Looking for advice planning my first reef tank

[Sockcman]

Hello, I am currently planning my first saltwater tank (been doing freshwater for a while. I'm planning to do a 20 gallon long for as cheap as possible and looking for advice with the setup.

Stocking: I want to do mostly soft / easy corals with a pair of clownfish and some shrimp / crabs. Will also try to have macro algae to help with nutrients.

Lighting: I was planning on either a nicrew hyperreef, fluval reef 4.0, or micmol marine air pro 600 (all used). Leaning towards the micmol but will depend if I can talk then down on price.

Filtration: this is where I could use some advice. Trying to decide between building my own aio chamber out of acrylic or just using HOB equipment. Will probably rely on filter floss to remove waste. Which setup do you think will be easier to maintain?

Want to make sure I don't go down a path that will cause problems later on or suck to maintain so any advice is appreciated!

Thanks

 

[Science/G]

Something like this might work out well for you. You could fit a little protein skimmer in there, a bag of carbon, some filter floss, and your heater. It's designed as a refugium but sometimes those things are a pain in the butt to keep going.
Some good quality live rock, the lighting you mentioned, and a good gyre pump and you should be good to go. And of course sand if you want.

.

 

[Sockcman]

Something like this might work out well for you. You could fit a little protein skimmer in there, a bag of carbon, some filter floss, and your heater. It's designed as a refugium but sometimes those things are a pain in the butt to keep going.
Some good quality live rock, the lighting you mentioned, and a good gyre pump and you should be good to go. And of course sand if you want.

.

That thing looks awesome but that's more than I was hoping to spend on filtration. I'm in Canada so a lot of reef equipment is way more expensive.

One of my plans was to basically build something like that inside the tank using acrylic. Thanks for the advice, didn't know about gyre pumps!

 

[northernreefin]

my vote is for AIO. Extra space for filtration is always useful. Looks less cluttered. If you got time you can definitely fab it yourself. If you have time…

 

[Sockcman]

my vote is for AIO. Extra space for filtration is always useful. Looks less cluttered. If you got time you can definitely fab it yourself. If you have time…

Yeah that's what I'm going forward with for now. Just picked up a used micmol light and an ATO. Looking at stand options now.

Gonna be a long process... But I need something to keep myself busy with lol.

 

[fish_collector]

A tank, hang on back filter, pump for water movement, heater and a light is all you need to enjoy most marine life, anyone who wants to debate that let's have at it. I set up my QT tank for less than $150 and it will support everything but acropora indefinitely. The biggest expense is going to be LIVE ROCK, I can't recommend anyone using dry rock to start a brand new tank.

Tank $16
Seachem Tidal $40
Eheim-Jager 50w heater $35
Pulaco 100gph pump $9
Nicrew marine light $25

IMO the biggest hurdle one will have to overcome with a small tank is starting with dry rock, it's horrible for the first year or two at least. I'd recommend getting some real ocean live rock and skipping all of the drama associated with a new tank.

The OP said as cheap as possible, that means nothing fancy.

 

[northernreefin]

Yeah that's what I'm going forward with for now. Just picked up a used micmol light and an ATO. Looking at stand options now.

Gonna be a long process... But I need something to keep myself busy with lol.

If you really want to save money make your own stand. Easier than making the AIO. Doesn’t take much to make it more robust than prefab

 

[Sockcman]

If you really want to save money make your own stand. Easier than making the AIO. Doesn’t take much to make it more robust than prefab

Yeah I'm exploring that option, but unfortunately lumber is pretty expensive where I am in canada. Looking for some cheap sturdy furniture but if I can't find anything I'll build one.

 

[Sockcman]

A tank, hang on back filter, pump for water movement, heater and a light is all you need to enjoy most marine life, anyone who wants to debate that let's have at it. I set up my QT tank for less than $150 and it will support everything but acropora indefinitely. The biggest expense is going to be LIVE ROCK, I can't recommend anyone using dry rock to start a brand new tank.

Tank $16
Seachem Tidal $40
Eheim-Jager 50w heater $35
Pulaco 100gph pump $9
Nicrew marine light $25

IMO the biggest hurdle one will have to overcome with a small tank is starting with dry rock, it's horrible for the first year or two at least. I'd recommend getting some real ocean live rock and skipping all of the drama associated with a new tank.

The OP said as cheap as possible, that means nothing fancy.

I really like the idea of having a good filter floss system and overflow for skimming the surface. Do you have any issues with surface film or particulates in the water column with your hob tank?

Seachem tidal 35 is $100 CAD on Amazon in canada and the used market sucks where I'm at. If I go aio it would be like $20 worth of acrylic, a small pump and some tubing.

Def planning on getting live rock. I'm willing to spend good money on lighting / hardscape / livestock, just hoping to save money everywhere else.

 

[fish_collector]

Well ok, you said as cheap as possible...

 

[mcarroll]

Cheap but you don't want it to suck. Got it.

Stop considering cheap gear....it sucks.

Back chambers are mostly for aesthetics and they take valuable tank space. IMO avoid for this tank.

Buy good quality gear USED. It's great AND it's cheap.

Get a used plain old 20 Gallon tank and a used Tunze 9001 skimmer and used Tunze flow pump and a used light....the 9001 is kinda a unique skimmer and their pumps are my favorite, but there are too many good brands to name for lights. (Tunze even has some, but you're not likely to find them used.)

Be patient while you collect all the used gear and save a pile of cash.

 

[Sockcman]

Cheap but you don't want it to suck. Got it.

Stop considering cheap gear....it sucks.

Back chambers are mostly for aesthetics and they take valuable tank space. IMO avoid for this tank.

Buy good quality gear USED. It's great AND it's cheap.

Get a used plain old 20 Gallon tank and a used Tunze 9001 skimmer and used Tunze flow pump and a used light....the 9001 is kinda a unique skimmer and their pumps are my favorite, but there are too many good brands to name for lights. (Tunze even has some, but you're not likely to find them used.)

Be patient while you collect all the used gear and save a pile of cash.

Thank you for the advice! The problem is that the used market really sucks where I'm located. Can guarantee I'll never find that exact brand and there's only like 2 skimmers within a 2 hour radius on marketplace. I've been looking for months too.

Do you have any other decent brands with a smaller skimmer to keep an eye out for?

 

[Kooma]

Thank you for the advice! The problem is that the used market really sucks where I'm located. Can guarantee I'll never find that exact brand and there's only like 2 skimmers within a 2 hour radius on marketplace. I've been looking for months too.

Do you have any other decent brands with a smaller skimmer to keep an eye out for?

Where are you from? Plenty of used gear available even in remote areas.

I’d suggest a biocube or similar AIO. People bash them but I’ve been running one for the past 8 years and they are well made and work well for all types of marine life (be in nano life).

Even a used freshwater system is an option you can convert, my 225 peninsula was a freshwater discus tank in its previous life.

If you want fish as cheap as possible, I’d suggest sticking to fresh water. Saltwater and cheap usually ends in frustration, struggle and quitting before success. I’d say you need to have about $1500 to burn before getting into saltwater properly.

 

[Sockcman]

Where are you from? Plenty of used gear available even in remote areas.

I’d suggest a biocube or similar AIO. People bash them but I’ve been running one for the past 8 years and they are well made and work well for all types of marine life (be in nano life).

Even a used freshwater system is an option you can convert, my 225 peninsula was a freshwater discus tank in its previous life.

If you want fish as cheap as possible, I’d suggest sticking to fresh water. Saltwater and cheap usually ends in frustration, struggle and quitting before success. I’d say you need to have about $1500 to burn before getting into saltwater properly.

I live on Vancouver island in canada, it's fairly big but there's an island tax on everything and not much supply for marketplace. I maybe worded my intention with this tank wrong. I'm fine spending money but I wanna cut cost wherever I can without making things a pain.

My goal is to just get some practice with saltwater / coral before moving in a couple of years and getting a more permanent tank.

The only good spot I can fit the tank is ideal for a 20 long footprint too.

 

[ChaddyJ_7]

Thank you for the advice! The problem is that the used market really sucks where I'm located. Can guarantee I'll never find that exact brand and there's only like 2 skimmers within a 2 hour radius on marketplace. I've been looking for months too.

Do you have any other decent brands with a smaller skimmer to keep an eye out for?

I have the Bubble Magus MiniQ Skimmer...dead silent, works surprisingly well for its size and I think it only set me back like $55.
I started out with a 20 long a few years back, and if I had to do it again, I'd probably go for an AIO style tank. I love the Innovative Marine 20/25 Lagoon models. I think the 20 runs about $170 and fits that skimmer perfectly, with extra room for biomedia/rubble/floss or whatever other filtration you may want to use. I know others have had success with hang-on filtration, it has just never worked well for me personally. I prefer the surface skimming that you get with an overflow in the AIO style setups.

I second @mcarroll l on the live rock...at a minimum you want to get some live rubble or sand, AF LifeSource, OceanDirect sand, etc. Anything that's coming from the ocean and has the real deal bacteria will make your life way easier getting things rolling, but the more "live" the better. For a 20 gallon setup you could get away with one of the "Treasure Chests" from Tampa Bay Saltwater and it will drastically increase your chances of success even if you're using some dry rock as well to keep the cost down.

I would advise against the Fluval light...Even with 2 of them, I never had great results growing coral as they just don't put out a ton of par and I could have bought a much nicer light for the money I spent on 2 of the Fluval Reef lights. I'd look at something like the AI Prime or Blade. Not familiar with the micmol, but I have seen plenty of people on here who've had success with Nicrew lights, it all comes down to what you're willing to spend.

If you're just getting into saltwater, check out the Serious Reefs website/YouTube or BRSTV 5 Minute Guide. Ryan offers a 1-week free Trial, and has a great beginner friendly series on how to start a tank using the "90/10 method" that's designed around low cost and LPS/soft coral which is more beginner friendly. Especially as a beginner, there's something to be said for finding 1 source of knowledge and following that...it can be overwhelming with all the info out there and everyone has their own way of doing things/opinions, especially on forums, lol. I think it the 90/10 would help cut out some noise and make informed decisions on where to save your money and what's worth the investment.

 

[ChaddyJ_7]

I live on Vancouver island in canada, it's fairly big but there's an island tax on everything and not much supply for marketplace. I maybe worded my intention with this tank wrong. I'm fine spending money but I wanna cut cost wherever I can without making things a pain.

My goal is to just get some practice with saltwater / coral before moving in a couple of years and getting a more permanent tank.

The only good spot I can fit the tank is ideal for a 20 long footprint too.

Also, you definitely don't need a fancy stand, especially for a smaller tank. I have a 20 gallon on a cabinet I got for $10 at a yard sale/flea market and just sanded & repainted.

 

[Sockcman]

I have the Bubble Magus MiniQ Skimmer...dead silent, works surprisingly well for its size and I think it only set me back like $55.
I started out with a 20 long a few years back, and if I had to do it again, I'd probably go for an AIO style tank. I love the Innovative Marine 20/25 Lagoon models. I think the 20 runs about $170 and fits that skimmer perfectly, with extra room for biomedia/rubble/floss or whatever other filtration you may want to use. I know others have had success with hang-on filtration, it has just never worked well for me personally. I prefer the surface skimming that you get with an overflow in the AIO style setups.

I second @mcarroll l on the live rock...at a minimum you want to get some live rubble or sand, AF LifeSource, OceanDirect sand, etc. Anything that's coming from the ocean and has the real deal bacteria will make your life way easier getting things rolling, but the more "live" the better. For a 20 gallon setup you could get away with one of the "Treasure Chests" from Tampa Bay Saltwater and it will drastically increase your chances of success even if you're using some dry rock as well to keep the cost down.

I would advise against the Fluval light...Even with 2 of them, I never had great results growing coral as they just don't put out a ton of par and I could have bought a much nicer light for the money I spent on 2 of the Fluval Reef lights. I'd look at something like the AI Prime or Blade. Not familiar with the micmol, but I have seen plenty of people on here who've had success with Nicrew lights, it all comes down to what you're willing to spend.

If you're just getting into saltwater, check out the Serious Reefs website/YouTube or BRSTV 5 Minute Guide. Ryan offers a 1-week free Trial, and has a great beginner friendly series on how to start a tank using the "90/10 method" that's designed around low cost and LPS/soft coral which is more beginner friendly. Especially as a beginner, there's something to be said for finding 1 source of knowledge and following that...it can be overwhelming with all the info out there and everyone has their own way of doing things/opinions, especially on forums, lol. I think it the 90/10 would help cut out some noise and make informed decisions on where to save your money and what's worth the investment.

Great advice, the surface skimming action was a big reason I wanted aio.

Definitely starting to understand sticking to one source of information, there's so many different ways to do it and no clear winner. Will check out 90/10!

 

[mcarroll]

If anyone is considering paying for reefing advice, I would suggest that the first money spent is on books .

Unless you have unlimited time to watch someone yammer on youtube, books are by far the best bang for your buck. (I prefer to yammer here. )

Check this thread out for some good book ideas:
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/how-long-is-your-aquarium-book-collection.180547/
There are many great book options, new and old. Get one or two at minimum to start with, but the more the better IME. They are easy to find used in most cases. Picture heavy books are the MOST FUN and also quite useful, but if you are limited on how many books you'll have, don't have more than 1 picture book for every 2 reference books. (Best not to limit how many books you have, but they do take up space. )

Two of my top author recommendations (Sprung and Moe) at least are available as eBook. Maybe others too....but a lot of ebooks I saw look like they were written and self-published by noobs regurgitating stuff they read in forums online...like much of YouTube. Stick to recommended authors IMO, at least to begin with....there are plenty!!!

*AND* for $free, while you're digesting those books make sure you're getting your fill of periodicals as well. Read everything on reefkeeping.com, advancedaquarist's stuff at reefs.com and everything you find relevant on the USDA's aquaculture library, https://srac.msstate.edu/FactSheets.html.

Plus, if you look for old FAMA, TFH and other defunct aquarium magazines in online archives like archive.org, there's a ton of great reefing (and general aquaria info) in them....even going back into the 1960's if you can find any archives that go back that far.

Naturally you'll still be hitting R2R for questions and other things all along as well. The Articles section here is no slouch these days, but **there's a lot** so I still recommend sticking to established authors like Randy Farley and Dana Riddle, at least to begin with. That's still PLENTY of reading, so not really a limit....just a way to make it more digestible.

You want to talk about cutting down the noise? Books and periodicals (either paper or e-) for the win!

If you're equipped for it, you can side-step all the opinions and just mind meld with Google Scholar by reading tons of related material there....but then books and periodicals are going to have LOTS of references to start you out on that front too, so they are always a win in my book.

 

[mcarroll]

... check that I don't think TFH is defunct. But you get my point on the rest of them.

 

[Michael Hughes]

I'm going the same route as you. Willing to spend money where it matters, but definitely saving where I can DIY or get by with budget and/or used options. Just a few thoughts:

Assuming you have a drill, you could build a stand for a 20 long for the cost of three 2x4s and a box of drywall screws (if you don't already have extra already). Should be less than $20 (at least here in Florida).

So far I really like the Nicrew lights (I have both the HyperReef and NavaReef models, though so far only have corals under the NavaReef. LPS are growing fine and this week we'll add the first SPS.

I didn't spend any money on fancy mounting brackets and instead mounted them to an unused headboard mount screwed directly into the studs.

Also, check Black Friday deals on Amazon! I got a great (absolutely dead quiet) Hydor Koralia 75% off brand new last year.

I've had success with the fairly inexpensive HiTaung heaters off Amazon, but I do plan to replace them annually.

Also easy to save on lids using screen frames and screen corners with mesh from BRS.