I want to upgrade my return pump…will I ruin my sump water level?

[Miami Reef]

Tank is 250 gallons with a <1000 return pump. I’m having a lot of junk in the tank and it’s not getting filtered out.

I want to upgrade my return pump.

Here’s my dilemma: If I increase the speed water leaves the sump, that means more water will be in DT. Does that mean the water in the DT will flow back into the sump quicker and the water level will reach the same equilibrium that it has now?

I know VERY little about plumbing, so I’d appreciate any responses I can get.

Pictures of my entire system in next post.

 

[BroccoliFarmer]

Tank is 250 gallons with a <1000 return pump. I’m having a lot of junk in the tank and it’s not getting filtered out.

I want to upgrade my return pump.

Here’s my dilemma: If I increase the speed water leaves the sump, that means more water will be in DT. Does that mean the water in the DT will flow back into the sump quicker and the water level will reach the same equilibrium that it has now?

I know VERY little about plumbing, so I’d appreciate any responses I can get.

Pictures of my entire system in next post.

As long as your overflow from you DT exceeds the flow of your return pump, you should be fine. May require a little fine tuning but water level should be fine. Now if your overflow is less than your returns pump volume, you have a problem.

 

[MnFish1]

if the area that drains your display into the sump can handle the water flow it should re-requilbrate. Its all about the speed that the water drains from the display into the tank. So - if possible I would check with the manufacturer of the overflow/tank to see. If 'stuff' accumulating in your tank is the 'problem' - what might help more is more flow inside the tank - rather than more flow going into the sump. Keeping the 'stuff' in solution - will mean more eventually goes into the sump. In other words - more flow keeping 'stuff' off the bottom of the tank.

PS - I would suggest that if you're going to buy a new pump (return) - buy one thats adjustable. Beware though - if your overflow weirs become clogged and you try to match flow too closely - you can have an overflow.

 

[Miami Reef]

Here’s a video of me explaining my system.

 

[Miami Reef]

Video about when I close the return pump. (Water doesn’t overflow) I have a check valve.

 

[MnFish1]

Video about when I close the return pump. (Water doesn’t overflow) I have a check valve.

You might be misunderstanding the concern. Its not about water back flowing into your tank (which your video prevents) if the pump shuts off. The problem is water overflowing outside the tank (over the edges) - if the overflow cannot handle the amount of water that your pump is pumping back. It will keep pumping until your sump is empty and no more water is flowing back into the sump (which is down to the white pipe in your video. That looks like about 30 gallons of water.

 

[MnFish1]

I re-looked at the videos. I do not understand the reason for 'decreasing the flow through the overflow with acrylic and silicone'. This will make your potential problem worse. Second - I think your debris problem may very well be lack of flow in the tank - BUT - the return pump (which is working fine now) - to me is not the solution. The solution is to get a couple more pumps. Perhaps 2 gyres. For that big a tank that return seems too small in any case. I couldnt tell - do you have other pumps creating flow in the tank?

 

[Miami Reef]

You might be misunderstanding the concern. Its not about water back flowing into your tank (which your video prevents) if the pump shuts off. The problem is water overflowing outside the tank (over the edges) - if the overflow cannot handle the amount of water that your pump is pumping back. It will keep pumping until your sump is empty and no more water is flowing back into the sump (which is down to the white pipe in your video. That looks like about 30 gallons of water.

Now I understand.

Can that be remedied by removing the “teeth” of the overflow to allow more water to drain through? Maybe I can remove that siliconed acrylic that is blocking one section of the overflow?

 

[MnFish1]

Now I understand.

Can that be remedied by removing the “teeth” of the overflow to allow more water to drain through? Maybe I can remove that siliconed acrylic that is blocking one section of the overflow?

I wouldn't remove the teeth. I would remove the silicone and acrylic that you added. (the teeth keep fish snails, etc from going into the overflow.

 

[Miami Reef]

I re-looked at the videos. I do not understand the reason for 'decreasing the flow through the overflow with acrylic and silicone'. This will make your potential problem worse. Second - I think your debris problem may very well be lack of flow in the tank - BUT - the return pump (which is working fine now) - to me is not the solution. The solution is to get a couple more pumps. Perhaps 2 gyres. For that big a tank that return seems too small in any case. I couldnt tell - do you have other pumps creating flow in the tank?

I already have a ton of flow. I have 4 Jebao 5,500gph. I get a lot of flow in my tank.

I have a lot of particulates and it’s just circulating inside the tank (not making it into overflow)

 

[KStatefan]

When you increase the flow to the display the water level in the display tank will go up some depending on the design of your overflow weir this will make the water level in the sump lower and you will have to add additional water to maintain the same level as before.

 

[Miami Reef]

@MnFish1

Look at this video:

Crazy amount of particles. But none are going into overflow. It’s just recirculating (and it’s NOT microbubbles.)

 

[MnFish1]

I already have a ton of flow. I have 4 Jebao 5,500gph. I get a lot of flow in my tank.

I have a lot of particulates and it’s just circulating inside the tank (not making it into overflow)

I do not think a bigger return pump will necessarily help. What is the particulate material? Do you have filter socks, etc

 

[Miami Reef]

When you increase the flow to the display the water level in the display tank will go up some depending on the design of your overflow weir this will make the water level in the sump lower and you will have to add additional water to maintain the same level as before.

Oh shoot. If that’s the case then my sump WILL flood!

 

[MnFish1]

@MnFish1

Look at this video:

Crazy amount of particles. But none are going into overflow. It’s just recirculating (and it’s NOT microbubbles.)

Looking at your pumps - to ME - it looks like the way the pumps are set - they are almost directing most of the water in a very turbulent fashion - which would seem to keep most of the upper water 'clear' and the bottom of the water in the tank is going to contain particulates. Its hard to explain - but - the pumps the way you have them tend to divide the water into 2 halves rather than distributing it throughout the tank. In other words there is plenty of horizontal flow - but not a lot of vertical flow.

 

[Miami Reef]

I do not think a bigger return pump will necessarily help. What is the particulate material? Do you have filter socks, etc

I do run filter socks. But the particles aren’t going into overflow.

The particles look to be a mix of mainly sand particles. I always had a particle problem, but not as bad as this. I added (prerinsed) special grade sand to my bare bottom and it became much worse.

 

[MnFish1]

Oh shoot. If that’s the case then my sump WILL flood!

The way that I explained it is correct. If the return pump is pumping less water back into the tank than the amount that can flow through the overflow - nothing will happen. You need to make sure that this is the case. This is why I'm recommending - dont change your return pump - try re-arranging your other pumps first.

 

[Miami Reef]

Looking at your pumps - to ME - it looks like the way the pumps are set - they are almost directing most of the water in a very turbulent fashion - which would seem to keep most of the upper water 'clear' and the bottom of the water in the tank is going to contain particulates. Its hard to explain - but - the pumps the way you have them tend to divide the water into 2 halves rather than distributing it throughout the tank. In other words there is plenty of horizontal flow - but not a lot of vertical flow.

This is interesting. Will positioning half the pumps lower pointing up be the solution?

 

[MnFish1]

I do run filter socks. But the particles aren’t going into overflow.

The particles look to be a mix of mainly sand particles. I always had a particle problem, but not as bad as this. I added (prerinsed) special grade sand to my bare bottom and it became much worse.

Redirecting the flow in your tank will help (if its sand) - sand is not going to (generally) make it up to the overflow. My GUESS is that over time, its the smaller sand grains that are blowing around - and they will get filtered out.

BY THE WAY - IMPORTANT - if you lower the level where you have the acrylic/silicone - THAT will temporarily cause a higher volume in your sump. So - before you take that off - take some water out of the tank - put it in a bucket - and see what happens to the sump level. then re-add water until the water in your return chamber is enough for the pump to work.

 

[dbowman5]

i could be wrong but it is almost like the weir on the right is used as a secondary overflow if the water level goes up. how much flow do you have through that hose? the thing i would wonder about increasing the gpm of the return is whether the pump would empty the sump and suck air when it is started? would your ATO misinterpret the drop in level and add too much water?