money Wall Street donors are simple buying politicians to create a peasent society of workers that will not stand together in unions but rather fight for the scrap wages they offer. They have no interest in a middle class - they want cheap labor to line their pockets

Until we as Americans get our head out if the sand, get informed, and vote wisely, the Ted cruises, Michelle backmens, and Sarah palins of the world will run amuck in our government and nothing good will get done - like for example, insuring that all Americans regardless of wealth get affordable health care for themselves and their children.

This law was passed in 2009, upheld as constitutional by the Supreme Court, and effective as of today. Now no longer can insurance companies kick you out for pre existing conditions, no longer can people use the emergency room for their primary care at tax payers expense, no longer will children go without preventative care cause their parents don't get insurance through their workplace. And yes we all must participate but don't we profess to be "one nation, under god, indivisible"

Ted Cruise and the rest of them need to suck it up, quit whining, and start doing their job, pass a budget, to keep America the greatest nation in the world like we all know it is. And we as voters need to make sure he and all the rest of them do and if they don't, well they can go get that job waiting for them with their Wall Street donors after the next election

we are not a democracy, we are a republic. do you go to the polls and vote on every issue or do you have a representative?

maybe one day you'll realize that each party wants to grow its voter base, democrats' voting base is has most of the welfare recipients and snooty elite 1%, whereas the republicans' voter base is mostly comprised of middle to upper-middle class.. now, let's think, don't parties want to grow their voter base? if there are more people on welfare programs, it works out well for the democrats, they've figured out that they can vote themselves the treasury - but it will collapse at some point.

you need to understand how healthcare works, this law is good for insurance companies, they love it, they are being handed customers because of the mandate. the very people you are complaining about are going to be the big winners here. healthcare will get more expensive, doctors are leaving practices, hospitals will struggle for their "share" of payments. now hospitals are basically forced into big conglomerates, which will eventually fail. and pre-existing? seriously? so if you wreck your car today and buy car insurance next week, do you expect them to cover your wreck? it's insurance, not a medical bill payment program..

the US didn't become the greatest nation in the world because of government, it became the greatest nation in the world because government stayed out of the way (for the most part), it became the greatest nation in the world because of the people and the freedom, carnegie's and rockefeller's, government getting the F out of the way is the only way to bring this country back.

 

[GHill762]

What i dont get is, you have to have car insurance if you drive, whether you think you're a great driver or not(i.e. young and healthy people not needing insurance) so why not have health insurance? it keeps people from using the emergency room for routine nonsense and jacking up rates, but that's not the only reason we need health care reform. You all do realize we pay more in taxes TOWARDS health care than countries that have socialized health care right? This guy explains it really well. Why Are American Health Care Costs So High? - YouTube

The problem is we dont negotiate with terrorists, and one sect of the republican party is basically the american taliban, holding our country hostage unless the get everything they demand. No bipartisanship. The tea party is the problem. The same people that believe, regardless of the scientific data, that burning fossil fuels has no impact on Co2 emissions and most of them believe the earth is 6,000 years old. These are the people we put in charge.

you don't have to buy a car, but even if you do you only have to have liability on your car in case you F up somebody esle's ****, you only have to have full coverage if someone else owns the car (ie the bank, and that's a rule of the lender, not gubbment). you should not be required to buy something merely because you are alive.

I'd say liberal scumbag progressives are the problem. yes we all believe the earth is 6000 yrs old, and we're all racist because we don't like Obama's politics, and blah blah blah..

if you want your healthcare taken care of for you go to canada, then sneak back across to the US for good healthcare when you get a serious medical condition. if you want to grow a set of balls, act like a man and take care of yourself, then the US is for you (or use to be, now the gubbment wants to take care of you craddle to grave).

 

[GHill762]

turn off MSLSD and Communist News Network for a moment, read a history book (one not butchered by political agenda), or heck, read the constitution and the federalist and antifederalist papers...

 

[CoryC]

You know, I stopped reading because I saw how poorly educated you were when you thought democrat's base is welfare recipients. if that were the case, then why do states that stay red in every election receive the most welfare and entitlements. if people like you and the other tea party wackjobs didnt think that somehow poor people are whats wrong with our country, not corporate welfare and allowing them to spend unlimited amounts of cash lobbying and influencing elections then maybe things would change. You need to turn off the FauxNews. I've read those documents. Health care will not get more expensive, premiums have already dropped in states where obamacare has been implemented. you're completely off base and just another sad angry tea party conservative that's grasping straws because the world is changing for the better and you dont want to believe it.

 

[robbrouse]

If Obama care is so dang awesome why doesn't Obama and congress sign up for it. My freaking insurance rates have increase years. My Wife company is going to the High Deductible plan only. Company are cutting employees hours to part time so they don't have to deal with Obama care.

But yeah it's freaking awesome.

 

[CoryC]

so you think that your insurance company, which is purely existing for profit, has your best interests in mind? you know that it will only effect a small percentage of businesses. they dont have obamacare because they already have health care, which is the point.

 

[Paul B]

I just have to say it. If Obamacare is so good, then why is he and his family not on it? Why are members of Congress exempted? Why are Unions exempted? (and I am in a union), why is big business exempted? I would be all for it if "All Americans were forced into it equally, including the people that donated the money that let him got elected. In the 60s I was drafted and fought in Viet Nam, but as most Govt. programs a large part of the American people were exempted such as college students and most rich people, people with religious concerns because they couldn't eat C rations or couldn't cut their hair or some other excuse. If we are "all" equal, then why are just the common people forced into it? The Constitution does state that the United States Government is not allowed to force Americans to buy anything. OK, I am done. Have a nice day.

 

[robbrouse]

Well I know Obama doesn't have my best interest in mind. When ash the government every taking over anything and made it run better?

 

[GHill762]

if people like you and the other tea party wackjobs didnt think that somehow poor people are whats wrong with our country, not corporate welfare and allowing them to spend unlimited amounts of cash lobbying and influencing elections then maybe things would change. Health care will not get more expensive, premiums have already dropped in states where obamacare has been implemented. you're completely off base and just another sad angry tea party conservative that's grasping straws because the world is changing for the better and you dont want to believe it.

you'll have to excuse my 4.0gpa university education, it's no comparison for your supreme intellect. welfare recipients statistically vote democrat.

it's not the poor that are "wrong with this country," it's the politicians preying on them, either with promises or fear depending on the election cycle.

healthcare already is getting more expensive dip****, my whole family (myself included) works in various areas of healthcare - split between insurance and hospital, I'm in financial, others in coverage, a couple higher up the ladder in insurace (big healthcare company, not an agent). so I usually am pretty up on what's changing, who's going to win, who's going to pay more. the consumer will pay more, insurance will win. period.

hopey changey crap isn't always for the better. you'll wake up one of these days.

 

[GHill762]

I just have to say it. If Obamacare is so good, then why is he and his family not on it? Why are members of Congress exempted? Why are Unions exempted? (and I am in a union), why is big business exempted? I would be all for it if "All Americans were forced into it equally, including the people that donated the money that let him got elected. In the 60s I was drafted and fought in Viet Nam, but as most Govt. programs a large part of the American people were exempted such as college students and most rich people, people with religious concerns because they couldn't eat C rations or couldn't cut their hair or some other excuse. If we are "all" equal, then why are just the common people forced into it? The Constitution does state that the United States Government is not allowed to force Americans to buy anything. OK, I am done. Have a nice day.

if you really want to get to what is constitutional and what is not, the federal government is supposed to be limited to the explicit powers listed therein. the federalist papers make the argument that the bill of rights opens a window for much more power because it basically says "you can't touch these rights" which is then interpreted as "you can touch other rights, and have more power." the constitution is not meant to tell us what we can do, it is meant to limit government to the powers listed in the constitution, that is it, that is all, nothing more.

 

[CoryC]

then please show those statistics! because states that recieve the most gov't aid vote republican time and again! whatever reactionary moves the health care industry has taken thus far will be offset by the broad changes coming through this act, which is for the better. but i guess it's bad that health care will now be affordable for all americans. not just the rich and shrinking middle class.whether or not you like it, the ACA is here to stay. it's been voted on by congress, signed into law, and then upheld by the supreme court with a conservative judge casting the last vote. GET OVER IT. we've had social programs for over a century now. what did you not understand that we already pay more in taxes than countries like germany and those that have social medicine?

 

[GHill762]

so you think that your insurance company, which is purely existing for profit, has your best interests in mind? you know that it will only effect a small percentage of businesses. they dont have obamacare because they already have health care, which is the point.

yes, I'd rather have my health care taken care of by the most inefficient agency in the world.

I'll trust any for-profit before trusting anything else, if they are for-profit then I already know what their motive is, if they aren't then you have to wonder what the motive is. such as many 503b's.

 

[GHill762]

then please show those statistics! because states that recieve the most gov't aid vote republican time and again! whatever reactionary moves the health care industry has taken thus far will be offset by the broad changes coming through this act, which is for the better. but i guess it's bad that health care will now be affordable for all americans. not just the rich and shrinking middle class.

how are rising premiums more affordable?

the costs are going up not down, doctors are getting out of practice, hospitals are trying to figure out how to get compensated, how is any of that good for the market? do you understand basic economics?

 

[robbrouse]

When Obama runs a insurance program is will looked the the child of Detroit and Chicago. Like everything thing else the government gets there hands on it will fail and fail big. Might be 10 years down the road, but this is a mistake. Yes health care needs to be reformed, but the government needs not to be the one running it.

 

[CoryC]

n two of the states closest to making their exchanges operational (both with Democratic majorities), the pressure of competition is already driving down insurance premiums for consumers. But instead of following the Democratic example, Republican-led states have largely chosen the path of greatest resistance - and greatest cost.Still more Republican-led states have stubbornly refused to implement Obamacare'sMedicaid expansion. They have done this despite study after study showing that, because the expansion allows federal dollars to displace state and local spending in other areas, most of these same state governments would actually save money by accepting the expansion.But in some of the Republican holdout states, GOP legislators have devised various "alternatives" to Medicaid expansion that allow them to continue railing against Obamacare while only leaving some of their constituents out in the cold. The details vary by state, butthese GOP plans all have this in common: they cover fewer people, while spending more state dollars to do it.​

 

[CoryC]

So we should let the market regulate itself? Kinda like wall street and the 2008 housing bubble? That worked really well.

 

[CoryC]

Ghill i just posted an excerpt from a easily found news article that states the opposite of what you just said. so please, provide proof for your own claims, or stop making them because you have nothing but anecdotal evidence.

 

[Neon Reef]

I agree robb, let us all put politics aside for just one moment and use common sense. The President of the United States of America wants to impose a standardized healthcare program if you will but yet not support it fully enough to sign himself and family up for what he says is great for the rest of us? How the f does that make sense? I know there are tons of sheeple out there but really? How the heck did so many millions of americans get to this point where they just do wbat government tells them and just accepts it. The government doesnt have our best interest at heart, they just want us to fall in line like drones. We say "no more wars" and what do those idiots do, figure how to spend more of OUR money on meaningless wars and other countries' infrastructure afterwards.
Saddest part is that its too late. One day people in this country will finally wake up and want to stand up against our government because they are finally fed up, but it will be a loss cause because most of the money going into the department of defense isnt to prepare against other countries, it's to prepare themselves against us. Don't believe me, just look at all the schools being build in the big cities. Are they just schools or are they disguised prisons, you be the judge.

 

[GHill762]

So we should let the market regulate itself? Kinda like wall street and the 2008 housing bubble? That worked really well.

you mean the housing bubble created by government regulations lol..

forced deregulation of banks, they couldn't disapprove loans based on several criteria because the government was pushing for "every american in a home"

there was also fanny and freddy (gov brainchildren) to sell your bad loans to.. no risk for the bank, loans for everyone!!!

yeah, you're right, it's the uncontrollable wild free market that caused it.

do your homework