hammer peeling from base again

[FishPersonFL]

Hi
This is my third hammer to peel away. (the peeling is in the black circle) . I caught this today. My previous two died from it. The first one did amazing for 7 years, grew huge. Then I had my apartment rennovated and lots of crap got in my tank. The handyman did not protect it at all like he said he would. That was 18 months ago. I've done many many many water changes, prob changed complete water 5 x over if not more already. Because the tank was doing very badly after the renovation - the first hammer died soon after and elegance I had (4 years) also peeled and died. Also another aquacultured elegance peeled and died recently after many water changes. But the tank has overall gotten better, even with these peeling events. Other corals and my Ritteri are coming back (which almost shrank to nothing) healthy again. Is there somehow something that I can treat the coral with to stop the peeling.

Or do I need to totally take down my tank and reset up fresh, getting rid of all the rocks , essentialy a new set up? I'm really frustrated with this

 

[Fish Fan]

I'm sorry to hear this, I can imagine how frustrated you must be.

If you're not already, I'd run some good activated carbon.

Do you know exactly what fell into your tank? If you can provide some more information about what may have contaminated your tank, I would think then @Randy Holmes-Farley would be able too advise you on how to proceed.

Good luck going forward!

 

[FishPersonFL]

I did just put a fresh BRS ROX 0.8 bag of cabron in a week ago. right after one of the major water changes. One or both of those did help the look of the coral , seems the carbon did make it look better, but possiblly too late.
I just know it was saw dust, from cutting flooring, Dry wall, overall construction dust. WHen I came home and saw the layer of it on the water I was ticked. It was my kitchen tat was rennovaed, Which I had in past, but then that handyman totally sealed teh kitchen off. This guy said he would do the same, but didnt. I shoudl have made sure that he did.

I"m thinkng the tank is poisnoned and can never really get rid of **** he got in it since rockework is porous and absobant.

 

[rayadog]

Dude that sucks. Sorry to state the obvious. Very annoying that it wasn’t anything you did or could have done. Have faith with some carbon and water changes things will turn the corner quickly.

 

[Fish Fan]

I"m thinkng the tank is poisnoned and can never really get rid of **** he got in it since rockework is porous and absobant.

Let's hope @Randy Holmes-Farley sees this and can reply, he will be able to tell you exactly what can and can't bind to your rock, and how to proceed. Give him a chance, he may not see this until tomorrow morning, but he's the authority for stuff like this.

What do you think got in your tank? In my experience (and I just rebuilt our lower bathroom because of a leaking tub above!), things like regular sawdust (2x4's, etc.), drywall dust, even typical latex wall paint are not that serious. Things like ceiling paints that have mold inhibitors and color changing components, are much more concerning. Obviously, if your guy sprays or aerosolized any chemicals, that could be an issue.

Could you also list your water parameters? It's entirely possible something else is at play, and the home renovations are just coincidental.

 

[FishPersonFL]

Let's hope @Randy Holmes-Farley sees this and can reply, he will be able to tell you exactly what can and can't bind to your rock, and how to proceed. Give him a chance, he may not see this until tomorrow morning, but he's the authority for stuff like this.

What do you think got in your tank? In my experience (and I just rebuilt our lower bathroom because of a leaking tub above!), things like regular sawdust (2x4's, etc.), drywall dust, even typical latex wall paint are not that serious. Things like ceiling paints that have mold inhibitors and color changing components, are much more concerning. Obviously, if your guy sprays or aerosolized any chemicals, that could be an issue.

Could you also list your water parameters? It's entirely possible something else is at play, and the home renovations are just coincidental.

I just dont know what got in it. He was cutting the florring -- laminate flooring. And then cabinetry. And cutting dry wall. I dont know what else that he could have been cutting or grinding. And I dont know what those things are made of. I just know there was a sig amount on the tank surface, probably for many days at a time, adding daily. I just dont know how I didnt realize at the start he wasnt preventing it. And I guess it's slightly possible whatever is causing the peeling is no longer anything to do with that event (actually it was over 2 years ago). So I' going to test for everything I can. Actually is that a good idea? To actually have the water sent some place to test it professionally? If so, then where?
I know back in 1980s we coudlnt keep LPS without using a supplement called KSM (it had molebdemum and Strontium) without them peeling like this. But I have a Ca Reactor... Same set up I've always had. Possibly adding Sr or Molyb will help? I dont know. I Really dont want to celan out the tank and start from scratch, it's been years of good aging.
But first is to test what I can here. Low range Phosph, Nitrate. I already know the CA, ALk, MG are fine. And Chlorine in my RO Di.. once I actually had that as an issue.

 

[BryanM]

Carbon is likely the answer, and I'd consider running it in a reactor instead of a bad. More frequent changes to try and get all the bad stuff out.

Combine that with an ICP test so you can see if there's a specific chemical or imbalance in your water chemistry.

I would do both of these before I started over.

 

[Fish Fan]

I just dont know what got in it. He was cutting the florring -- laminate flooring. And then cabinetry. And cutting dry wall. I dont know what else that he could have been cutting or grinding. And I dont know what those things are made of. I just know there was a sig amount on the tank surface, probably for many days at a time, adding daily. I just dont know how I didnt realize at the start he wasnt preventing it. And I guess it's slightly possible whatever is causing the peeling is no longer anything to do with that event (actually it was over 2 years ago). So I' going to test for everything I can. Actually is that a good idea? To actually have the water sent some place to test it professionally? If so, then where?
I know back in 1980s we coudlnt keep LPS without using a supplement called KSM (it had molebdemum and Strontium) without them peeling like this. But I have a Ca Reactor... Same set up I've always had. Possibly adding Sr or Molyb will help? I dont know. I Really dont want to celan out the tank and start from scratch, it's been years of good aging.
But first is to test what I can here. Low range Phosph, Nitrate. I already know the CA, ALk, MG are fine. And Chlorine in my RO Di.. once I actually had that as an issue.

Yes, please list your tank's parameters, lighting and flow; perhaps there's something there that other R2R members will see that might help.

You can send a sample of water out for ICP testing, this is (in theory) a laboratory level test that can indeed test for a wide variety of things in the water, not just the typical alk, calc, mag. An ICP test may help determine if something contaminated the tank. This recent thread has some info on what might be *the best* ICP testing facility:

https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/what-is-the-most-recommended-icp-test-these-days.1145631/

Good luck!

 

[FishPersonFL]

Carbon is likely the answer, and I'd consider running it in a reactor instead of a bad. More frequent changes to try and get all the bad stuff out.

Combine that with an ICP test so you can see if there's a specific chemical or imbalance in your water chemistry.

I would do both of these before I started over.

That's really good advice. It's just hard to fit in my small sump, but I might be able to squeeze it in. WHich carbon is the best? I may still have a small carbon reactor. If i can really get rid of whatever is with that , then that would be fantastic, of course I'd need to always run it and keep it changed.

 

[BryanM]

That's really good advice. It's just hard to fit in my small sump, but I might be able to squeeze it in. WHich carbon is the best? I may still have a small carbon reactor. If i can really get rid of whatever is with that , then that would be fantastic, of course I'd need to always run it and keep it changed.

BRS ROX 0.8 is what I use, and is considered quite good.

They also sell a small reactor, but I don't know how much space you have.

BRS GFO & Carbon Mini Reactor - 5" Single

Why does BRS recommend this? All of the BRS reactors come with easy to use push connect tubing, flow control, and a refillable cartridge. We took easy to find components to keep things cheap while designing an efficient easy to refill reactor for aquarium use. We keep hearing our reactors are...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

 

[FishPersonFL]

I can possibly fit 4x4 maxxx in my sump. This one: https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/sigm...=18758&indexName=brs_prod_m2_default_products

If I use the above I'll just have to move the heater to the refug/chaeto area, but I dont think that's a big deal.

Or will this one be fine? https://www.bulkreefsupply.com/inte...r8UEoPvYS8Xbtd9uZ6spQd6PauUZp-ZhoCK70QAvD_BwE

How often do I need to change the carbon? I have a medium fish stock and low coral amount in my tank. I skim at least moderately, seems to be better for my particular det up.
TIA. I really hope this solvees it even if it's a permanent band aid

 

[FishPersonFL]

But a reactor really makes that much of a difference compared to having the water flow over the bag? I know it makes sense it would but in reaity all the water would pass through the bag several times a day anyhow, right? Or is it also just a much better contact in the reactor, meaning more is drawn out?

 

[FishPersonFL]

BRS ROX 0.8 is what I use, and is considered quite good.

They also sell a small reactor, but I don't know how much space you have.

BRS GFO & Carbon Mini Reactor - 5" Single

Why does BRS recommend this? All of the BRS reactors come with easy to use push connect tubing, flow control, and a refillable cartridge. We took easy to find components to keep things cheap while designing an efficient easy to refill reactor for aquarium use. We keep hearing our reactors are...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

i have max 4x4 space.. and it needs to be IN the sump since I have to avoid leaks

 

[FishPersonFL]

Carbon is likely the answer, and I'd consider running it in a reactor instead of a bad. More frequent changes to try and get all the bad stuff out.

Combine that with an ICP test so you can see if there's a specific chemical or imbalance in your water chemistry.

I would do both of these before I started over.

I doubt more water changes uniless it's many many complete ones will have a big effect. I say that b/c I already did 2 total -- 80-90% changes, a few 50% and many many 25-35%.
I just ordred the bigger version of the two reactors.. the sigma one and new Rox-08 carbon. I'm a bit pessmistic b/c I jsut changed 80% of the water before I put the hammer in and changed the carbon (no reactor yet) this will work but it makes sense to try it. But I also need to test for the basics I listed and the ICP

 

[FishPersonFL]

The seller of the Hammer advised me to dip it in Lugols. Is that a good idea?
Also I am getting an ICP test. I did get strontium. I'll send off sample before adding it. But I'll add some, possibly will get molybdenum.
I know the tank has healed greatly since the ritteri is growing and not shrinking and the torches open super nice buy the torches are 'easy' . My only SPS is monti which isnt growing at all,but isnt dying. And tht used grow annoyingly lol. My ricorida were even dying off, they stopped, but are not yet spreading.
I checked PO4 . It's .05, I know there is no target for it, but that seems like a good numbr to me. And there is no chlorine in my RO DI (ther was at one time a long time ago ).
Hopefully the Carbon chamber is what this tank really needs. I should have one anyhow of course.
I'l test nitrate today.

 

[BryanM]

An iodine dip like lugos is perfectly fine to do, and could indeed be beneficial.

I'm not sure why you want to add specific trace elements before you get your ICP test results back.

 

[FishPersonFL]

An iodine dip like lugos is perfectly fine to do, and could indeed be beneficial.

I'm not sure why you want to add specific trace elements before you get your ICP test results back.

well b/c I dont want this coral to die, and it's gonig that way, the ICP will take a few weeks to get back. of course ideally i'd know my levels before dosing and I would dose min amount. I'm a little desperate to save this thing as you can see. If I had time I'd do it the scientific and correct way

 

[BryanM]

well b/c I dont want this coral to die, and it's gonig that way, the ICP will take a few weeks to get back. of course ideally i'd know my levels before dosing and I would dose min amount. I'm a little desperate to save this thing as you can see. If I had time I'd do it the scientific and correct way

Well, I'll just state this, since you've done quite the rounds of water changes, your trace elements should be fine at the moment.

The ICP results are to confirm you have some sort of pollutant in the tank, what it is, and then if carbon won't remove it, what will? And we can figure that out after the ICP.

But with lots of big water changes your chemistry should be pretty good.

 

[FishPersonFL]

Well, I'll just state this, since you've done quite the rounds of water changes, your trace elements should be fine at the moment.

The ICP results are to confirm you have some sort of pollutant in the tank, what it is, and then if carbon won't remove it, what will? And we can figure that out after the ICP.

But with lots of big water changes your chemistry should be pretty good.

That makes sense unless hammers and elegances need higher Sr and or Mo? or K in a tank. At least under some conditions. It's what we had to dose many years ago.
But I might know my problem. Since the rennovation I coincidentally had more green turf and other green algaes that I had to clean out of the tank. In brief , I've been releasing toxins in the water released by mature green turf and other green algae when I scrbbed rocks off in the tank. And my hammers and elegances have been dying since I been doing this. I dont remember where I read about this a long (30 years + ago) time ago that doing the above can kill things in our tank. // edit: maybe if I had the carbon reactor it woudl have pulled these toxins before they could hurt anything.

 

[FishPersonFL]

A dip in lugols actually saved the hammer. It was peeling so fast, at that rate there would be nothing left in anotehr 48 hours .. and had some film on the coral coming off the skeleton. The first dip - fri night - stopped it, two days later I did a second. Now, thurs night, there is no further peeling, death, recession. I'm going t guess the algae toxins burned it, inviting the infection.
I got the carbon reactor, it's a matter of just setting it up. ANd I'll be getting a few more mex turbos to keep the algae down. I know it's better to prevent it with better balances in the water, but thats another subject.
It seems I have my issue solved. And seems the rennovation polllution is in the past. I wish I knew my past recededing corals liely were infected , I could have dipped and possibly saved them.