How can I lower the alkalinity in fresh saltwater mix?

[A_Blind_Reefer]

1/11,000 of water volume to drop 2.8 dkh.

let me make sure I understand correctly,

if I wanted to lower the alk of 11k gallons by2.8 dkh I would do 1 gallon of muratic acid?


in my case the alk is 11.3 on about 50ish gallons of water which I want to bring to about 8.5

to find how much I would need I take

(1/11,000) x 50 = approx .0045454 gallons which converts to approx 17 mls?


Does that sound right?

If it helps, I use twenty ml to bring seventyish gallons of IO down to nine dkh. I have a bunch of old Red Sea test kit glass vials and have someone fill them all up with twenty mls of muriatic acid for me (I can’t see to measure anything). That way is all I have to do is twist off the cap and dump a vial into my mixing station every time I make fresh saltwater. Also, the first time I tried this my Alk did not drop as it should and I ended up using a ton more than needed. Randy helped me figure out that my mixing station probably had precipitate build up at the bottom and the acid was diluting that. I cleaned out my mixing vessel and after that it’s been flawless. I suggest making sure your mixing vessel is cleaned out when switching to this method.

 

[Rawsreef]

If it helps, I use twenty ml to bring seventyish gallons of IO down to nine dkh. I have a bunch of old Red Sea test kit glass vials and have someone fill them all up with twenty mls of muriatic acid for me (I can’t see to measure anything). That way is all I have to do is twist off the cap and dump a vial into my mixing station every time I make fresh saltwater. Also, the first time I tried this my Alk did not drop as it should and I ended up using a ton more than needed. Randy helped me figure out that my mixing station probably had precipitate build up at the bottom and the acid was diluting that. I cleaned out my mixing vessel and after that it’s been flawless. I suggest making sure your mixing vessel is cleaned out when switching to this method.

Noted and much appreciated!

The 20 mls is pretty close to what I got, so I guess I did the calculations correct.

I use 2 brute trash cans to make water so every time I use the water I wash with tap water, dry off and put them away. So they stay relatively clean, I hope I don't run into any issues.

 

[rtparty]

Sorry, it’s 100x easier to just buy a salt mix that matches what you want to run. You will get inconsistent parameters with IO as well. Alkalinity will be 9 on some buckets and 11+ on others. I’ve tested well over a dozen batches of them now and inconsistency is one thing they are consistent at

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

Noted and much appreciated!

The 20 mls is pretty close to what I got, so I guess I did the calculations correct.

I use 2 brute trash cans to make water so every time I use the water I wash with tap water, dry off and put them away. So they stay relatively clean, I hope I don't run into any issues.

It has worked out well for me and is dirt cheap. I get a twin gallon pack of muriatic pool acid for ten bucks. I now also use the acid for pump cleaning at ten to one dilution with water. It works much faster and cheaper than citric acid and doesn’t kill my pumps like vinegar did.

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

Sorry, it’s 100x easier to just buy a salt mix that matches what you want to run. You will get inconsistent parameters with IO as well. Alkalinity will be 9 on some buckets and 11+ on others. I’ve tested well over a dozen batches of them now and inconsistency is one thing they are consistent at

First, doesn’t help with the ops question at all. Second, your results don’t seem to be in line with many others. Third, cost and availability may be an issue for some. Some people just prefer to get what’s available absolutely everywhere and doesn’t run into supply chain issues. I’m glad it’s so much easier for you though.

 

[rtparty]

First, doesn’t help with the ops question at all. Second, your results don’t seem to be in line with many others. Third, cost and availability may be an issue for some. Some people just prefer to get what’s available absolutely everywhere and doesn’t run into supply chain issues. I’m glad it’s so much easier for you though.

It actually does help even just for future reference.

There are loads of threads with IO numbers and they aren’t consistent at all

 

[Rawsreef]

Sorry, it’s 100x easier to just buy a salt mix that matches what you want to run. You will get inconsistent parameters with IO as well. Alkalinity will be 9 on some buckets and 11+ on others. I’ve tested well over a dozen batches of them now and inconsistency is one thing they are consistent at

I was also looking to switch salts, but one of the issues I ran into is that no salt really has the parameters I want.

I aim for 8.5-9 dkh, 420 calcium, and 1350 mag. IO seemed pretty close, while being fairly cheap.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

1/11,000 of water volume to drop 2.8 dkh.

let me make sure I understand correctly,

if I wanted to lower the alk of 11k gallons by2.8 dkh I would do 1 gallon of muratic acid?


in my case the alk is 11.3 on about 50ish gallons of water which I want to bring to about 8.5

to find how much I would need I take

(1/11,000) x 50 = approx .0045454 gallons which converts to approx 17 mls?


Does that sound right?

Yes, that is correct.

 

[rtparty]

I was also looking to switch salts, but one of the issues I ran into is that no salt really has the parameters I want.

I aim for 8.5-9 dkh, 420 calcium, and 1350 mag. IO seemed pretty close, while being fairly cheap.

Red Sea Blue, AccurSea, HW Reefer, TM Pro Reef (Alk is a little lower than that but great salt) all meet those.

 

[Rawsreef]

Yes, that is correct.

Thank you very much Randy!

How long should I wait after dosing the muratic acid to begin aeration? And then I assume it's 24 hours of aeration

I dosed with mixing pumps on to help keep water circulating. Not sure if this will affect it in any way.

 

[jda]

For Murtatic, gallons * dKh drop * .123 works very well. Once you figure it out, you can use the same measurement forever. 24 hours with a powerhead pointed at the surface works for me.

In a 44g brute container with IO, this is about 20mls of Muriatic. Impurities might be an issue, but I have never noticed. I would rather have a rock solid salt and the possibility of some impurities in the acid than a so-so salt with wandering purity and batches.

I get rock solid results by mixing the whole 50g bag of IO at a time.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Thank you very much Randy!

How long should I wait after dosing the muratic acid to begin aeration? And then I assume it's 24 hours of aeration

I dosed with mixing pumps on to help keep water circulating. Not sure if this will affect it in any way.

You can begin aeration as soon as you add the acid. Aeration time will depend on the pH. I’d measure it after 24 h.

 

[Icryhard]

I actually have some of that stuff on hand (just a little I think) but I think that stuff is for raising the alkalinity not lowering ?

You can simply use some lemon juice. Let it sit overnight for the pH and done. No need to go expensive routes.

 

[Icryhard]

Yes, that is correct.

Very irrelevant (and not trying to hijack the thread) question, but by any chance you know the formula to increase dkh with 1 using baking soda? Every formula out there thusfar has rather screwed me over.

 

[Magic031707]

Sorry, it’s 100x easier to just buy a salt mix that matches what you want to run. You will get inconsistent parameters with IO as well. Alkalinity will be 9 on some buckets and 11+ on others. I’ve tested well over a dozen batches of them now and inconsistency is one thing they are consistent at

I've tried the red sea blue bucket and my alk still has not come down to the 8's. I switched to Nyos as their salt is 8.3. I've used 2 buckets so far. My Alk still 9.2. What gives? So is it easier or just lucky?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

You can simply use some lemon juice. Let it sit overnight for the pH and done. No need to go expensive routes.

I'm sorry, but this is not a useful procedure and should not be used. Did you read it somewhere?

The acid in lemon juice is largely citric acid. Like the acetic acid in vinegar, and any metabolizable organic acid, once the citric acid is metabolized in the aquarium, all of the "lost" alkalinity will come back.

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Very irrelevant (and not trying to hijack the thread) question, but by any chance you know the formula to increase dkh with 1 using baking soda? Every formula out there thusfar has rather screwed me over.

This calculator is reliable for adding baking soda:

Reef Chemistry Calculator
http://reef.diesyst.com/chemcalc/chem_calc3.html

 

[rtparty]

I've tried the red sea blue bucket and my alk still has not come down to the 8's. I switched to Nyos as their salt is 8.3. I've used 2 buckets so far. My Alk still 9.2. What gives? So is it easier or just lucky?

Test kit error

 

[Icryhard]

I'm sorry, but this is not a useful procedure and should not be used. Did you read it somewhere?

The acid in lemon juice is largely citric acid. Like the acetic acid in vinegar, and any metabolizable organic acid, once the citric acid is metabolized in the aquarium, all of the "lost" alkalinity will come back.

Not sure how that would work, mine drops and does not come back up (tested multiple times with intervals of 12 hours and then 24 hours. Any idea why this could be the case?

 

[Randy Holmes-Farley]

Not sure how that would work, mine drops and does not come back up (tested multiple times with intervals of 12 hours and then 24 hours. Any idea why this could be the case?

Not enough bacteria and nutrients in the mixing bucket to metabolize it, probably. In the reef tank it should come back.