Is it more difficult now?
- Thread starter Sump Crab
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OP
OP
Sump Crab
Valuable Member
I think in some ways reefing is much harder now than when I started in the 70s. Not in all ways because now there is information and then there was none. But I believe that no information is better than wrong or even damaging information and today we have IMO a lot more wrong information than correct information.
That is not anyone's fault but much of this hobby is done by people with very little experience of a couple of years and may have only had a problem once with a particular fish, disease, pest etc. and give their advice which may have worked once or may have not worked at all but the problem went away on it's own as most of these "problems" do and that information is passed around as fact.
Five years is not even half the lifespan of a hermit crab.
We still have people advising to use cleaner shrimp to control ich. Thats great if you believe that, but you are wrong, sorry it is bad advice and I would rather not argue about it. People have been doing that for 45 years. Including in the beginning, myself.
Yes I know, many people put in a shrimp, the ich went away so the shrimp cured the fish.
Thats like saying you washed your car and the ich went away so car washing is the secret. It is not.
Other people squirt hydrogen peroxide on hair algae, or throw in a sea hair and the algae went away.
(Algae goes away on it's own most of the time no matter what you do. ) Shoot me.
Anyway, if you can find a cure or remedy and it works "most" of the time for 15 or 20 years, then maybe you have something. The Vast majority of these "cures and remedies" that some people come up with have been used many many times since the hobby started in 1971. I think it was on a Tuesday about 2:00 or 2:15 in the afternoon on a cold, windy day in March.
If they worked, thats what everyone would do.
If you have a problem or question about something, I think the best advice would be to find someone with an old tank (old is not 5 years) and ask them questions as to what they would do.
PM them or read their threads as there are many old, healthy tanks especially on this forum.
I would not take advice from someone who posts that they have been having "Great Success" doing something and you find out they started in the hobby last Tuesday.
Remember most fish can go for months without even eating so it is hard to tell the health or needs of some creatures unless you have been caring for them for a few years.
The anecdotal info given by relative new comers that is spout off as scripture in this hobby is crazy.
dbowman5
Valuable Member
i am a tweener. i have manufactured dry rock that has never seen water, i have life rock that was painted to look like coralline algae, i have cured recycled rock that was turned in to my LFS by reefers that had beneficial hitchhikers in it. so my experience is all over the board. so far i have nor seen anything beyond vermetid snails that i would consider pests. My back yard is not manicured there are lots of lifeforms that have found their way to it. i watch and enjoy. i look at my aquaria in the same way. i do remove specimens that are eating corals because the corals are too few to spare but other than that i let it roll. welcome to R2R
NS Mike D
In the arena.
I nearly every algae thread you will see a number of posts stating with authority that the OP needs to lower nutrients and start dosing xyz, even though the OP has not posted what their NO3 and PO4 are, or even worse, that they have 0 NO3 and 0 PO4.
AndyinAtlanta
Community Member
The poster you quoted is what frustrates me with this hobby. Long mature times and ugly "white" tanks isn't what scares away most new hobbyists in my opinion. The intimidation of huge upfront costs scares away most people. Heck, one of the popular Youtubers I follow made a video saying the minimum tank size is 150 gallons. Bull.
The challenge is expectations and setting them correctly. Understand what you're getting with a 20 gallon nano tank verses a 200 gallon tank with a sump. The white rocks and slow growing frags, that's part of the process that makes this hobby fun in my book. Enjoy the journey.
I once overhead someone giving advise to a newcomer at my LFS (not an employee just someone the individual was with). He was talking hundred dollars this, hundred dollars that, RODI units this, expensive skimmers that. Total dear in headlights moment. The biggest change in the last thirty years is you can buy an AIO and be good to go. Worry about upgrading to a larger tank another day. You don't need thousands to get into this hobby, and you don't need thousands to survive in it either.
dbowman5
Valuable Member
the reason the same hair brush for people is $1.99 and for dogs is $4.99 is that what we love we spend on. i believe i could probably have comparable results by patiently waiting for used equipment to become available, manually doing every possible task, staying small and adding slowly. but i enjoy filling in the pieces quickly, have new paint disease, and have the means. the results i am seeking are enjoyment of the hobby and satisfaction with my efforts in creation. ok not god, my efforts at assembly and modification. stay engaged and reef on.
Copingwithpods
Valuable Member
I've been a newbie twice, more than a decade ago and just under a year ago. My first time I started with Ocean live rock. I loved the instant cycle and all the little critters. I soon found out not all of them were good. I struggled very early on with these and as a newbie to the hobby it felt as though I had doomed myself from the start by introducing these pests that were eating my corals. For me it went from "ohhh look at all this life!" to "ohhh no what's that eating my corals and fish" very fast.
The second time around I couldn't even find live rock and even if I did the cost of it would have not made it an option anyway. So I used dry sterile rock. I'm almost a year in and yes my rocks are Colgate white and yes the maturing process is painfully slow but I feel this time around it was easier (not faster by any means) as I don't have to actively pull mantis shrimp and zoa eating spiders out of my tank. It comes with a whole new set of challenges but none that are too difficult to overcome.
All in all I think it was easier short term back then, it's easier long term now. Newbies can be set up for long term success by just starting with dry rock and dipping everything that goes in.
The second time around I couldn't even find live rock and even if I did the cost of it would have not made it an option anyway. So I used dry sterile rock. I'm almost a year in and yes my rocks are Colgate white and yes the maturing process is painfully slow but I feel this time around it was easier (not faster by any means) as I don't have to actively pull mantis shrimp and zoa eating spiders out of my tank. It comes with a whole new set of challenges but none that are too difficult to overcome.
All in all I think it was easier short term back then, it's easier long term now. Newbies can be set up for long term success by just starting with dry rock and dipping everything that goes in.
I came back to the hobby after a hiatus. I think it is much more difficult now. I have more money and opportunities to take better care of my tanks now than I did in my twenties -- but I'm finding it more difficult. I still love it, but there is more worry. But that is just my opinion.
Copingwithpods
Valuable Member
Youre right theres alot more worrying now than there was years ago. I remember asking why a certain coral wasn't looking too great and 9 out 10 times the answer from an old reefer was "ehh they do that now and then don't worry about it" ask the same question now and you're grilled for every minute detail about the tank and coral. I think with more info come more fears and more stuff to worry about.
Nanorock1970
Well-Known Member
Good info on the LR from the pacific vs Fla . I got mine from the LFS and did not have too much issues with the hitchhikers. IDK where it came from but it could have been local since I live in FLA...new to the LR thing/ well new to rock in general as when I tried 35 years ago, you didn't go to the LFS and pick up rock...year and a half back into the hobby.
Nanorock1970
Well-Known Member
Oh yeah...I feel the hobby is lots easier..The internet, plus all the gear we didn't have then that makes things more closer to reef life now, and better life support equipment.
I don’t think it is any harder now days. I still see live rock similar to what I used to get 14 years ago. I suspect my LFS gets it from Tampa Bay Saltwater. But yeah, a majority of rock I see for sale is dry rock, with nothing on it, stuck in a bin of saltwater that they call “live rock”.
Businesses only offer to sell what most customers want. If you’re new to the hobby, why pay $7-9 a pound for the good rock when you can get the other stuff for $2-3. This is especially true when you start buying 75-100 pounds to fill a moderately sized tank.
I think people are too concerned about the possibility of having hair algae and aptasia. I’ve set up three systems, dealt with both pests, and never really had much of a problem with it. Most of the time, these issues are simple to solve and require a little patience.
True. You can do this hobby cheap if you get used equipment. But ongoing costs add up. And a lot of reefers at some point get the itch to upgrade or get a bigger tank when space becomes a problem. I just think some people should be aware of how much they're really going to spend over the long haul
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