Hydros Maven or Neptune?

JayM

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I’ve never used either, but based off of what I’ve read about Apex and Hydros, I’d likely go with Hydros.

That said, I don’t see the value in spending north of $1000 to test tank water.
 

JNalley

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I’ve never used either, but based off of what I’ve read about Apex and Hydros, I’d likely go with Hydros.

That said, I don’t see the value in spending north of $1000 to test tank water.
I mean, in Hanna testers, you're looking at ~$320, right?

It's still a manual process, and you then have to do data entry into a controller (or math manually) in order to dose things intelligently. The extra $900 is for the convenience of automatic testing and automatic dosing based on the results... Some people will pay for that benefit...
 

n2585722

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Thanks, yes I have a WE v2, I created a collective and go through the steps to add WIFI but it aborts and fails.
Do you happen to have a MESH type wifi network. Also your 5ghz channel and the 2.4ghz channel have to have different names in most cases for the wifi strips to communicate with the controllers since they have to connect on the same channel as the controller and that channel cannot be a guest channel or one with inner communications between devices blocked which some routers do. The controller and wifi strip have to communicate locally. Also make sure the device with the app is also on the channel that the controller is on when trying to pair the wifi strip to your wave engine. I have used my WEv2 as a wifi master in my collective before and I also paired it with a wifi strip before I added it to my collective. I usually do not add new controllers to the collective right a way. I use them stand alone to check them that way before adding them. Hope this helps. There is a guy that is very good with networks on the Hydros facebook group and also on the Hydros forum if you cannot get it paired he may be able to help with the router settings that may be needed.
 

leepink23

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Do you happen to have a MESH type wifi network. Also your 5ghz channel and the 2.4ghz channel have to have different names in most cases for the wifi strips to communicate with the controllers since they have to connect on the same channel as the controller and that channel cannot be a guest channel or one with inner communications between devices blocked which some routers do. The controller and wifi strip have to communicate locally. Also make sure the device with the app is also on the channel that the controller is on when trying to pair the wifi strip to your wave engine. I have used my WEv2 as a wifi master in my collective before and I also paired it with a wifi strip before I added it to my collective. I usually do not add new controllers to the collective right a way. I use them stand alone to check them that way before adding them. Hope this helps. There is a guy that is very good with networks on the Hydros facebook group and also on the Hydros forum if you cannot get it paired he may be able to help with the router settings that may be needed.
I do have a mesh network, will look into this, thank you.
 

n2585722

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I do have a mesh network, will look into this, thank you.
Sometime it is better on MESH networks to get a access point and use a wired connection to the main router from the access then set the access point up with a different name and only enable the 2.4ghz channel. Some routers will allow you to set them up as an access point instead of router mode. If you have an older router you may check and see if can do that and how you do it. It will vary depending on the router. I did this with one of my older routers.
 

JNalley

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I run my Hydros on a Mixed 2.4/5Ghz network and have never had any problems. I have 2 Netgear Nighthawk RAX120 AX6000 routers running my network. The 2.4 and 5Ghz networks share the same SSID (network name) and password. The main router is connected directly to Google Fiber and is in router mode, while the other router runs off of port 1 of the main router and is in Access-Point mode. Every device in my home can connect to this network without issues; this includes devices from Sony, Samsung, LG, HP, ASUS, InkBird, Govee, CoralVue/Hydros, Nest, Eufy, Aladdin Garage Door, and several other off-brands. I think the key to getting this to work is choosing a router that supports "Smart Connect" (this is Netgears name for the feature, but the feature itself is not unique to Netgear), which puts the router in charge of selecting, setting, and maintaining which devices connect to which signal (2.4 or 5) for the network.
 

n2585722

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I run my Hydros on a Mixed 2.4/5Ghz network and have never had any problems. I have 2 Netgear Nighthawk RAX120 AX6000 routers running my network. The 2.4 and 5Ghz networks share the same SSID (network name) and password. The main router is connected directly to Google Fiber and is in router mode, while the other router runs off of port 1 of the main router and is in Access-Point mode. Every device in my home can connect to this network without issues; this includes devices from Sony, Samsung, LG, HP, ASUS, InkBird, Govee, CoralVue/Hydros, Nest, Eufy, Aladdin Garage Door, and several other off-brands. I think the key to getting this to work is choosing a router that supports "Smart Connect" (this is Netgears name for the feature, but the feature itself is not unique to Netgear), which puts the router in charge of selecting, setting, and maintaining which devices connect to which signal (2.4 or 5) for the network.
Not all routers are the same. I was having trouble with my old router with the wifi devices for the Hydros dropping out. I could reboot the router and it would all come back up ok. I would even have an occasional issue with my surface not being able to connect. Then the first of December I got a new car that had wifi access. I set it up to our wifi. After that every time I would come home our wifi would go nuts with things dropping off the network so about mid December I got a new router that was good up to 64 devices. At the time I didn't know I could not separate the 2.4ghz and 5ghz. It is not setup as a MESH network. but I set it up with the same name and login as the old one and I have had no wifi issues since then even with both channels enabled. Odd thing is I setup the old router as an access point it it has worked flawless doing that. I guess it was overloaded with too many device. I have about 40 devices on it.
 

JNalley

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Not all routers are the same. I was have trouble with my old router with the wifi devices for the Hydros dropping out. I could reboot the router and it would all come back up ok. I would even have an occasional issue with my surface not being able to connect. Then the first of December I got a new car that had wifi access. I set it up to our wifi. After that every time I would come home our wifi would go nuts with things dropping off the network so about mid December I got a new router that was good up to 64 devices. At the time I didn't know I could not separate the 2.4ghz and 5ghz. It is not setup as a MESH network. but I set it up with the same name and login as the old one and I have had no wifi issues since then even with both channels enabled. Odd thing is I setup the old router as an access point it it has worked flawless doing that. I guess it was overloaded with too many device. I have about 40 devices on it.
I did mention that the key is finding a router that has and supports "Smart Connect," didn't I? I mean, that is a recognition that not all routers are the same... I even supplied which routers I used so that someone could look them up and find something with as many features/options. As a side hustle, I set up and maintain networks for local small and home-based businesses, so I know that not every router is the same. I also dislike Mesh networks because of how clumsy they are. Doing an Access Point (if feasible) Is almost always a better solution from a stability point of view.

I am just failing to understand why you quoted my post, can you elaborate on what you think is wrong?
 

n2585722

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I did mention that the key is finding a router that has and supports "Smart Connect," didn't I? I mean, that is a recognition that not all routers are the same... I even supplied which routers I used so that someone could look them up and find something with as many features/options. As a side hustle, I set up and maintain networks for local small and home-based businesses, so I know that not every router is the same. I also dislike Mesh networks because of how clumsy they are. Doing an Access Point (if feasible) Is almost always a better solution from a stability point of view.

I am just failing to understand why you quoted my post, can you elaborate on what you think is wrong?
I was just relaying I have the same thing with 2.4 and 5ghz having the same name and don't have an issue. I use a Asus RT-AX58U. I do have dual band smart connect on on my router. So I guess Asus and Netgear use the same name for it. A lot are having issues but it may be more of a MESH thing than the dual band.
 

JNalley

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I was just relaying I have the same thing with 2.4 and 5ghz having the same name and don't have an issue. I use a Asus RT-AX58U. I do have dual band smart connect on on my router. So I guess Asus and Netgear use the same name for it. A lot are having issues but it may be more of a MESH thing than the dual band.
Yeah, IME Mesh is less stable than Access Points and, often, does not contain advanced routing features like Smart Connect at similar price points. You have to jump way up the price point ladder to get those extra stability/compatibility features. Mesh systems have come a long way since the days of repeaters, but they still are not as versatile and feature-rich as an Access Point system of the same cost.
 

aaron186

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I wanted to go with hydros but I have a remote location mixing and dosing station. It was far easier to run a usb cable with my tubes and use apex rather than trying to run a proprietary cable from hydros or rely on wifi.

Obviously nobody has used the maven yet but it looks promising. I’ve heard mixed reviews on trident. You could consider apex and the maven as its stand alone too
 

aaron186

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I run my Hydros on a Mixed 2.4/5Ghz network and have never had any problems. I have 2 Netgear Nighthawk RAX120 AX6000 routers running my network. The 2.4 and 5Ghz networks share the same SSID (network name) and password. The main router is connected directly to Google Fiber and is in router mode, while the other router runs off of port 1 of the main router and is in Access-Point mode. Every device in my home can connect to this network without issues; this includes devices from Sony, Samsung, LG, HP, ASUS, InkBird, Govee, CoralVue/Hydros, Nest, Eufy, Aladdin Garage Door, and several other off-brands. I think the key to getting this to work is choosing a router that supports "Smart Connect" (this is Netgears name for the feature, but the feature itself is not unique to Netgear), which puts the router in charge of selecting, setting, and maintaining which devices connect to which signal (2.4 or 5) for the network.
I found it better if your router allows for additional SSIDs to create a separate SSID for smart home/aquarium stuff that only runs on 2.4 ghz. Much more stable in my experience. Plus you can add some security settings to block Google and what not from accessing your data on the second network if you’re savvy
 

JNalley

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I found it better if your router allows for additional SSIDs to create a separate SSID for smart home/aquarium stuff that only runs on 2.4 ghz. Much more stable in my experience. Plus you can add some security settings to block Google and what not from accessing your data on the second network if you’re savvy
Yes, that's a very common "answer" to this problem, it used to be called Wifi-Steering or Band-Steering, and to be fair, most people just accept this as a necessary evil. But it doesn't have to be. By investing a bit more money up front (By way of nicer Wifi Equipment) you get better performance with fewer compromises. Not all routers and modems are created equally, and your ISP is buying the most bottom of the barrel one they can have mass-produced for their customers, they have almost no smart feature sets. Most people just accept the modem+router combo that their ISP gives them and call it a day. Most of the time they pay a rental fee for this equipment on their bill every month (not always, but most of the time). It's typically better to buy your own modem or modem router combo and use that. If your ISP doesn't allow you to have your own modem (this is a very small population of people as most ISPs allow it) you need to ask your ISP for a modem only (No router) or a modem + router combo that you can disable the routing on (called Bridge Mode) and buy your own network equipment that meet the needs of your connected household (eg. Smart Connect).

By doing so, you can ensure you have smooth stable connections in your household and all throughout your property. Our world is only going to become more and more connected, so making these investments now will actually continue to benefit you down the road as more and more technologies are released.
 

n2585722

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I wanted to go with hydros but I have a remote location mixing and dosing station. It was far easier to run a usb cable with my tubes and use apex rather than trying to run a proprietary cable from hydros or rely on wifi.

Obviously nobody has used the maven yet but it looks promising. I’ve heard mixed reviews on trident. You could consider apex and the maven as its stand alone too
My mixing station is in the garage 35ft from the tank. I use an old CAT 5 cable that was already installed in the media box in the garage to the room with the tank for a data only cable so I could have the controllers at the tank and controllers at the mixing station in the same collective, I think Jeff sells adapters you can do it with. A collective cannot use wifi for communication between the controllers. Each controller still has to have wifi access to communicate with the cloud and the app.
 

ca1ore

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Obviously nobody has used the maven yet but it looks promising. I’ve heard mixed reviews on trident.
Thus the perils of trying to draw any kind of useful comparisons. Seven years of consumer usage versus the effectiveness of a marketing department.

I’ve no intention of moving away from the sunk cost that is my apex system, but I’m undecided as to whether the NP is on my wish list. I’ll wait until there are some reports from the field.
 

Thales

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I suggest newer reefers get some reefing experience before jumping into automation. Automation is a whole nother universe to learn and understand.
 

aaron186

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Thus the perils of trying to draw any kind of useful comparisons. Seven years of consumer usage versus the effectiveness of a marketing department.

I’ve no intention of moving away from the sunk cost that is my apex system, but I’m undecided as to whether the NP is on my wish list. I’ll wait until there are some reports from the field.
I was planning on pulling the trigger on a trident vs looking into a different alk monitor. I’m heavy into apex but I recently got rid of my Dos under my tank in favor of a much quieter versa. I’m going to wait to see how the Maven is reviewed before making a decision
 

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I'm a Hydros user and don't have any experience with Apex. However, the Maven does pass the initial sniff test as far as advertised form and function.

As for cost, it's $1199. This is cheaper than the Mastertronic, but I don't know what the Apex equivalent is. Right now they have an Alkalinity, Magnesium, and Calcium tester for $700, and are coming out with a Nitrate and Phosphate tester that is unpriced as of today. To be equivalent, the Trident 2 NP would need to be $500, and I don't see that happening.

The Maven can run independent of any other Hydros equipment, so one does not need to make a Hydros/Apex decision right away, while the Neptune requires a further Apex system to run. Granted, it is likely someone getting the Neptune already has Apex, so that cost has already been eaten.

Someone getting the Maven has mostly locked themselves into creating a Hydros collective as it is extremely unlikely that Apex will integrate with it. So if they want to do anything with the results they'll need a Hydros setup.

Don't be swayed by people claiming that automation is a bad thing. It is a very good thing - especially for newer reefers. Just make sure you know the manual process before automating anything.
 

n2585722

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I'm a Hydros user and don't have any experience with Apex. However, the Maven does pass the initial sniff test as far as advertised form and function.

As for cost, it's $1199. This is cheaper than the Mastertronic, but I don't know what the Apex equivalent is. Right now they have an Alkalinity, Magnesium, and Calcium tester for $700, and are coming out with a Nitrate and Phosphate tester that is unpriced as of today. To be equivalent, the Trident 2 NP would need to be $500, and I don't see that happening.

The Maven can run independent of any other Hydros equipment, so one does not need to make a Hydros/Apex decision right away, while the Neptune requires a further Apex system to run. Granted, it is likely someone getting the Neptune already has Apex, so that cost has already been eaten.

Someone getting the Maven has mostly locked themselves into creating a Hydros collective as it is extremely unlikely that Apex will integrate with it. So if they want to do anything with the results they'll need a Hydros setup.

Don't be swayed by people claiming that automation is a bad thing. It is a very good thing - especially for newer reefers. Just make sure you know the manual process before automating anything.
You can control 2 dosing pumps from the 2 drive ports on the Maven so you can dose at least 2 things depending on test results with just the Maven an 2 dosing pumps.
 

Jimbo327

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Form Factor: Maven
Testing Schedule Flexibility: Maven
Cost: ? Don't know. Most likely Maven since they seem to wait for Trident NP official pricing before undercutting it.
Newbie friendly: Maven since it doesn't need a APEX brain
Time to Market: Trident NP
Tubing Kink-Proof: Maven
Accuracy and Precision: ??? Don't know.
Versatility: Maven. Can test 2 tanks with 1 unit.
 

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