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High levels of TIN in my tank

KenO

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Ken, Thank you for this info. I am awaiting an ATI test that I sent out at the same time and am curious to see how the RO/DI water comes back (as well as the tank water of course).
1) Have you heard anything about whether the Triton Detox works with tin?
2) Do you have any idea from where in the RO/DI the tin is coming from? (media or equipment?)
3) Are you using BRS equipment and media by any chance?
Thanks for helping!
FYI my tests took about 2 weeks to get results. The tests are shipped from CA to Germany.
I don’t know if the Triton detox would work or not. Maybe send them a message.
My guess for my RO/DI water with tin is coming from the storage container. I sent two RO/DI water samples. One was direct from the output of the DI resin. The second was from RO/DI storage container like I did from the first test I did. For me the output of the DI resin was zero for tin. Which is great news for me. The storage container still has tin in it but the level has dropped from in the 20’s to 5.34ppb. That was without any metal removing media.
From what I’ve been reading plastics can contain tin. Now this is my believe and not based on any scientific data. RO/DI water is not a natural state for water, it is lacking ions. So maybe it is pulling the tin from the plastic container. My rodi water is clean other than the tin. To test this theory I’m going to send in another test of my SW storage water. It is in the same type of storage container as the RO/DI container. If my theory is correct the level of tin in my mixed SW in the storage container, then it should match the level of the RO/DI water of 5.34ppb.
My RO/DI system is a BRS 75 that I did a dual membrane upgrade to along with the 3 different resins. Cation, anion and mixed bed DI. What I am finding now is that my anion is the only resin that gets used up. I make a lot of water. I get thousands of gallons before I have to change it.
 

Dr. Jim

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FYI my tests took about 2 weeks to get results. The tests are shipped from CA to Germany.
I don’t know if the Triton detox would work or not. Maybe send them a message.
My guess for my RO/DI water with tin is coming from the storage container. I sent two RO/DI water samples. One was direct from the output of the DI resin. The second was from RO/DI storage container like I did from the first test I did. For me the output of the DI resin was zero for tin. Which is great news for me. The storage container still has tin in it but the level has dropped from in the 20’s to 5.34ppb. That was without any metal removing media.
From what I’ve been reading plastics can contain tin. Now this is my believe and not based on any scientific data. RO/DI water is not a natural state for water, it is lacking ions. So maybe it is pulling the tin from the plastic container. My rodi water is clean other than the tin. To test this theory I’m going to send in another test of my SW storage water. It is in the same type of storage container as the RO/DI container. If my theory is correct the level of tin in my mixed SW in the storage container, then it should match the level of the RO/DI water of 5.34ppb.
My RO/DI system is a BRS 75 that I did a dual membrane upgrade to along with the 3 different resins. Cation, anion and mixed bed DI. What I am finding now is that my anion is the only resin that gets used up. I make a lot of water. I get thousands of gallons before I have to change it.
That is good that it sounds like you are narrowing it down. I may not be that lucky because I am using glass tanks for RO/DI storage and salt mixing. (I've always used glass because I know RO/DI is very "reactive" water. I suppose there is a chance that the glass could have a coating containing tin, but I believe that is only with low Fe glass).
I have all BRS RO/DI equipment also with the same 3 cartridges (only 5 mo old). I also have a pressure pump and the low pressure shut off switch, as well as a SpectraPure vacuum operated level control....so a lot of stuff I will have to check out if my RO/DI test comes back with tin....but I hope that's it!
I'll post again when I get the ATI results (in about 5 days). In the meantime, I'm stopping daily AWC's and I put the Metasorb back in the sump. I will probably order a Polyfilter, Triton Detox and the Brightwell product you suggested as well.
Thanks again for helping....and, Good Luck!!
 

KenO

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That is good that it sounds like you are narrowing it down. I may not be that lucky because I am using glass tanks for RO/DI storage and salt mixing. (I've always used glass because I know RO/DI is very "reactive" water. I suppose there is a chance that the glass could have a coating containing tin, but I believe that is only with low Fe glass).
I have all BRS RO/DI equipment also with the same 3 cartridges (only 5 mo old). I also have a pressure pump and the low pressure shut off switch, as well as a SpectraPure vacuum operated level control....so a lot of stuff I will have to check out if my RO/DI test comes back with tin....but I hope that's it!
I'll post again when I get the ATI results (in about 5 days). In the meantime, I'm stopping daily AWC's and I put the Metasorb back in the sump. I will probably order a Polyfilter, Triton Detox and the Brightwell product you suggested as well.
Thanks again for helping....and, Good Luck!!
I also have the same spectrapure setup along with a booster pump. My setup has a low and high switch for the turning on/off of the spectrapure setup.
If your glass has tin it will leach off over time. Good luck with your testing. Keep me updated on test results and any detox results. I’ll do the same.
 

KenO

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I had high TIN level's and I changed all Rusty hinges and and checked all magnet's and my lights I had had some rust. Changed lights and hinges and TIN level 0
Rust will typically cause high tin readings. On a ICP test rust can also be indicated by showing above normal levels of iron and zinc. When I had a rusty probe holder magnet, my ICP test had high iron and zinc. In my situation the tin is coming from my storage container. It has been slowly leaching out over time.
 

Reefltx

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Well, check out my tin lvl. No clue where it’s coming from. My RO/di source is 0 and so far my corals including sps hasn’t shown any stress.

1C9BA106-DC39-4DC5-B27F-E3A39A801078.jpeg
 

KenO

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Well, check out my tin lvl. No clue where it’s coming from. My RO/di source is 0 and so far my corals including sps hasn’t shown any stress.

1C9BA106-DC39-4DC5-B27F-E3A39A801078.jpeg
We have no way of knowing if the tin shown in the test is toxic or not. Since your tank inhabitants aren’t having issues, I would keep track of the numbers but not worry about.
 

Dr. Jim

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Rust will typically cause high tin readings. On a ICP test rust can also be indicated by showing above normal levels of iron and zinc. When I had a rusty probe holder magnet, my ICP test had high iron and zinc. In my situation the tin is coming from my storage container. It has been slowly leaching out over time.
Yes, I agree that if tin is coming from a metal, other metals will be elevated. (This is not my case....I only have high tin). Since tin is common in plastics, and because my entire system is relatively new....only 5 months old....I'm looking at everything made of plastic (to see if anything looks suspicious). All the PVC that I used was "old" but the Red Sea Reefer came with new Sched 80 PVC. No way to check that but I'm guessing it is probably not the culprit.
But I did have 2 Vortech Guards (that I cut down and modified) that are placed over Vortech pumps. I'm guessing not many people use this particular guard....and it seems like it is made of an unusual type of plastic. (Click on th link to enlarge the photo and you might see what I mean). This may be a long-shot, but I removed them …..(at least while I wait for ATI ICP test results in 3-4 days)
 

KenO

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I put a 500-800 gallon bag of the MetaSorb into my main setup (600 gallons) yesterday. I ordered a number of water test kits. I am going to leave the MetaSorb for the 10 day period and then send out a water test.
 

KenO

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This you will find interesting, look at what I found in my sand. I am using Tropic Eden Reef Flakes sand. I like it because it has a larger grain size. When I was hanging my lights above the 250 gallon tank I needed to use screws to attach the lights. I know I didn't drop any screws in the tank, but I wanted to be sure so I used a magnet to go through the sand. I didn't find any screws, but I found these metal flakes or pieces. I don't believe the pieces are iron based, my water test didn't show any rust (i.e. zinc or iron). I am not sure what type of metal this is. I found it both of my tanks (250 gallon and 130 gallon) that are using the same sand listed above. I'm not sure if it is Tin or how to even test the metal. It is not polarized since the pieces aren't stuck together in the 2nd picture, but they are attracted to the magnet. They don't appear to be "rusted" but are somewhat corroded on the surface.

IMG_2530.jpeg


IMG_2532.jpeg
 

KenO

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So the 500-800 gallon bag of MetaSorb has been in my 600 gallon setup since Sunday. The bag of MetaSorb has turned yellow. So it is absorbing something. Yellow is not one of the colors listed to indicate what metal is being absorbed. Since tin is the highest level metal that was shown on the ATI test let’s hope that’s what’s being absorbed. The yellow color is much brighter than what the picture shows.

The smaller MetaSorb bag (250 gallon) came. I just added one to my 60 cube. Since that tank has 2x the level of the 600 gallon setup, I’m interested to see what color it turns and how quickly it changes.

58A4B4CD-38F6-4961-9236-26EBB44E3FE8.jpeg

75646648-75FE-4985-9917-2C3BACB37EE2.jpeg
 

im_jeremy5

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Well, I am now in the tin removal club. After every sps shedding its tissue I got an icp test. Came back with 16 tin and a small amount of aluminum.

After this thread I am beginning to suspect my brute trash can I store my RO in... In the process of mass water changes. If my next test comes back the same or higher I'll be sending off some of my RO to see if that is the problem.
 

KenO

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Well, I am now in the tin removal club. After every sps shedding its tissue I got an icp test. Came back with 16 tin and a small amount of aluminum.

After this thread I am beginning to suspect my brute trash can I store my RO in... In the process of mass water changes. If my next test comes back the same or higher I'll be sending off some of my RO to see if that is the problem.
Anything new in your system like pvc plumbing, acrylic sump, etc?
 

KenO

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Quick update. The bag of MetaSorb in my 60 cube setup also turned yellow like the bag in my main setup. Waiting on my Triton ICP tests. I received an email from them on Friday that my samples were received. Should have The icp test results any day now.
 

KenO

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So my Triton ICP test results came in. Both of my setups show that the tin is still there. So it looks like the MetaSorb didn’t absorb the tin.
 

Dr. Jim

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Tin Problem Update:

I just got three ICP tests back after 7 days of using Polyfilter, Seachem Cuprisorb, MetaSorb, Continuum Power Cleanse, and carbon....(not all at the same time but with a lot of overlapping). I also performed water changes during this time which, by themselves, should have lowered the tin from 22 to 8.5, even if none of the adsorbents had been used (or didn't help). But the tin came back at 18! This suggests that none of these products worked OR the tin leached back quicker than it could be removed.

Everything in my "RO/DI--Salt Mixing Room" is fine.

I tore down my system and moved everything into 4 make-shift tanks with plans to send out about 8-9 samples next week. Hopefully, this will narrow things down or pinpoint my problem. I'm really suspecting, and hoping, that it is the Carib Sea artificial rock. This seems like the most likely thing to quickly replenish the tin into the water. Another tank that will be sampled has just Gulf of Mexico live rock with all my livestock. The main tank and sump (5 mo old Red Sea Reefer) was cleaned and filled with new water; each will be sampled. Another tank which will be sampled has all the misc. items soaking: skimmer, pumps, pvc, etc. And lastly, I have a tank for just my hang-on refugium which will be sampled.

Will update in a couple of weeks.

Sherlock
 

KenO

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Tin Problem Update:

I just got three ICP tests back after 7 days of using Polyfilter, Seachem Cuprisorb, MetaSorb, Continuum Power Cleanse, and carbon....(not all at the same time but with a lot of overlapping). I also performed water changes during this time which, by themselves, should have lowered the tin from 22 to 8.5, even if none of the adsorbents had been used (or didn't help). But the tin came back at 18! This suggests that none of these products worked OR the tin leached back quicker than it could be removed.

Everything in my "RO/DI--Salt Mixing Room" is fine.

I tore down my system and moved everything into 4 make-shift tanks with plans to send out about 8-9 samples next week. Hopefully, this will narrow things down or pinpoint my problem. I'm really suspecting, and hoping, that it is the Carib Sea artificial rock. This seems like the most likely thing to quickly replenish the tin into the water. Another tank that will be sampled has just Gulf of Mexico live rock with all my livestock. The main tank and sump (5 mo old Red Sea Reefer) was cleaned and filled with new water; each will be sampled. Another tank which will be sampled has all the misc. items soaking: skimmer, pumps, pvc, etc. And lastly, I have a tank for just my hang-on refugium which will be sampled.

Will update in a couple of weeks.

Sherlock
Have you tested your RO/DI water?
On a different note, I noticed your from Farmingdale. I live in AZ now but I use to live in Toms River. I was there when Sandy hit.
 

Dr. Jim

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Have you tested your RO/DI water?
On a different note, I noticed your from Farmingdale. I live in AZ now but I use to live in Toms River. I was there when Sandy hit.
Hi Neighbor! :) (Not sure if we ever met at any of the NJ Reefers Clubs swaps or other local swaps where I was a vendor).

Yes, I tested water directly out of the RO/DI as well as water from my salt mixing tank and they were both free of tin. (By default, this eliminates the RO/DI holding tank as well. I'm actually using that tank now for my temporary tank for all my fish, corals and Gulf rock. I hope I can keep everything alive in this 29 gal tank with no skimmer (or sump) for 2 weeks until I get back my next set of ICP results. I'm testing nitrites, nitrates, phosphates and alk daily and doing water changes twice a day. My "filter" is only 25lbs of the Gulf rock, and, there are 30 SPS frags in there!).
Temp tank.jpg
 

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