Is a refugium in a small tank worth it... and what is the best macro algae to go with?

[Sonor]

Years ago I ran an Aquapod 24. I had a small glass tank built to fit into the cabinet. 13"x 13"x 7". I put an overflow into 1 of the rear chambers of the display, feeding the refugium below with 2 chambers, the fuge and a return chamber. It worked great, the fuge was ample size for the tank and I was also able to mount a tunze nano skimmer in one corner of the fuge. Plenty of pods and cheato for nutrient export. I ran mine with about 2" of sand as well as the chaeto. Lifereef makes a nano overflow that fit perfectly into the rear chamber of the display tank.

 

[Rjramos]

I have been running a 29 biocube since 2014. Chamber 1 skimmer. Initially had media basket with chemipure elite and purigen in chamber 2. Also have refugium basket with mud on bottom and chaeto in chamber 2. I stopped using the chemipure and purigen about 2 years ago with better results. Chaeto started growing better, parameters great.

 

[Knightnaut]

I have the IM 30L and am growing chaeto in the back compartment using a Intank fuge basket and it works well. It has been keeping my nutrients where I want them and have been able to tweak it by adjusting the photo period. I’m using the cheatomax light which is kind of expensive but does work well. On my IM 25 lagoon I’m using this cheaper amazon light and it seems to be working good as well. If you do go that route make sure to get some 3M VHB tape to attach it to the back glass.

That is the same one I have, except I use suction hooks to hang it, and then put plastic cabinet bumpers so I could hang it off the back and take it off for moving, cleaning, mods to wiring harnesses, etc..

 

[New&no clue]

Hi All, thanks for the responses. I didn't mean to drop the thread but we had a power outage for about 36 hours over the weekend, about a foot of heavy wet snow, and down trees and power lines everywhere... add that on the mandatory quarantine... it was not a great weekend .

Anyway, back to the refugium I decided to go for it. I'm going to use my 2nd chamber and see how it goes. I didn't go too crazy with a light to start. I did see the IM makes a fuge light that looked good, but was expense. I looked up some other Nuvo 30 to see what people were using and I found 1 light that several people had used with good results. I decided to go with two of them instead of one, as they were cheaper. I also bought in Fuge Basket. I think I will do Chaeto as it is easy to get, but I might turn my first chamber into a refugium as well depending on how this goes, and then I will pick something else in there.

 

[muzikalmatt]

Sounds like a good approach. Best of luck to you! Let us know how it works out.

 

[New&no clue]

Thank, if you want to follow along below is my build thread.

Build Thread - My ULM Office Tank- Nuvo 30L

Corals have been in for almost a week. Everything is looking good, but my Elegance Coral has really opened up and looks amazing. This is one of my favorite corals in both my tanks

www.reef2reef.com

 

[muzikalmatt]

Thank, if you want to follow along below is my build thread.

Build Thread - My ULM Office Tank- Nuvo 30L

Corals have been in for almost a week. Everything is looking good, but my Elegance Coral has really opened up and looks amazing. This is one of my favorite corals in both my tanks

www.reef2reef.com

Awesome! I will definitely check it out. I'm a big fan of IM's Nuvo line of AIO aquariums and I've been considering setting up a small office tank myself.

 

[Dom]

I’m not trying to grow pods, I’m not sure any of fish would eat them. I’m looking more for a natural way to export nutrients from the water and reduce the amount of water changes I have to do. I’m not sure I could fit at HOB with where the tank is at.

It is important to remember that water changes aren't just for nutrient export. We also do water changes to replenish elements consumed by the tank.

As an example, if you have coral frags in your tank, they require Calcium and Carbonate for skeletal growth. Water changes is how you replenish these elements. Fewer water changes will result in lower levels and a slowed rate of growth.

 

[New&no clue]

It is important to remember that water changes aren't just for nutrient export. We also do water changes to replenish elements consumed by the tank.

As an example, if you have coral frags in your tank, they require Calcium and Carbonate for skeletal growth. Water changes is how you replenish these elements. Few water changes will result in lower levels and a slowed rate of growth.

Yes, I agree. I think if you want to lower water changes you need to up the testing to make sure that everything is staying where it needs to be. My tank is primarily softies so I don't have a great deal of swing with Cal, Alk, or Mag. However, it is still important to test and when levels are dropping to either dose, or do a water change. My goal would never be to eliminate water changes, just to reduce them. This will be depended upon what elements are being used up by the corals I have.

 

[Dom]

Yes, I agree. I think if you want to lower water changes you need to up the testing to make sure that everything is staying where it needs to be. My tank is primarily softies so I don't have a great deal of swing with Cal, Alk, or Mag. However, it is still important to test and when levels are dropping to either dose, or do a water change. My goal would never be to eliminate water changes, just to reduce them. This will be depended upon what elements are being used up by the corals I have.

As long as you remain faithful in testing. If eliminating water changes completely appeals to you, then you may want to consider the Dutch Synthetic Reefing method.

The DSR Method (Dutch Synthetic Reefing)

Explanation appreciated or not ? it is a way to work without water changed and composing your own salt (as a base). if appreciated i will go ahead and explain how it work for me and the dutch reefing community this is a screenprint of the excel sheet i use for water correction...

www.reef2reef.com

 

[New&no clue]

As long as you remain faithful in testing. If eliminating water changes completely appeals to you, then you may want to consider the Dutch Synthetic Reefing method.

Thanks for the information. I don't think I would ever feel comfortable eliminating water changes completely. It's hard wired in my brain from growing up with gold fish in a tiny little bowl that you need to do a water change every week. If I could stretch that out to a couple of weeks, I'd be happy.

 

[Broutilde]

Hi All, thanks for the responses. I didn't mean to drop the thread but we had a power outage for about 36 hours over the weekend, about a foot of heavy wet snow, and down trees and power lines everywhere... add that on the mandatory quarantine... it was not a great weekend .

Anyway, back to the refugium I decided to go for it. I'm going to use my 2nd chamber and see how it goes. I didn't go too crazy with a light to start. I did see the IM makes a fuge light that looked good, but was expense. I looked up some other Nuvo 30 to see what people were using and I found 1 light that several people had used with good results. I decided to go with two of them instead of one, as they were cheaper. I also bought in Fuge Basket. I think I will do Chaeto as it is easy to get, but I might turn my first chamber into a refugium as well depending on how this goes, and then I will pick something else in there.

May I ask what light you chose?

 

[New&no clue]

I went with two of these

 

[NS Mike D]

Don't underestimate the clean up work that the pods that don't get eaten will do. I have a 29 gal and have run cheato in a sump for several years. Is it necessary? No. What I do like about cheato/macro algae is that it's self regulating as far as nutrient export/uptake. NO3/PO4 high, stuff grows like crazy. Nutrients drop, growth slows. Too low, cut back the light schedule


I also run the lights on the reverse of the DT which helps keep pH and O2 stable.

and it's not like if you don't harvest today, or tomorrow or next week, something bad will happen like some other maintenance task. It locks up and holds that N03 and PO4 until you are ready to trim it back.

 

[New&no clue]

Don't underestimate the clean up work that the pods that don't get eaten will do. I have a 29 gal and have run cheato in a sump for several years. Is it necessary? No. What I do like about cheato/macro algae is that it's self regulating as far as nutrient export/uptake. NO3/PO4 high, stuff grows like crazy. Nutrients drop, growth slows. Too low, cut back the light schedule


I also run the lights on the reverse of the DT which helps keep pH and O2 stable.

and it's not like if you don't harvest today, or tomorrow or next week, something bad will happen like some other maintenance task. It locks up and holds that N03 and PO4 until you are ready to trim it back.

It's funny, I never knew pods were anything but food. Just a couple days ago I happened to be reading about different CUC members and pods were listed. I was shocked. Needless to say, now I'm looking into the different kinds and possibly adding some into the tank.

 

[NS Mike D]

It's funny, I never knew pods were anything but food. Just a couple days ago I happened to be reading about different CUC members and pods were listed. I was shocked. Needless to say, now I'm looking into the different kinds and possibly adding some into the tank.

tigger and tisbe are probably the most common and should do well in a reef tank. Careful about other types as some of the bigger pods can eat the little ones. Did I mention that pods also eat algae in addition to detritus. Not that I think you will see them keep your glass sparkling clean, but I do think a healthy micro-fauna as part of my clean up crew.

I've been happy with Reef Nutrition Tiggers, their bottles are well stocked and I can get them locally and save on shipping,.

Algae Barn is another seller I have used, no complaints.

 

[Broutilde]

tigger and tisbe are probably the most common and should do well in a reef tank. Careful about other types as some of the bigger pods can eat the little ones. Did I mention that pods also eat algae in addition to detritus. Not that I think you will see them keep your glass sparkling clean, but I do think a healthy micro-fauna as part of my clean up crew.

I've been happy with Reef Nutrition Tiggers, their bottles are well stocked and I can get them locally and save on shipping,.

Algae Barn is another seller I have used, no complaints.

Not to high jack the thread but I've been looking at adding pods in my refugium at some point, as I would like to adopt a mandarin. I have a Nuvo 25 and an Intank fuge basket (just one chamber) and was wondering if the pods population would be enough for the little guy...

 

[muzikalmatt]

Not to high jack the thread but I've been looking at adding pods in my refugium at some point, as I would like to adopt a mandarin. I have a Nuvo 25 and an Intank fuge basket (just one chamber) and was wondering if the pods population would be enough for the little guy...

I think that depends on a lot of different things. How long has the tank been running and how long after adding/seeding pods do you intend to add the mandarin?

I tried this very same thing in my Nuvo 40 and unfortunately the mandarin didn't make it. The tank was ~8 months old when I added him and I had a healthy refugium and pod population (could seem them on the glass during the day and on the rocks/sand at night). I even seeded the tank with more pods a few months ahead of time. I watched the mandarin eat pods at my LFS before purchasing him, but once I added him to my tank he just wouldn't eat. I tried adding more pods, spot feeding him everything under the sun (pods, mysis, LRS Reef Frenzy, flakes, pellets, live brine) but he eventually starved to death. I'm not sure if it was this particular mandarin, the species of pods I had in my tank, or some combination of both, but it is something I highly regret doing. Watching a fish starve, even if you feel it's because they're being stubborn and won't eat, is not fun. As much as I love these fish and want to try again, I just can't bring myself to do that again.

If you're going to try, I would highly suggest several things:

• Wait until your tank is at least 6-8 months old.
• Seed the tank and refugium with a wide variety of pod species well ahead of getting the mandarin to ensure you have a high pod population.
• Try to source a mandarin that is already accepting a wide variety of foods, not just pods.
• Look into PaulB's mandarin feeder and set one up ahead of time.

I definitely don't mean to be a debbie downer, and I know it's possible to have a mandarin thrive even in a small tank. I just wanted to caution you given my experience. Best of luck to you!

 

[Broutilde]

I think that depends on a lot of different things. How long has the tank been running and how long after adding/seeding pods do you intend to add the mandarin?

I tried this very same thing in my Nuvo 40 and unfortunately the mandarin didn't make it. The tank was ~8 months old when I added him and I had a healthy refugium and pod population (could seem them on the glass during the day and on the rocks/sand at night). I even seeded the tank with more pods a few months ahead of time. I watched the mandarin eat pods at my LFS before purchasing him, but once I added him to my tank he just wouldn't eat. I tried adding more pods, spot feeding him everything under the sun (pods, mysis, LRS Reef Frenzy, flakes, pellets, live brine) but he eventually starved to death. I'm not sure if it was this particular mandarin, the species of pods I had in my tank, or some combination of both, but it is something I highly regret doing. Watching a fish starve, even if you feel it's because they're being stubborn and won't eat, is not fun. As much as I love these fish and want to try again, I just can't bring myself to do that again.

If you're going to try, I would highly suggest several things:

• Wait until your tank is at least 6-8 months old.
• Seed the tank and refugium with a wide variety of pod species well ahead of getting the mandarin to ensure you have a high pod population.
• Try to source a mandarin that is already accepting a wide variety of foods, not just pods.
• Look into PaulB's mandarin feeder and set one up ahead of time.

I definitely don't mean to be a debbie downer, and I know it's possible to have a mandarin thrive even in a small tank. I just wanted to caution you given my experience. Best of luck to you!

Oh don't worry you're not crushing my dreams! I had a mandarin in my 400 at work before, and even though he ate mysis shrimps he ended up dying of starvation because when the office was closed it was just pellet food. At the time I knew nothing of reef tanks and couldn't know that we didn't have enough pods (or none at all) for him in the tank.
I'm willing to try again this time in my own tank as I researched a lot on mandarin fish, but I was just wondering if a small fuge can sustain a heavy enough population of pods for the mandarin to eat. I will definitely look into the feeder you recommended, as I haven't heard of it before. My 25 gallons tank is just cycled and going through the ugly stages right now, so it's far from being mature and ready for a mandarin anyways. Thanks for your input!

 

[muzikalmatt]

Glad to hear it! Check out this thread for more info and some videos on PaulB's DIY mandarin feeder. It seems like the most surefire way to feed them, especially in a smaller tank where pod population might be an issue. You pretty much pour the pods down the tube where they remain in the feeder container for easy access by the mandarins. Wish I had known about this thing sooner!