How I won my dino battle (YMMV)

[jattinella]

I started my 75 Gallon a little over a year ago. I have an algae scrubber and 15W AquaUV sterilizer in the return pump flow. I set it up with dry rock, did a Dr Timms fishless cycle, had what I thought was a very light "ugly" stage, stocked some small reef-safe fish and in around 6 months after my parameters appeared to stabilize, I introduced some corals, a mix of LPS, Zoos, and a couple SPS. In retrospect this was a mistake. I should have waited longer. My parameters were stable, but my nitrates and phosphates were zero. This is before I had a Hanna ULR Phosphate test kit so all I knew was that the phosphates were not too high but did not expect them to actually be zero. Also, at that time I didn't realize that zero nitrates and phosphates was a recipe for a dino outbreak. I started seeing the brown snotty stuff on the rocks. I originally thought it was some type of safe algae or diatoms. I then noticed my SPS's starting to bleach and one was slowing getting covered with brown. After purchasing a microscope and then comparing to available pictures it was clear that I had Ostreopsis Dinoflagellates, the bad stuff!

I wanted to first get my nitrates and phosphates in proper balance so as to provide competition for the dinos with good algae growth. At the same time reduce the existing dino population with UV, repeated cleaning of rocks glass, and filtering. Feeding the fish and corals heavy did not help my zero readings so I purchased nitrate and phosphate additives from BRS (Aquaforest Lab NO3+ and Aquaforest PO4 Boost). I first started dosing nitrates. Reaching the desired level of nitrates was much easier than the phosphates. Once bringing them up to the 5-9 range, they held steady without any additional dosing. I then started dosing phosphates. Every day for weeks I dosed phosphates because it kept getting absorbed down to zero. From what I understand it was likely the dry rock not at equilibrium yet. Also, I suspect the corals and dinos also contributed to the reduction. This appeared it was going to be a lengthy battle, so I put the phosphate additive on a dosing pump and spread dosing throughout the day (1.1 ml four times a day), testing daily with a Hanna Ultra Low Phosphate test kit. This allowed me to maintain a consistent 0.05-0.15 range. Also, two times a day I would blow off the rocks and sometimes take a toothbrush to them. I did one of the cleaning close to light out to hopefully get more the dinos into the water column. I put my UV sterilizer on 24/7 and cleaned my algae scrubber often. Eventually, (around 4 weeks) the brown started to go away, and I needed less and less phosphate additive to maintain a 0.05-0.15 range. I then began to see some green algae growth, but not excessive. My algae scrubber was slowly having the brown snot replaced by green algae and some (different) brown as well. Also, the glass was starting to collect some brown again, but under the microsope I saw only a tiny number of dinos in this brown, but lots of diatoms. The few dinos I saw were not moving.

I later added a 16 oz jar of Tisbee copepods from Algae Barn, along with daily dosing 30 ml of their live Oceanmagik phytoplankton blend. Microscope samples of glass scrapes are not finding any dinos, and I see dinos and live phytoplankton. I now appear to have stabilized my nitrates (around 9) and phosphates (.05-.08) with no more phosphate dosing. I lost a couple SPS corals during this process, but the corals that survived are showing healthy growth now and good extension and my fish are all looking healthy. One thing to note is that late in this process I replaced my UV bulb since it was a little over a year old and at the same time removed and cleaned the quartz sleeve in the AquaUV sterilizer. I was very surprised that the quartz sleeve was completely covered with calcium deposits, letting very little UV to escape. I suspect if I had done this UV maintenance earlier in my battle, it would have resolved faster. Lesson learned that the UV sleeve should be cleaned much more often than once a year.

 

[Euphylliaphyle]

I started my 75 Gallon a little over a year ago. I have an algae scrubber and 15W AquaUV sterilizer in the return pump flow. I set it up with dry rock, did a Dr Timms fishless cycle, had what I thought was a very light "ugly" stage, stocked some small reef-safe fish and in around 6 months after my parameters appeared to stabilize, I introduced some corals, a mix of LPS, Zoos, and a couple SPS. In retrospect this was a mistake. I should have waited longer. My parameters were stable, but my nitrates and phosphates were zero. This is before I had a Hanna ULR Phosphate test kit so all I knew was that the phosphates were not too high but did not expect them to actually be zero. Also, at that time I didn't realize that zero nitrates and phosphates was a recipe for a dino outbreak. I started seeing the brown snotty stuff on the rocks. I originally thought it was some type of safe algae or diatoms. I then noticed my SPS's starting to bleach and one was slowing getting covered with brown. After purchasing a microscope and then comparing to available pictures it was clear that I had Ostreopsis Dinoflagellates, the bad stuff!

I wanted to first get my nitrates and phosphates in proper balance so as to provide competition for the dinos with good algae growth. At the same time reduce the existing dino population with UV, repeated cleaning of rocks glass, and filtering. Feeding the fish and corals heavy did not help my zero readings so I purchased nitrate and phosphate additives from BRS (Aquaforest Lab NO3+ and Aquaforest PO4 Boost). I first started dosing nitrates. Reaching the desired level of nitrates was much easier than the phosphates. Once bringing them up to the 5-9 range, they held steady without any additional dosing. I then started dosing phosphates. Every day for weeks I dosed phosphates because it kept getting absorbed down to zero. From what I understand it was likely the dry rock not at equilibrium yet. Also, I suspect the corals and dinos also contributed to the reduction. This appeared it was going to be a lengthy battle, so I put the phosphate additive on a dosing pump and spread dosing throughout the day (1.1 ml four times a day), testing daily with a Hanna Ultra Low Phosphate test kit. This allowed me to maintain a consistent 0.05-0.15 range. Also, two times a day I would blow off the rocks and sometimes take a toothbrush to them. I did one of the cleaning close to light out to hopefully get more the dinos into the water column. I put my UV sterilizer on 24/7 and cleaned my algae scrubber often. Eventually, (around 4 weeks) the brown started to go away, and I needed less and less phosphate additive to maintain a 0.05-0.15 range. I then began to see some green algae growth, but not excessive. My algae scrubber was slowly having the brown snot replaced by green algae and some (different) brown as well. Also, the glass was starting to collect some brown again, but under the microsope I saw only a tiny number of dinos in this brown, but lots of diatoms. The few dinos I saw were not moving.

I later added a 16 oz jar of Tisbee copepods from Algae Barn, along with daily dosing 30 ml of their live Oceanmagik phytoplankton blend. Microscope samples of glass scrapes are not finding any dinos, and I see dinos and live phytoplankton. I now appear to have stabilized my nitrates (around 9) and phosphates (.05-.08) with no more phosphate dosing. I lost a couple SPS corals during this process, but the corals that survived are showing healthy growth now and good extension and my fish are all looking healthy. One thing to note is that late in this process I replaced my UV bulb since it was a little over a year old and at the same time removed and cleaned the quartz sleeve in the AquaUV sterilizer. I was very surprised that the quartz sleeve was completely covered with calcium deposits, letting very little UV to escape. I suspect if I had done this UV maintenance earlier in my battle, it would have resolved faster. Lesson learned that the UV sleeve should be cleaned much more often than once a year.

Thanks for sharing lessons learned!

 

[jattinella]

Typo near end of my post: Microscope samples of glass scrapes are not finding any dinos, and I see dinos diatoms and live phytoplankton.

 

[Jack_L]

I started my 75 Gallon a little over a year ago. I have an algae scrubber and 15W AquaUV sterilizer in the return pump flow. I set it up with dry rock, did a Dr Timms fishless cycle, had what I thought was a very light "ugly" stage, stocked some small reef-safe fish and in around 6 months after my parameters appeared to stabilize, I introduced some corals, a mix of LPS, Zoos, and a couple SPS. In retrospect this was a mistake. I should have waited longer. My parameters were stable, but my nitrates and phosphates were zero. This is before I had a Hanna ULR Phosphate test kit so all I knew was that the phosphates were not too high but did not expect them to actually be zero. Also, at that time I didn't realize that zero nitrates and phosphates was a recipe for a dino outbreak. I started seeing the brown snotty stuff on the rocks. I originally thought it was some type of safe algae or diatoms. I then noticed my SPS's starting to bleach and one was slowing getting covered with brown. After purchasing a microscope and then comparing to available pictures it was clear that I had Ostreopsis Dinoflagellates, the bad stuff!

I wanted to first get my nitrates and phosphates in proper balance so as to provide competition for the dinos with good algae growth. At the same time reduce the existing dino population with UV, repeated cleaning of rocks glass, and filtering. Feeding the fish and corals heavy did not help my zero readings so I purchased nitrate and phosphate additives from BRS (Aquaforest Lab NO3+ and Aquaforest PO4 Boost). I first started dosing nitrates. Reaching the desired level of nitrates was much easier than the phosphates. Once bringing them up to the 5-9 range, they held steady without any additional dosing. I then started dosing phosphates. Every day for weeks I dosed phosphates because it kept getting absorbed down to zero. From what I understand it was likely the dry rock not at equilibrium yet. Also, I suspect the corals and dinos also contributed to the reduction. This appeared it was going to be a lengthy battle, so I put the phosphate additive on a dosing pump and spread dosing throughout the day (1.1 ml four times a day), testing daily with a Hanna Ultra Low Phosphate test kit. This allowed me to maintain a consistent 0.05-0.15 range. Also, two times a day I would blow off the rocks and sometimes take a toothbrush to them. I did one of the cleaning close to light out to hopefully get more the dinos into the water column. I put my UV sterilizer on 24/7 and cleaned my algae scrubber often. Eventually, (around 4 weeks) the brown started to go away, and I needed less and less phosphate additive to maintain a 0.05-0.15 range. I then began to see some green algae growth, but not excessive. My algae scrubber was slowly having the brown snot replaced by green algae and some (different) brown as well. Also, the glass was starting to collect some brown again, but under the microsope I saw only a tiny number of dinos in this brown, but lots of diatoms. The few dinos I saw were not moving.

I later added a 16 oz jar of Tisbee copepods from Algae Barn, along with daily dosing 30 ml of their live Oceanmagik phytoplankton blend. Microscope samples of glass scrapes are not finding any dinos, and I see dinos and live phytoplankton. I now appear to have stabilized my nitrates (around 9) and phosphates (.05-.08) with no more phosphate dosing. I lost a couple SPS corals during this process, but the corals that survived are showing healthy growth now and good extension and my fish are all looking healthy. One thing to note is that late in this process I replaced my UV bulb since it was a little over a year old and at the same time removed and cleaned the quartz sleeve in the AquaUV sterilizer. I was very surprised that the quartz sleeve was completely covered with calcium deposits, letting very little UV to escape. I suspect if I had done this UV maintenance earlier in my battle, it would have resolved faster. Lesson learned that the UV sleeve should be cleaned much more often than once a year.

thanks for sharing, i am having a very similar experience as you. except the dinos killed more corals, and shrimp. shocking how fast they go south. i read a lot of people saying it would work itself out, but it just got worse, then i realized my PO4 and NO3 were bottomed out, and like you, it took a LOT LOT LOT of phosphaste dosing to get it up. but that justs fueled the dinos more. i did a blowoff and siphone, then just finished a 3 day blackout. my P and N are reading now, high on the P, guess i will see what happens next.

what kind of microscope did you get?

 

[BryanM]

Congrats on winning the battle, I hate dinos!

 

[jattinella]

thanks for sharing, i am having a very similar experience as you. except the dinos killed more corals, and shrimp. shocking how fast they go south. i read a lot of people saying it would work itself out, but it just got worse, then i realized my PO4 and NO3 were bottomed out, and like you, it took a LOT LOT LOT of phosphaste dosing to get it up. but that justs fueled the dinos more. i did a blowoff and siphone, then just finished a 3 day blackout. my P and N are reading now, high on the P, guess i will see what happens next.

what kind of microscope did you get?

I purchased the Tomlov DM301 max. I like the digital screen and the specimen table that allows small controlled adjustments to the glass slide position. Did you have a UV running when blowing off the Dino’s? Also the flow rate of the UV matters. I read mixed messages on if slow or fast rate is best for Dino’s. Normally slow for parasites and fast for algae, but these guys are very large under the scope so I went with the slower rate prioritizing dwell time over turn-over.

 

[Tahoe61]

Thank you for sharing your experience and treatment suggestions. I have used many of those intervention.
Within the last couple weeks I have finally been able to discontue the daily dosing of phosphate.

 

[Jack_L]

I purchased the Tomlov DM301 max. I like the digital screen and the specimen table that allows small controlled adjustments to the glass slide position. Did you have a UV running when blowing off the Dino’s? Also the flow rate of the UV matters. I read mixed messages on if slow or fast rate is best for Dino’s. Normally slow for parasites and fast for algae, but these guys are very large under the scope so I went with the slower rate prioritizing dwell time over turn-over.

i bought a UV, but it was steel, then i realize that is bad in SW. and TBH, the dinos were/are wearing me down, and i really didn't want to try to cram another device into the mess. what did instead was use 5 micron socks in my sump and kept chaning them before they overflowed. i have and OLD scope i got from craigslist, looks like an old highschool one. its a bit broken, but works.

 

[jattinella]

I purchased the Tomlov DM301 max. I like the digital screen and the specimen table that allows small controlled adjustments to the glass slide position. Did you have a UV running when blowing off the Dino’s? Also the flow rate of the UV matters. I read mixed messages on if slow or fast rate is best for Dino’s. Normally slow for parasites and fast for algae, but these guys are very large under the scope so I went with the slower rate prioritizing dwell time over turn-over.

i bought a UV, but it was steel, then i realize that is bad in SW. and TBH, the dinos were/are wearing me down, and i really didn't want to try to cram another device into the mess. what did instead was use 5 micron socks in my sump and kept chaning them before they overflowed. i have and OLD scope i got from craigslist, looks like an old highschool one. its a bit broken, but works.

It’s my understanding the ostreopsis Dino’s are large, 30-65 microns long and 18-50 microns wide so the 5 micron filter sock should definitely trap them when they go into the water column. Thanks for sharing. The more tools to combat Dino’s the better. I am using a 50 micron filter roller, so less effective. I suspect the UV zapped most of mine. Also frequent cleaning of my algae scrubber. After that, other algae, plankton, and pods took over once the PO4 and nitrates stabilized at desired levels.

 

[jattinella]

A follow-up: when cleaning out my algae scrubber and looking at the scrapings under a microscope, I am seeing dead Ostreopsis Dinoflagellates (no movement) surrounded by lots of living much smaller organisms. My rocks, sand, and display tank do not show any signs of dino's. It appears they still exist to a small extent (as seen in my scrubber) but are being adequately managed by biological and UV control. I believe it will be important to not let the nitrates and phosphates bottom out again. Subsequent Hana testing over the last few weeks has shown my phosphates/nitrates are relatively steady at 0.05/ 9.0.