Help on strategy to RAISE phosphates and nitrates

[Charterreefer]

Brief update for the thread readers/contributors. More details to come. Things have turned around considerably. I made a concerted effort to go back and chart as much relevant data as possible (thanks to apex). Was able to map out my PO4 dosing as well as water change schedule. With PO4 there were erratic results as I was learning my tank’s consumption. Once I dialed it in and dosed the same amount each day to give me a stable and healthy (yet in range) level of PO4, things stabilized. For me, this was 1ml daily split into am and pm doses of .5ml. This gives me about .02 ppm PO4 at any given time. In addition, I noticed troubling trends with my water change schedule. Won’t bore anyone with the numbers. Truth be told I’ve always changed the water out regularly but I did change my regimen from 5gal weekly to 15gal every 12-13 days or so. Noticed that my monti issue coincided with GFO increase AND the longest time in between water changes (which was about 24 days). So, I did a massive water change, and have gone back to a very regular schedule.

This has caused a massive turn around. To my utter shock (despite my local LFS owner claiming it could happen), my monti has exploded back to life. This is after being bone white and then covered in algae. Now it’s not all the way back by any means. Still plenty of algae. However 15% of the surface is as bright as it ever was.

With regards to the polyp bailout on the hammer/torch. This has stopped. The hammer took the brunt of it. Slowly but surely heads that were adjacent to the affected heads also started to bail. Couldn’t stop it even once I’d started dosing predictably. Finally I dragged the piece to separate affected polyps from healthy. Since doing this nothing more has been affected. Almost as if polyp bailout is an infection of sorts that works its way through a colony. However my torch (which had one branch die to bailout) was NOT fragged. It had grown too far into a rock making it impossible to take out. It has yet to have another affected polyp. So that throws a wrench in my bacteria theory.

Anyway, I’m cautiously pleased with the progress. I know it seems simple (dealing with low nutrients) and maybe it really is. However knowing your tank obviously takes time and you don’t always get the intended consequences. Time will tell if I’m on the right track but at the moment things are looking much much better.

From your description it sounds like you are getting a good feel for what's going on in your system.
The cause and effect: developing a sense of the time it takes between a change in water chemistry and when it's effect can be seen visually on the coral is probably the most important skill. Not changing other conditions (and thus introducing more variables) while trying to "correct" what you think is happening will help develop that ability much faster. For example, doing water changes on a set schedule will get rid of a potential variable and provide you with a more accurate idea of what is actually going on.
The rate at which things happen in reef tanks takes time to get a good feel for, having good data and good reef keeping practices will help speed that along.

On another note: You are reporting that your coral are dying due to "polyp bailout". Think of it in terms of your water chemistry. Polyp bailout is the symptom not the problem. The coral are stressed because of the water chemistry. Once the water is dialed in you will greatly minimize these problematic ailments the coral can suffer.

 

[Cire]

Update 2. Yes I’m developing a better sense of the tank. Interesting how a minor crisis makes you look at things differently. I thought I had consistency down. Period. However the data showed differently. Rash changes coupled with (even infrequent) changes to maintenance schedules can truly cause havoc.

I decided to keep a log each week. It’s digital. Includes pictures of the tank and inhabitants as a visual guide. It includes measurements of all parameters including ALK, CA, MG, Sal, PO4 and NO3. I always checked these parameters before but now I do them all at the same time once a week. And I couple the visual guide with them. I also continue to put this data in apex. This proved valuable before as it allowed me to chart changes I made prior to experiencing my first tank issues.

While I’m sure I’ve got a long way to go, this experience will make me better. This data will give me a breadtrail to follow in case of future problems.

I’m astounded by the people who pack their tank so quickly, taking tremendous losses in both fish and corals (YouTube I’m looking at you). My tank is empty compared to their’s but I’m learning how this ecosystem works. To this day I have yet to officially kill a coral or fish because if parameters. But I came dang close.

This is my last post. Thank you to all for your help. This thread will prove to be a valuable resource to me in the future as its documentation of how hard this hobby can be, but how great the community is. Thank you all. Onward to becoming a good responsible and loving reefer.

 

[Mistahbrock]

Hello Eric
I had a similar issue, even though I'm in freshwater, my NO3 was zero, so I bought a bottle of JBL ProScape NPK Macroelements
on ebay, if you don't want to stock your tank with more fishes, this could be an option

Cheers, Brock

 

[nano reef]

They mean if the levels do not drop after you boost them, not that they do not rise because of the dosing.

"Allow 24-hours to elapse; re-test nitrate and phosphate concentrations. If concentrations remain unchanged, then the system is likely carbon-limited."

What does carbon limited mean? I got in this situation(0 to very low phosphates after carbon dosing) I cant seem to get it to stay up! I was dosing neophos but quit recently thinking maybe my salifert is not that accurate being it is a low number. I am fixing to buy a url hanna phospates. Sometimes I see a tint of blue 24 hours later sometimes I dont but its so its hard to see and lighting could be a variable.

I know the directions are confusing. I dont know if they mean carbon like nopox because thats what I was dosing and think I over did it, when I should have just did a water c hange. I got it down to 10 then wouldnt budge so kept dosing! Stupid I know! After a water change nitrates are about 3 now and they dont change either even though I am feeding the tank much more. My fish let so much hit the sand bed!

So when they say carbon limited is iot nopox or carbon like the type that keeps water clear? I use brs rox 0.8. I change it about once a month. Should I change more often?

Another thought is since fish and coral like consistent levels it worrys me dosing neophos because the phospates are so inconsistint. They go up after dosing then fall down aft5er 24 hours. What should I do? I get tired of testing daily to because my fear is if I dont test b4 I dose, it could finally stop being all used up and my levels will get to high. Help Please!

Also is tank fertilizer just neophos or something like that OR IS IT DIFFERENT? i NEVER HEARD THE TERM "TANK FERTILIZER" aLSO iF MY TANK IS CARBON LIMITED MEANING NOPOX TYPE OF CARBON THEN HOW AM i SUPPOSE TO DOSE MORE WHEN IN FACT IT LOWERS THE PHOSPATES AND NITRATES AND I am already at possibly 0 po3 oops sorry about caps! . I am already dosing MB7 and vibrant (which lowers no4) because I have something going on I thought might be dinos for having low to 0 po4. Just 1 x a week. Could be diatoms as I just increased my lightening right before the breakout and it resembles diatoms more than dinos.