Help with mimic tang not gaining weight

Reefer1978

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 22, 2014
Messages
3,283
Reaction score
3,343
Location
New Jersey
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
I have a mimic tang that's pretty thin, and not gaining any weight. I've had him for 2 months, and it went though a full QT. He's eating very well, pretty much everything I feed. I did 5 days KanaPlex + MetroPlexAny bound with Focus. But he's very skittish, hiding all the time. Ideas what is going on and what else I can do?

IMG_8537.png
IMG_8539.png
 

Jay Hemdal

10K Club member
View Badges
Joined
Jul 31, 2020
Messages
25,939
Reaction score
25,712
Location
Dundee, MI
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Reefer1978 Welcome to the Fish Disease Treatment and Diagnosis Forum!

The #fishmedic team and other knowledgeable members of our community will do our best to help you resolve your questions. Please provide as much of the following as you are able:
  • Brief description of the issue you are observing and answers to the following questions:
    • How long have you had the fish with the condition?
    • Did you quarantine with medication when you first acquired the fish? (If Yes, which medication?)
  • Current water quality measurements
  • Clear photos of the issue taken using WHITE light and/or a short video of any behaviors (post in your response or on YouTube).
If you can help us by providing as much of the above info as possible, it will make diagnosing and providing recommendations for treatment MUCH easier! The Fish Medic team will get back to you as quickly as possible. In the meantime, other members of our community may also share their experience with similar situations and advice that they may have regarding your situation.

You may also feel free to provide a more detailed description of the condition if you wish to share more info than the above list.

Additionally, these links may be useful while you await a response:
 

vetteguy53081

Well known Member and monster tank lover
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Messages
91,998
Reaction score
203,188
Location
Wisconsin -
Rating - 100%
14   0   0
I have a mimic tang that's pretty thin, and not gaining any weight. I've had him for 2 months, and it went though a full QT. He's eating very well, pretty much everything I feed. I did 5 days KanaPlex + MetroPlexAny bound with Focus. But he's very skittish, hiding all the time. Ideas what is going on and what else I can do?

IMG_8537.png
IMG_8539.png
How did you measure Metro? It has to be specific at .5 gram by Weight or its literally overdosed and makes food taste bitter.
Was there a reason you gave it Kanaplex?
Look at your tank ph, salinity and ammonia level as triggers for not eating and may be triggered by mixed medications.
Is fish breathing normal or labored?
 

MnFish1

10K Club member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
22,832
Reaction score
21,967
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
What exactly are you trying to treat? With metroplex? There are many reasons for fish not to do well - but first - what was your 'full quarantine' protocol. Second - I can't see anything in your pictures - white light would be really helpful. agree with @vetteguy53081 no clear reason for kanaplex - And - the dosing of both could be actually toxic (since you don't know what dose you're giving) - If you had a fish alone in a single tank - and you could measure what they took in (ate) all good

i.e. - what are you trying to treat with metroplex - no matter which way
 

Tnops

Well-Known Member
View Badges
Joined
Jun 8, 2021
Messages
550
Reaction score
342
Location
Queens
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
what are the other fish in your tank? It could be the reason why it is skittish perhaps due to aggression. Funny thing my triggerfish was very skittish when it was the only fish in the tank for months but came out after I added more fish
 

Jay Hemdal

10K Club member
View Badges
Joined
Jul 31, 2020
Messages
25,939
Reaction score
25,712
Location
Dundee, MI
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
Some issues with thin fish can be overcome by simply feeding them more. Internal gut parasites steal food from the fish, but if you give them more food, that can be overcome, just like it does in the wild.

Home aquarists often feed their tangs too much nori and not enough high protein food like pellets and mysids. I have had people tell me, "I feed my fish every day, but they are getting thin". When I drill down and figure out how much they are feeding, it turns out that they are holding back on the food so as not to increase nutrients to their reef tank.

The first step would be to feed it 3x / day, as much as it will eat in 3 minutes or so.....

Jay
 
OP
OP
Reefer1978

Reefer1978

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 22, 2014
Messages
3,283
Reaction score
3,343
Location
New Jersey
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
How did you measure Metro? It has to be specific at .5 gram by Weight or its literally overdosed and makes food taste bitter.
Was there a reason you gave it Kanaplex?
Look at your tank ph, salinity and ammonia level as triggers for not eating and may be triggered by mixed medications.
Is fish breathing normal or labored?
PH 8.3, Salinity 1.024, 0 Ammonia (dosing ammonia for nitrates) actually, 1 year tank, so it's established. There's absolutely no issues with eating, he's eating everything. I am feeding Mysis, Fish Frenzy, Herbivore Frenzy, Nori.

Some issues with thin fish can be overcome by simply feeding them more. Internal gut parasites steal food from the fish, but if you give them more food, that can be overcome, just like it does in the wild.

Home aquarists often feed their tangs too much nori and not enough high protein food like pellets and mysids. I have had people tell me, "I feed my fish every day, but they are getting thin". When I drill down and figure out how much they are feeding, it turns out that they are holding back on the food so as not to increase nutrients to their reef tank.

The first step would be to feed it 3x / day, as much as it will eat in 3 minutes or so.....

Jay
I can certainly try that. But it's a large tank, so I would have to feed everyone 3x.
 

vetteguy53081

Well known Member and monster tank lover
View Badges
Joined
Aug 11, 2013
Messages
91,998
Reaction score
203,188
Location
Wisconsin -
Rating - 100%
14   0   0
PH 8.3, Salinity 1.024, 0 Ammonia (dosing ammonia for nitrates) actually, 1 year tank, so it's established. There's absolutely no issues with eating, he's eating everything. I am feeding Mysis, Fish Frenzy, Herbivore Frenzy, Nori.


I can certainly try that. But it's a large tank, so I would have to feed everyone 3x.
If I understand correctly, you are adding ammonia Chloride to increase Nitrates? If so, the ammonia can be toxic and have adverse effects on delicate fish.
Jay mentioned to increase feedings - That too will increase nitrates and 3 feeding is what I am doing daily also with a large tank which contains 25 tangs plus 14 other fish
 

Jay Hemdal

10K Club member
View Badges
Joined
Jul 31, 2020
Messages
25,939
Reaction score
25,712
Location
Dundee, MI
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
PH 8.3, Salinity 1.024, 0 Ammonia (dosing ammonia for nitrates) actually, 1 year tank, so it's established. There's absolutely no issues with eating, he's eating everything. I am feeding Mysis, Fish Frenzy, Herbivore Frenzy, Nori.


I can certainly try that. But it's a large tank, so I would have to feed everyone 3x.
It very easily could be outcompeted for good then. Try upping the feeding amount and frequency for a time - if it’s belly folks out, then that would confirm the issue. You could then decide to either move the fish to a less crowded tank, or feed the whole tank more.
 
OP
OP
Reefer1978

Reefer1978

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 22, 2014
Messages
3,283
Reaction score
3,343
Location
New Jersey
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
If I understand correctly, you are adding ammonia Chloride to increase Nitrates? If so, the ammonia can be toxic and have adverse effects on delicate fish.
Jay mentioned to increase feedings - That too will increase nitrates and 3 feeding is what I am doing daily also with a large tank which contains 25 tangs plus 14 other fish
I am not dosing enough to even get a reading. It's a large tank, I am dosing a tiny amount 2x per day. I've been dosing for 6 months.

It very easily could be outcompeted for good then. Try upping the feeding amount and frequency for a time - if it’s belly folks out, then that would confirm the issue. You could then decide to either move the fish to a less crowded tank, or feed the whole tank more.
Jay could you describe, or share a picture of what "belly folks out" is? When I feed, the entire tank is covered with food. And as I mentioned he/she does eat very actively.
 

Jay Hemdal

10K Club member
View Badges
Joined
Jul 31, 2020
Messages
25,939
Reaction score
25,712
Location
Dundee, MI
Rating - 0%
0   0   0
I am not dosing enough to even get a reading. It's a large tank, I am dosing a tiny amount 2x per day. I've been dosing for 6 months.


Jay could you describe, or share a picture of what "belly folks out" is? When I feed, the entire tank is covered with food. And as I mentioned he/she does eat very actively.
Sorry that was a typo: “belly fills out” is what it should have said.
 

MnFish1

10K Club member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
22,832
Reaction score
21,967
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
IMHO - there is no reason to dose ammonia for nitrate.... Instead - dose nitrate. Or - the increased feeding you're doing will increase nitrate on its own.
 

MnFish1

10K Club member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
22,832
Reaction score
21,967
Rating - 100%
1   0   0

MnFish1

10K Club member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
22,832
Reaction score
21,967
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
I am not dosing enough to even get a reading. It's a large tank, I am dosing a tiny amount 2x per day. I've been dosing for 6 months.


Jay could you describe, or share a picture of what "belly folks out" is? When I feed, the entire tank is covered with food. And as I mentioned he/she does eat very actively.
This is something I think we as reefers ignore - and is an excellent point from @vetteguy53081 . Medications like kanamycin, neomycin, can have severe symptoms in humans - they are rarely used intravenously - some have been given orally for cleaning the bowel because they are not absorbed. They and most of their cousins have been relegated to treating severe infections and then stopped as soon as possible based on the diagnosis. I see many well-intentioned people treating with 2 or even 3 medications - all of which can cause toxicity - and additionally, may cause less eating.
 
OP
OP
Reefer1978

Reefer1978

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 22, 2014
Messages
3,283
Reaction score
3,343
Location
New Jersey
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
I know I know. :). It's ok for people to question/disagree with @Randy Holmes-Farley :). I agree with his article - and I see the rationale for doing it. I as someone who reads 50-100 tank problem questions daily would think dosing nitrate - though perhaps not as scientifically efficient, is much safer than dosing ammonia itself:)
I think the challenge with Nitrate is getting a clean product, it's very expensive. Spectacide, something I used for a long time (it's on sale at Lowes today if anyone needs it), is not food grade, so god knows what else is in it.
 

MnFish1

10K Club member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
22,832
Reaction score
21,967
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
I think the challenge with Nitrate is getting a clean product, it's very expensive. Spectacide, something I used for a long time (it's on sale at Lowes today if anyone needs it), is not food grade, so god knows what else is in it.
Each chemical that is for sale - should have an analysis. However these can be misleading. If I wanted to increase nitrate in a FOWLR I would just feed more. Same in a coral tank.
 
OP
OP
Reefer1978

Reefer1978

2500 Club Member
View Badges
Joined
Sep 22, 2014
Messages
3,283
Reaction score
3,343
Location
New Jersey
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
Each chemical that is for sale - should have an analysis. However these can be misleading. If I wanted to increase nitrate in a FOWLR I would just feed more. Same in a coral tank.
In theory I fully agree, and I actually feel I feed a lot. Entire tank is circulated with food, takes them about 5 minutes to finish everything. But then again, we see more and more dyno tanks, and those happen when nutrients bottom out.
 

MnFish1

10K Club member
View Badges
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
22,832
Reaction score
21,967
Rating - 100%
1   0   0
In theory I fully agree, and I actually feel I feed a lot. Entire tank is circulated with food, takes them about 5 minutes to finish everything. But then again, we see more and more dyno tanks, and those happen when nutrients bottom out.
I'm going to suggest an amendment to your comment. 'We se more and more dyno tanks, that are immature, do not have adequate coral cover (i.e. a lot of open light filled spaces are present) - and it is happening whether nutrients bottom out or not.
 

Bubbles, bubbles, and more bubbles: Do you keep bubble-like corals in your reef?

  • I currently have bubble-like corals in my reef.

    Votes: 28 36.4%
  • I don’t currently have bubble-like corals in my reef, but I have in the past.

    Votes: 9 11.7%
  • I don’t currently have bubble-like corals in my reef, but I plan to in the future.

    Votes: 24 31.2%
  • I don’t currently have bubble-like corals in my reef and have no plans to in the future.

    Votes: 14 18.2%
  • Other.

    Votes: 2 2.6%

New Posts

Back
Top