Is the recommended water change percentage outdated now that we have better filtration?

[A_Blind_Reefer]

Another question that has been beat to death over the years, I know….but I haven’t really heard of it keeping up with the times. In previous tanks (pre Rollermat) I was religious about my water change percentages (I started with 10% weekly manually and graduated to 1% a day when I setup my first auto water change system). Now that I’m a few years into my newest tank, I’m contemplating the whole 1% per day auto water change. It’s a high flow, bare bottom, with a Rollermat, skimmer and uv. I never before ran a Rollermat or uv. I’m having to dose nitrate and phosphate daily to keep them in check. I’ve never had to dose those in previous tanks. I know there’s methods of not changing water and adding elements as needed, but that’s not really what I’m getting at. Although, I am having to add in potassium, iodine, and strontium every few months or so. Ruling out element replenishment as a basis for water changes, which at 1% daily/10% weekly/20% bi-weekly really wouldn’t keep up anyway. Is that old tried and true standard outdated with the newer types of filtration available? Is it time to start thinking about cutting that number in half (full well knowing that some additives will be needed to be dosed)? Are we realistically headed towards zero water changes across the board, and not just on the fringe with triton or moonshiners? Anyway, I’m just thinking (a first for me) that I’m just wasting a lot of water for no reason other than it was once written in stone.

 

[Chrisv.]

Probably not. My tanks look noticeably better for the week or two after a wc. Do yours?

 

[Reefer_punk]

If your tank is doing fine, or even better, great and your parameters are in check, why do a WC? Just dose the major 3, a bottle of trace and check other minors every once in awhile through icp. Only thing you want to have stabilized before is your nutrients export. Make sure your Skimmer and/or (roller( filter is doing it's job. Review your fishstock and feeding routine. Then you should be totally fine.

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

Probably not. My tanks look noticeably better for the week or two after a wc. Do yours?

Mines been automatic at 1% a day since I started this tank a few years ago. My previous tank was the same for about seven years, so I never get that large water change difference.

 

[Chrisv.]

If your tank is doing fine, or even better, great and your parameters are in check, why do a WC? Just dose the major 3, a bottle of trace and check other minors every once in awhile through icp. Only thing you want to have stabilized before is your nutrients export. Make sure your Skimmer and/or (roller( filter is doing it's job. Review your fishstock and feeding routine. Then you should be totally fine.

Because there are things we don’t test for, even with icp. Those things either get depleted or accumulate, which is why a wc makes most tanks look much better…for a while.

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

If your tank is doing fine, or even better, great and your parameters are in check, why do a WC? Just dose the major 3, a bottle of trace and check other minors every once in awhile through icp. Only thing you want to have stabilized before is your nutrients export. Make sure your Skimmer and/or (roller( filter is doing it's job. Review your fishstock and feeding routine. Then you should be totally fine.

That’s where I think I’m heading. Im just curious to see if this will be where the hobby goes as a whole. Especially with the water restrictions coming down the pipeline from the drought. I just keep seeing the water change questions on the forum and the answers have been the same from the beginning of time.

 

[Reefer_punk]

Because there are things we don’t test for, even with icp. Those things either get depleted or accumulate, which is why a wc makes most tanks look much better…for a while.

It is a quick fix and sometimes needed in case of an emergency but I've been running without any waterchanges for years now, not even while starting the tank up. Tank is still doing great.

 

[Reefer_punk]

That’s where I think I’m heading. Im just curious to see if this will be where the hobby goes as a whole. Especially with the water restrictions coming down the pipeline from the drought. I just keep seeing the water change questions on the forum and the answers have been the same from the beginning of time.

People are often affraid to try a 'new' way. But there are so much examples of great looking tanks which run without wc. It can be done. The knowledge is there. The technique has improved so much. If you know the basics, know how to read your corals, you'll be just fine.

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

It is a quick fix and sometimes needed in case of an emergency but I've been running without any waterchanges for years now, not even while starting the tank up. Tank is still doing great.

Another aspect of my question as there have not been a lot (proportionately) of long term anti-establishment no water change stories out there. They are trickling in. It’s just the whole it won’t work just because water changes have been the mainstay and people seem to get shot down if they stray from the path. I still think it’s kinda fringe, but I can totally see it being necessary in the future. Plus, if I’m already having to dose nitrate, phosphate, and trace elements to keep up and modern filtration and uv keep everything at bay, why continue with such large water changes?

 

[Reefer_punk]

You shouldn't. And being shot down? That is the ignorance speaking.... here in Holland it is much more common not to do waterchanges. And yes changing the game does take time. Just go with what you believe in, despite what others think.

4,5 years old. 0 waterchanges.

after yearly trim

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

Because there are things we don’t test for, even with icp. Those things either get depleted or accumulate, which is why a wc makes most tanks look much better…for a while.

That’s what gets me thinking….with all the technology out there shouldn’t it be more widely accepted that water is becoming a bit more scarce and keeping water changes to minimum, if it could be done with great success, become the norm?

 

[X-37B]

On my 3 systems I do 10% a month to remove what possibly cant be tested for. Tank looks no different after one.
I do dose trace elements to keep levels where I want them.

 

[Reefer_punk]

That’s what gets me thinking….with all the technology out there shouldn’t it be more widely accepted that water is becoming a bit more scarce and keeping water changes to minimum, if it could be done with great success, become the norm?

Humans are creatures of habit

 

[X-37B]

You shouldn't. And being shot down? That is the ignorance speaking.... here in Holland it is much more common not to do waterchanges. And yes changing the game does take time. Just go with what you believe in, despite what others think.

4,5 years old. 0 waterchanges.

after yearly trim

Nice DSR system!

 

[Reefer_punk]

Nice DSR system!

Thanks! It is working out great for us

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

You shouldn't. And being shot down? That is the ignorance speaking.... here in Holland it is much more common not to do waterchanges. And yes changing the game does take time. Just go with what you believe in, despite what others think.

4,5 years old. 0 waterchanges.

after yearly trim

It was once my dream to move to Utrecht! I visited once and fell in love. Across the pond in the us it hasn’t quite caught on, although it’s picking up steam. Not too long ago I lost most of my vision so testing is impossible. I can see blobs of color when I look at my tank, but I have zero detail vision at all and a lot of things blend together. I’m trying to stay in the hobby, but it is not easy. I’ve listened to a few YouTube’s of people success with sending in for an ICP test and dosing what’s recommended every so often and it sounds amazing to me. Currently I send in for an ICP once a year just to check on things. Although I don’t participate in the no water change method yet, I really do think it’s time for us to all start heading in that direction.

 

[Reefer_punk]

It was once my dream to move to Utrecht! I visited once and fell in love. Across the pond in the us it hasn’t quite caught on, although it’s picking up steam. Not too long ago I lost most of my vision so testing is impossible. I can see blobs of color when I look at my tank, but I have zero detail vision at all and a lot of things blend together. I’m trying to stay in the hobby, but it is not easy. I’ve listened to a few YouTube’s of people success with sending in for an ICP test and dosing what’s recommended every so often and it sounds amazing to me. Currently I send in for an ICP once a year just to check on things. Although I don’t participate in the no water change method yet, I really do think it’s time for us to all start heading in that direction.

Utrecht is a beautiful city! I studied there.

So sorry to hear that you lost most of your vision. I hope you can stay in the hobby and maybe having some locals to help you out when needed!

And hear hear to changing the game

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

On my 3 systems I do 10% a month to remove what possibly cant be tested for. Tank looks no different after one.
I do dose trace elements to keep levels where I want them.

Yeah, I might start with that. That would be cutting my water change schedule by 2/3rds. See where I’m at after a while and maybe think about going without routine water changes at all. I just can’t believe that my first tank, back in 1995 10% weekly water changes were the norm. That was with using swamp cooler filter floss, a protein skimmer made from pvc pipe a funnel and a maxi jet, power compact lights, and topping off with TAP water! Granted it was live rock and huge colonies with no dipping or quarantine, and I had great success for ten years. Fast forward to 2019 with my mr fancy pants rodi, Rollermat, uv, ginormous skimmer on a high flow bare bottom and we’re still told to do 10% weekly water changes. I just think it’s kinds crazy that hasn’t changed.

 

[A_Blind_Reefer]

Utrecht is a beautiful city! I studied there.

So sorry to hear that you lost most of your vision. I hope you can stay in the hobby and maybe having some locals to help you out when needed!

And hear hear to changing the game

Were you the one that almost ran me over on a bicycle? Ha. Those cobblestone streets, canal, hardly any cars, beautiful lush landscaping, even the prison on the other side of the canal looked like a place I’d want to be! One night there they were playing classic movies on a screen in the park all night. It was pretty chill to just hang out, have a beer with fries and mayo and socialize.

I wish I could find some local reefers. Where I live a lot of people come and go. The vast majority don’t stay more than a couple years so no one seems to be into this hobby as it requires a bit more time. I’ve tried having neighbors and such help with testing but a non-reefer performing titration tests is not accurate whatsoever. Pretty useless actually, but they get an A for effort and willingness.
Cheers to change

 

[Anemone_Fanatic]

Water changes aren't strictly necessary, but they are a good idea for most people. Some systems with reactors and large refugiums can keep nutrients low and avoid water changes. Look up the "Walsted Method". Freshwater planted tanks with many plants and few fish can go without filtration or water changes, and they do just fine. I'd imagine that a similar result could be achieved by using a large refugium with several species of macroalgae.