"Kessil Logic"

[Dana Riddle]

@Dana Riddle
Did you quote the "cut sheet" or have you taken the time to watch and disgest the above BRS video?

If you watched the video. What is your overall take on the Kessil a360's par / uv and kessil logic?

Thanks, Freddie

I watched the full video, and am impressed with the amount of effort BRS put into testing. That was a lot of work, and the Li-Cor meter and 3 underwater sensors don't come cheap! Good job BRS! My comments: The PAR measurements are probably a tad low due to the UV LEDs (which *most* quantum meters/sensors can't 'see' but are still PAR.) The spectrum adjustment is more of a marketing tool, I think (it keeps the significant other happy when the light is adjusted to what is considered the 'perfect spectral output' but it make the carpet look purple, so negotiation is necessary.) But the only way to know for sure is looking at the electron transport rate. Anything else is just speculation. It is certain that this Kessil is capable of producing enough light to satisfy just about any photosynthetic invertebrate if due diligence is given to lamp positioning and consideration of tank size. I was told by a owner of a large commercial coral farm that they ran Kessils on their tanks and the corals received PAR of 25. Yup, I said 25. Just a couple of pet peeves - I don't like fan-cooled luminaires. Fans fail, and when working they draw salt spray across the electronics. And please - Saying that SPS corals (Acroporas) require more light than soft corals just isn't true. 'Myth-information' is what Ron Shimek called it. And speaking of Rons - was that Ronny Schopke doing the spectral analysis?

 

[Nano sapiens]

It is certain that this Kessil is capable of producing enough light to satisfy just about any photosynthetic invertebrate if due diligence is given to lamp positioning and consideration of tank size. I was told by a owner of a large commercial coral farm that they ran Kessils on their tanks and the corals received PAR of 25. Yup, I said 25.

To maintain photosynthetic corals at 25 PAR, I'd imagine that they ran their Kessels with just the UV to blue spectra (enhanced photosynthesis spectra) and dispensed with the rest of the warmer hues. In such a case, PUR should be relatively high with a LED luminaire like this that produces some true UV and other near UV spectra in addition to the blues.

 

[GoVols]

I watched the full video, and am impressed with the amount of effort BRS put into testing. That was a lot of work, and the Li-Cor meter and 3 underwater sensors don't come cheap! Good job BRS! My comments: The PAR measurements are probably a tad low due to the UV LEDs (which *most* quantum meters/sensors can't 'see' but are still PAR.) The spectrum adjustment is more of a marketing tool, I think (it keeps the significant other happy when the light is adjusted to what is considered the 'perfect spectral output' but it make the carpet look purple, so negotiation is necessary.) But the only way to know for sure is looking at the electron transport rate. Anything else is just speculation. It is certain that this Kessil is capable of producing enough light to satisfy just about any photosynthetic invertebrate if due diligence is given to lamp positioning and consideration of tank size. I was told by a owner of a large commercial coral farm that they ran Kessils on their tanks and the corals received PAR of 25. Yup, I said 25. Just a couple of pet peeves - I don't like fan-cooled luminaires. Fans fail, and when working they draw salt spray across the electronics. And please - Saying that SPS corals (Acroporas) require more light than soft corals just isn't true. 'Myth-information' is what Ron Shimek called it. And speaking of Rons - was that Ronny Schopke doing the spectral analysis?

Dana,
Thanks for taking the time and providing your incite. It truly means a lot.
I personally am not a par monster freak but (lol) I am a light spread junkie.

I still feel like MH/T5 is the gold standard in reef lighting but my wife would ;Dead me if I hung the ole cannons back up in our den.
The only MH canopy she'll go for is the giesemann spectra and they don't make it in a 36" model.

When I look at led's I'm not sold on one manufacture but what's a good light that gives my tank the right spread.

If I had to go full blown led today I'd have to go with the GHL 7's when all things are considered to my setup and they have wonderful customer service.

I love the giesemann futura s but it took Coralvue months to answer my questions and it just scares me from that kind of customer service.

I run a Kessil a80/T5 hybird and very happy. The a80's do not have fans and I would not be surprised if Kessil came out with newer a160's and maybe a360's with the fanless shell shaped heat sinks too.

Would love BRS to spec. out the AP700 and figure they'll do it.

Again: Thanks for your time and incite.

Freddie

 

[Donovan Joannes]

A little off topic...

Hopefully one day we can have a smart LED lighting that will ask several questions on first boot up. Fixture height from water surface, tank depth, highest point of rock below water surface, kind of coral at highest point, coral dominance and acclimation needed (Yes/No). Based on these input, the light will adjust all other parameters (intensity, spectrum, lighting scene etc) without user intervention. This is what LOGIC should be. A lot of LED failures happens because manufacturer gives a full control to end users.

My two cents on a super wet monday morning

 

[Dana Riddle]

A little off topic...

Hopefully one day we can have a smart LED lighting that will ask several questions on first boot up. Fixture height from water surface, tank depth, highest point of rock below water surface, kind of coral at highest point, coral dominance and acclimation needed (Yes/No). Based on these input, the light will adjust all other parameters (intensity, spectrum, lighting scene etc) without user intervention. This is what LOGIC should be. A lot of LED failures happens because manufacturer gives a full control to end users.

My two cents on a super wet monday morning

Tht's forward thinking! I'll send them my two-page list of questions every reef hobbyist should ask before making a decision on lighting!

 

[GoVols]

A little off topic...

Hopefully one day we can have a smart LED lighting that will ask several questions on first boot up. Fixture height from water surface, tank depth, highest point of rock below water surface, kind of coral at highest point, coral dominance and acclimation needed (Yes/No). Based on these input, the light will adjust all other parameters (intensity, spectrum, lighting scene etc) without user intervention. This is what LOGIC should be. A lot of LED failures happens because manufacturer gives a full control to end users.

My two cents on a super wet monday morning

Why does EcoTech and all other led manufactures "not" publish this now for the "Prefect" lighting spectrum?

To myself they all fudge on how many units you truly need once you get bigger than a smaller cube.

The "Kessil Logic" is a sales tool and it should be.

 

[Donovan Joannes]

Why does EcoTech and all other led manufactures "not" publish this now for the "Prefect" lighting spectrum?

To myself they all fudge on how many units you truly need once you get bigger than a smaller cube.

The "Kessil Logic" is a sales tool and it should be.

Yeah man. Can't imagine how easy life can be for a truly "plug & play" LED fixtures, almost fool proof and more importantly grows coral straight out of the box without cracking your head. The forum's light section must be very quiet .

 

[GoVols]

Yeah man. Can't imagine how easy life can be for a truly "plug & play" LED fixtures, almost fool proof and more importantly grows coral straight out of the box without cracking your head. The forum's light section must be very quiet .

To myself when led gets to MH/T5 (Proven - Plug and Play)... We'll be there.

Philips CoralCare keeps the lights tuned and I don't see people saying that Philips is a hoax and throwing stones at them.
It is a selling point.

 

[Robthorn]

Yes she did

 

[Donovan Joannes]

To myself when led gets to MH/T5 (Proven - Plug and Play)... We'll be there.

Philips CoralCare keeps the lights tuned and I don't see people saying that Philips is a hoax and throwing stones at them.
It is a selling point.

At 5 times higher than what you all are paying, my rusty old LED have to stay for a while I guess

 

[Dana Riddle]

There is no such thing as the perfect spectrum. Just look at the absorption spectrum for zooxanthellate and compare that to what green or red algae absorb.

 

[GoVols]

There is no such thing as the perfect spectrum. Just look at the absorption spectrum for zooxanthellate and compare that to what green or red algae absorb.

+1
And lighting is only one of many factors to a healthy reef.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

There is no such thing as the perfect spectrum. Just look at the absorption spectrum for zooxanthellate and compare that to what green or red algae absorb.

Lol. They don't belive me when I say that. And you'd need a lotta tools at home to even attempt it.

 

[GoVols]

Lol. They don't belive me when I say that. And you'd need a lotta tools at home to even attempt it.

I believe ya and it just makes sense.
I'd go ;Wacky ;Dead

 

[Nano sapiens]

There is no such thing as the perfect spectrum. Just look at the absorption spectrum for zooxanthellate and compare that to what green or red algae absorb.

Lol. They don't belive me when I say that. And you'd need a lotta tools at home to even attempt it.

So true. Even for individual coral species/morphs, there is no perfect 'one size fits all' as far as spectrum is concerned. Luckily for us, the corals themselves are highly adaptable.

 

[saltyfilmfolks]

So true. Even for individual coral species/morphs, there is no perfect 'one size fits all' as far as spectrum is concerned. Luckily for us, the corals themselves are highly adaptable.

Chasing ph chasing par chasing spectrum.
I'd rather just understand them.
Chasing makes me tired.

I believe ya and it just makes sense.
I'd go ;Wacky ;Dead

Lol. I'd go broke on too many toys, er, tools.

 

[GoVols]

Lol. I'd go broke on too many toys, er, tools.

...

Salty,
I've always got the "Tinker Bug" and I'd be stupid to change my lighting but (lol) the ole "Tinker Bug" still lives within.

 

[Nano sapiens]

...

Salty,
I've always got the "Tinker Bug" and I'd be stupid to change my lighting but (lol) the ole "Tinker Bug" still lives within.

+1 for all the 'Tinkerers' who like to fix things that ain't broke

 

[Dana Riddle]

No such thing as the perfect spectrum... but, let's see... I have two Ocean Optics spectrometers, two Walz PAM fluorometers, two chlorophyll meters... Geez, I could be driving a Mercedes sport coupe if I had just wised up years ago. LOL. Seriously, we have a lot to learn and the new lab aquaria should be up and cycling in about 6 weeks!

 

[Nano sapiens]

No such thing as the perfect spectrum... but, let's see... I have two Ocean Optics spectrometers, two Walz PAM fluorometers, two chlorophyll meters... Geez, I could be driving a Mercedes sport coupe if I had just wised up years ago. LOL. Seriously, we have a lot to learn and the new lab aquaria should be up and cycling in about 6 weeks!

Knowledge > Mercedes

Lab completion...will be awesome!