Help quarantine Threadfin Cardinals

[martin.a]

The Copper Treatment done. All 6 Cardinals seem to be in an excellent condition. Time to start Praziquantel treatment. Fingers crossed for the fish. They look awesome. I really do not want to screw it up.

Is anybody aware of Threadfin Cardinals poorly responding to Praziquantel?

Can I please ask to review my plan:
Tomorrow (Sat. 24 Oct.) I will start lowering copper below 1ppm. Current level is 2.3ppm (chelated). I am planning to replace 60% of the water tomorrow to get it down to a hair below 1ppm. Next day, on Sun. I will do another 50% water change to get it down to 0.5ppm. Water salinity and temp. adjusted.

Can I start Praziquantel treatment with chelated copper at 0.5ppm? I will use PraziPro, dosage as per label 2.5 mg/L meaning 5ml per 20G/75L. My tank is 80L, so I will use 5.3ml.

Dosage is to be 8 days apart as per @Jay Hemdal instructions (PraziPro label calls for 7 days apart, but I assume this is to simplify the treatment schedule)

1. Dose #1: Sun. 25 Oct. followed by 30% water change on Tue. 27 Oct.
2. Dose #2: Mon. 2 Nov. followed by 30% water change on Wed. 4 Nov.
3. Dose #3: Tue. 10 Nov. followed by 30% water change on Thu. 12 Nov.

Are the water changes actually necessary? They will be stressful to the fish.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

The Copper Treatment done. All 6 Cardinals seem to be in an excellent condition. Time to start Praziquantel treatment. Fingers crossed for the fish. They look awesome. I really do not want to screw it up.

Is anybody aware of Threadfin Cardinals poorly responding to Praziquantel?

Can I please ask to review my plan:
Tomorrow (Sat. 24 Oct.) I will start lowering copper below 1ppm. Current level is 2.3ppm (chelated). I am planning to replace 60% of the water tomorrow to get it down to a hair below 1ppm. Next day, on Sun. I will do another 50% water change to get it down to 0.5ppm. Water salinity and temp. adjusted.

Can I start Praziquantel treatment with chelated copper at 0.5ppm? I will use PraziPro, dosage as per label 2.5 mg/L meaning 5ml per 20G/75L. My tank is 80L, so I will use 5.3ml.

Dosage is to be 8 days apart as per @Jay Hemdal instructions (PraziPro label calls for 7 days apart, but I assume this is to simplify the treatment schedule)

1. Dose #1: Sun. 25 Oct. followed by 30% water change on Tue. 27 Oct.
2. Dose #2: Mon. 2 Nov. followed by 30% water change on Wed. 4 Nov.
3. Dose #3: Tue. 10 Nov. followed by 30% water change on Thu. 12 Nov.

Are the water changes actually necessary? They will be stressful to the fish.

Yes - you can start prazi at 0.5 copper - people run prazi at even full copper. I generally suggest less than 1 ppm.

I’ve never used Prazipro on this group of fish. It shouldn’t be an issue though if you dose accurately and add aeration though.

Pure prazi powder is generally safer to use, but more difficult to dose (you need a fine mesh net and a gram scale).

The water changes between Prazipro is a good idea. They help reduce biological loading from the solvent used.

 

[martin.a]

Yes - you can start prazi at 0.5 copper - people run prazi at even full copper. I generally suggest less than 1 ppm.

I’ve never used Prazipro on this group of fish. It shouldn’t be an issue though if you dose accurately and add aeration though.

Pure prazi powder is generally safer to use, but more difficult to dose (you need a fine mesh net and a gram scale).

The water changes between Prazipro is a good idea. They help reduce biological loading from the solvent used.

Thanks! 25 - 30% WC was my arbitrary chosen value, would you say it's OK?

I also have "Blue Planet Fluke & Tapeworm Tablets". They have 100mg Praziquantel per tablet. What confuses me 'a bit' is that their directions call for "1 tablet per 20L of aquarium water" which means 5 mg/L of Praziquantel. (You can read directions following the link above). This is twice the dosage from Prazipro label. What dosage to you use?
Also, they are casual about dissolving those tablets in a "cup of water". I assumed I would need at least 250ml/1cup of water to dissolve 100 mg, just one tablet. So... I have second thoughts.

Anyway, Prazipro, with all it's issues, still appears to me as a 'devil better known'.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Thanks! 25 - 30% WC was my arbitrary chosen value, would you say it's OK?

I also have "Blue Planet Fluke & Tapeworm Tablets". They have 100mg Praziquantel per tablet. What confuses me 'a bit' is that their directions call for "1 tablet per 20L of aquarium water" which means 5 mg/L of Praziquantel. (You can read directions following the link above). This is twice the dosage from Prazipro label. What dosage to you use?
Also, they are casual about dissolving those tablets in a "cup of water". I assumed I would need at least 250ml/1cup of water to dissolve 100 mg, just one tablet. So... I have second thoughts.

Anyway, Prazipro, with all it's issues, still appears to me as a 'devil better known'.

I only use 4 mg/l in tanks where I know that the heterotrophic bacteria (that consume PZQ) has been growing due to multiple previous treatments.

PZQ is barely soluble in water - I see no way to dissolve tablets like this, they need to be crushed very fine and pushed through a fine mesh to form a suspension. Even with prazipro - if you look closely as you add it, it immediately comes out of solution when it hits the water.

 

[martin.a]

Started ProziPro. Water looks... like if it was a snowball. I hope this is fine. The tank is 80L AOI cube. It runs 2 nano skimmers draining back to the tank. I put extra aeration stones into the return pump compartment. I hope this is fine. The bubbling stones were clearly upsetting the fish when they were in the main tank. The extra aeration can be seen at the very end of the clip. If you watch it, please mute the sound, I had to add some silly soundtrack to mask a personal conversation.


I am going to try Fritz PraziCleanse next time. Ordered from US... You wouldn't believe the stuff we don't have in AU.

 

[Jay Hemdal Verified Community Expert]

Started ProziPro. Water looks... like if it was a snowball. I hope this is fine. The tank is 80L AOI cube. It runs 2 nano skimmers draining back to the tank. I put extra aeration stones into the return pump compartment. I hope this is fine. The bubbling stones were clearly upsetting the fish when they were in the main tank. The extra aeration can be seen at the very end of the clip. If you watch it, please mute the sound, I had to add some silly soundtrack to mask a personal conversation.


I am going to try Fritz PraziCleanse next time. Ordered from US... You wouldn't believe the stuff we don't have in AU.

Usually, the particles created when Prazipro is added to water are smaller than that. Was the video taken right after the addition? Does the tank have any mechanical filtration?

 

[martin.a]

Usually, the particles created when Prazipro is added to water are smaller than that. Was the video taken right after the addition? Does the tank have any mechanical filtration?

Right after. 5.3ml of prazipro was vigorously shaken with 25ml of aquarium water in 50ml Falcon tube. Milky suspension was poured to the return pump compartment. Some sticky residue was left on the walls of the tube. It was not possible to remove it with consecutive washes.

Those particles mostly cleared out after approx. 6 hours. Skimmers went berserk immiedietly after addition of prazipro and continue to foam madly, even though the water looks considerably cleaner now. The foam is not stable, all skimmate pours back into the tank as clear liquid.

Tank has a thin layer of filter mat on top of large filter sponge, and 2 tiny skimmer - bubble magnus nano, and aqua one nano. There is no sock or mat roller. I regularly clean the filter mat which catches most of the particles. Sponge is copepods and bacteria dominion.

Fish stay low and rather withdrawn. They are interested in food a bit, but much less than usual. But I fed them over the top before starting this stage.

BTW, Jay I really appreciate your attention. I have no idea how you are finding the time and energy to attend all the posts. Highest respect.