It Has Begun...

ElussssvReefSD

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Hey all,

Welcome to my journey down the deep, dark blue-hole that is reefing. Be forewarned, this is a loooong post. So please take a moment at this time to pray for me and my relationship with my S/O before continuing with this post. Thank you in advance for your thoughts and prayers.

Currently in talks with 2 different manufacturers to spec out my dream system:

Tank: 108x36x30, ~500 Gallons serving as a room-divider.

It will be placed in the living room, parallel to the sectional couch as shown in the absolute perfectionist masterpiece below (the red velvet chair and ottoman on the left will be for sale btw if anyone is interested ;)):

upload_2019-6-2_18-40-22.jpeg


I have many ideas and sooooooooo many questions ;Happy. I am not *brand-brand* new to saltwater aquariums. My prev tank was a 90G FOWLR that morphed that into a Kenya Tree-Dominant tank in a span of 4 years haha. Managed to keep most of my fish alive, fat and happy and was pretty much engaged to the Kenya before having to sell everything to make the move out West. That was approx 5 years ago, and have decided to throw caution to the wind and just go for it by jumping right into the deep end with a dream-size, SPS-dominant showpiece.

That being said, I have absolutely no delusions about my own skill-set, and fully expect to needs lots (and lots and LOTS) of help and advice from fellow junkies.

First, let's talk about the basics:

  • Tank Type: SPS-Dominant. However, I have some concerns about the amount of SPS I will actually be able to grow and keep healthy. More explanation about that below under "Lighting".

  • Water Quality Mgmt: After reading everything I could get my eyeballs on on YouTube, this forum, and other online sources, I have decided on using the Triton Method with (GASP) NSW. Now, before the haters burn me at the stake, hear me out. I live in a SoCal bungalow where making space for a dedicated fish room is just not realistic and wasting water through using RO/DI would be severely frowned upon. Also, Scripps NSW is still freely available last time I checked a couple months ago (someone please let me know if this changes because that would throw a serious kink in my plans haha). This would necessitate A Triton-style sump (duh) of at least 72 inches in length with overflow dropping directly into Refugium, flowing to skimmer chamber, then reactor/dosing chamber and back up to the DT.
  • Water Circulation: I am currently trying to decide between 2 closed loops with EcoTech DC Pumps w/ a couple MP60W Powerheads and a Gyre or two, or All powerheads/Gyres. This will be a 9ft long tank with a goal max turnover of 80x. If I went all powerheads, I feel like I'd have to plaster every glass surface with powerheads and cords and won't be able to see inside! ;Wideyed I would appreciate any in-sight or experience I can get on this point.

  • Lighting: Whatever lighting option I choose, it would hang from the ceiling. So, this is where I'm really struggling. On one hand, I would LOVE to go with LEDs for the power- and heat-saving benefits alone. However, to grow SPS, I feel that the amount of LEDs I would need to purchase would be excessive. Also, my favorite LEDs are the Kessil A360X. That being said, if what I've read is true, I would need at least 10-12+ of these puppies ($$$$$$) to light my tank adequately for SPS and even with that amount, would prolly only be able to place SPS/Clams at the very top of the tank without any additional T5 fixtures to boost the PAR and combat shadowing. Before anyone brings it up as an alternative, I absolutely despise the disco-effect of EcoTech Radions, despite their higher PAR output and light penetration. Also, in order to get rid of the disco effect, it's my understanding you'd have to add T5 (which negates some of the power savings) or purchase a diffuser (which then negates the PAR and light penetration benefit that Radions seem to have over the Kessil A360X). All in all, for the price they charge, no thanks. The alternative that I'm seriously considering, is two old-school 48" Hamilton Cebu Sun T5/400W MH fixtures at half the initial cost. The obv trade-offs are increased power consumption (almost DOUBLE) and would need to mount them high off the water and putting fans in to minimize heating the water too much (the idea of having to install a chiller makes me nauseous ;Yuck). Luckily I live near the coast and on a hill so it remains cool and breezy, only turn the AC on 2-3 weeks/year, and the vent is conveniently located directly across from where the tank will be. T5 only looks a little flat to me, and really like the shimmer with MH and Kessil pendants. Bottom line: I see that corals and clams are grown fine under both, but I feel like tried-and-true, old school might win the day on this one for me. Talk me out of it ;Playful

Okay, I think that's a good starting point. What do y'all think? Am I absolutely bonkers-insane? Does wanting MH in 2019 make me an old out-of-touch fuddy-duddy neanderthal (I'm 37 for the record)? Will the up-front price savings on an MH/T5 combo fixture be completely negated by having to install more solar panels on the roof to compensate for the extra power (the answer at $1,000 per panel, is yes) and on-going bulb replacements? Is it dumb to talk about saving money when it comes to a project of this scope?

~J

PS- Anyone know of an architect/engineer that can brace and reinforce floor beams in the San Diego area please let me know... this beast will be HEAVY and if it falls through the floor in 5 years I will be single and homeless on the street. Or perhaps murdered and buried in cement in the backyard, the likely outcome of that scenario is not clear...





 

Sailingeric

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Jealous of such a big tank. As for your floor, if you can get under the house some jack stands should work. Should not need to hire an engineer.

And why MH lights? The heat from them alone would be a turn off for me.
 
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ElussssvReefSD

ElussssvReefSD

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You don't need 10 or 12 kessils a360 they have about a 24" coverage, you could get away with 4 of them assuming your tank is less then about 20" deep. Might need 5.
It's 30" deep, and would they give enough PAR spread throughout the tank for SPS corals at all mid and upper levels of the tank in your opinion?
 
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ElussssvReefSD

ElussssvReefSD

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Jealous of such a big tank. As for your floor, if you can get under the house some jack stands should work. Should not need to hire an engineer.

And why MH lights? The heat from them alone would be a turn off for me.

I like the fact that they are plug-n-play and a proven (old-school) tech. Corals look spectacular underneath them and they are proven to provide all the light that corals need straight out of the box.
 

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If you are worried about the effects on water usage by having your own RO/DI system then you should be concerned about the electrical usage this tank will cause. According to Southern Cal Edison my little 55 gallon makes me a 50% higher consumer of electricity than my typical neighbor. These extra electricity costs easily add up to REAL money given California electricity rates. Your tank will be an even bigger electricity hog. So, my suggestion is do the math on the cost of LEDs vs MH over a typical year and see what you breakeven point would be. As others have suggested, you won't need 10 or 12 Kessils. I would also suggest making the tank more shallow. 30" deep is very hard to keep clean. Make it only 24" deep. Its easier on maintenance. Also, make it narrower and you could get by with fewer lights too. y hog than my average neigh

Edit 6/3/2019: Just got my So Cal Edison Energy report today. I exaggerated a bit. I am only 44% more of an energy hog than my average neighbor and it cost me $312 extra over the last 6 months. Yikes! Maybe I should get out of reefing ;Nailbiting
 
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Phil D.

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On the light front, you may want to consider AI Hydra 52s as they are very controllable as compared to Kessil. Then you wouldn't have to get many of them.
 
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ElussssvReefSD

ElussssvReefSD

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If you are worried about the effects on water usage by having your own RO/DI system then you should be concerned about the electrical usage this tank will cause. According to Southern Cal Edison my little 55 gallon makes me a 50% higher consumer of electricity than my typical neighbor. These extra electricity costs easily add up to REAL money given California electricity rates. Your tank will be an even bigger electricity hog. So, my suggestion is do the math on the cost of LEDs vs MH over a typical year and see what you breakeven point would be. As others have suggested, you won't need 10 or 12 Kessils. I would also suggest making the tank more shallow. 30" deep is very hard to keep clean. Make it only 24" deep. Its easier on maintenance. Also, make it narrower and you could get by with fewer lights too.

To answer the response regarding "10-12 Kessils is too many", I used the BRS videos and articles below as some of my references. In the videos specifically, they use up to 8 pucks for a 40"x20" tank to get optimum PAR levels and distribution for wall-to-wall SPS (my goal). My build will be 108" long and 36" wide, so that is where I got those numbers from. I would love nothing better than to get by with only 4-6 LED lights but it doesn't seem plausible based on the information I've read/watched and still get the light coverage and coral placement freedom that I want unless I'm missing something.

RE: Kessil LEDs


RE: AI LEDs


https://reefhacks.com/the-ultimate-guide-how-to-successfully-grow-beautiful-sps-corals/

You are def right about the power consumption! However as I stated above, the extra solar panels that will be required to mitigate the increased power consumption of this beast have already been budgeted in. To answer your question about the breakeven point, we have solar installed so use an annual net metering plan vs. monthly. Factoring in our wacky tiered metering system here in CA, for the MH/T5 fixture (400W MH bulbs x4 run for 6 hours + 54 Watt T5 bulbs x8 run for 12 hours), it would cost about $1,439 for the year vs. $839 for the year for 1000 Watts worth of LEDs before solar credits. Not an insignificant difference, but not enough to surpass the break-even point even factoring in at least 1 annual round of bulb replacements.

As far as the dimensions, I would like to keep them as is. I actually originally wanted a 36" height but got talked down from that ledge already haha. Luckily I have long-arms and don't back down from a challenge :).

Thanks for the input!
 
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ElussssvReefSD

ElussssvReefSD

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Alright... how's about the ATI Powermodules? Anyone have any pictures or testimonials on how they've worked on their own tanks?
 
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ElussssvReefSD

ElussssvReefSD

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I hope you are tall. My tank is 30" high and can be a pain to clean and place corals. (I'm only 5'5") It looks great, however.

6'3" with a wingspan. Looked like a disgruntled albatross growing up until the rest of my body caught up to my arms and legs after puberty haha.
 

sfin52

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Solid advice so far.
IMG_20190105_202102_01.gif

Edit 6/3/2019: Just got my So Cal Edison Energy report today. I exaggerated a bit. I am only 44% more of an energy hog than my average neighbor and it cost me $312 extra over the last 6 months. Yikes! Maybe I should get out of reefing ;Nailbiting
you sir need to be taken out back and lectured about energy consumption. Beaten behind a woodshed is frowned upon in Cali.
Thats a crazy report.
IMG_20190603_125148_01.gif

IMG_20190603_125150_01.gif
 

Fusion in reefing: How do you feel about grafted corals?

  • I strongly prefer grafted corals and I seek them out to put in my tank.

    Votes: 2 3.5%
  • I find grafted corals appealing and would be open to having them in my tank.

    Votes: 35 61.4%
  • I am indifferent about grafted corals and am not enthusiastic about having them in my tank.

    Votes: 14 24.6%
  • I have reservations about grafted corals and would generally avoid having them in my tank.

    Votes: 5 8.8%
  • I have a negative perception and would avoid having grafted corals in my tank.

    Votes: 1 1.8%
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