love aquatics

[LoveAquatics]

I will soon be setting up a 250 mixed reef and have been reading about miracle mud in a cryptic zone refugium. Does anybody have specific information on how to set one up i.e. amount of mud, rock or rubble, can chaeto be grown over it, any advice and/or experience would be greatly appreciated. Also are filter socks still needed and how about a skimmer. I sounds intriguing to me and I like trying new (at least to me) ideas.

 

[Gumbies R Us]

#reefsquad

 

[tbrown]

@Fish Styx @Stang67 @JoJosReef

 

[Staghorn]

I’ve never used mud but I do have a cryptic filter with a deep sand bed that’s about 11-12 years old. A true cryptic filter isn’t really compatible with the chaeto because you need the darkness. I do use filter socks, enough organics get past the sock to provide the cryptic zone with food.

 

[Fish Fan]

I believe @Subsea is knowledgeable with cryptic 'fuges, and I believe he uses some kind of live mud in his. @VintageReefer and I believe @exnisstech have cryptic 'fuge setups.

 

[exnisstech]

I believe @Subsea is knowledgeable with cryptic 'fuges, and I believe he uses some kind of live mud in his. @VintageReefer and I believe @exnisstech have cryptic 'fuge setups.

I do. Mine is just rock and whatever builds up. I run socks before it but only 200 micron and its not uncommon for them to over flow for a few days between changes. I scraped all the mulm out of my previous tanks sump and put it all in this one when I started it.

 

[Rocks reef]

On the miracle mud, you’ll want about 1.5” in your refugium.
As far as socks go, that is totally up to you. Some use them, others don’t. As @exnisstech mentioned, a 200 micron is great for larger particles but will allow the smaller stuff through to partially get skimmed and to feed your corals.
Skimmers are another item that isn’t required, they are a tool in your arsenal though. I have one for aeration purposes only. I skim very dry and empty the cup once a month maybe. I prefer to not remove all the beneficial organics out of the water as its food for my corals.

 

[LoveAquatics]

I do. Mine is just rock and whatever builds up. I run socks before it but only 200 micron and its not uncommon for them to over flow for a few days between changes. I scraped all the mulm out of my previous tanks sump and put it all in this one when I started it.

I already have a similar set up but mine is rubble. I do have rock with chaeto in a different chamber with light. I am interested in getting rid of the chaeto and light, adding mud for the trace elements and just having one chamber. Hopefully that would act similar to a DSB and increase the number and type of little critters. I just have no experience with mud and need some guidence.

 

[LoveAquatics]

On the miracle mud, you’ll want about 1.5” in your refugium.
As far as socks go, that is totally up to you. Some use them, others don’t. As @exnisstech mentioned, a 200 micron is great for larger particles but will allow the smaller stuff through to partially get skimmed and to feed your corals.
Skimmers are another item that isn’t required, they are a tool in your arsenal though. I have one for aeration purposes only. I skim very dry and empty the cup once a month maybe. I prefer to not remove all the beneficial organics out of the water as its food for my corals.

Thanks Rocks Reef I appreciate the info. I didn't see your post until I sent mine. Do you put rock or rubble over the top of the mud?

 

[Subsea]

Thanks Rocks Reef I appreciate the info. I didn't see your post until I sent mine. Do you put rock or rubble over the top of the mud?

I agree with less than 1” of miracle mud. I don’t wear socks in my refugium. In 25 years, MULM accumulated an extra 1”. Mud feels spongy to the touch and is crawling with worms. Five years ago, I turned out the light, composted tomatoes with Chaetomorphy, added eggcrate and placed live rock on top of egg rate.

I use diver collected live rock for biodiversity. This live rock also brings in cryptic sponges which will also grow on the dark side of rocks in your display.

I don’t use protein skimmers but I do use air bubblers for water movement & gas exchange.

 

[LoveAquatics]

I agree with less than 1” of miracle mud. I don’t wear socks in my refugium. In 25 years, MULM accumulated an extra 1”. Mud feels spongy to the touch and is crawling with worms. Five years ago, I turned out the light, composted tomatoes with Chaetomorphy, added eggcrate and placed live rock on top of egg rate.

I use diver collected live rock for biodiversity. This live rock also brings in cryptic sponges which will also grow on the dark side of rocks in your display.

I don’t use protein skimmers but I do use air bubblers for water movement & gas exchange.

Is there a specific tank gallon to mud bed size ratio?

 

[Subsea]

No fixed ratios. Too many variables and unable to quantify with measured data.

“It sounds intriguing to me and I like trying new (at least to me) ideas.”

@LoveAquatics
It’s a leap of faith. If you take a “walk on the wild side”, then consider embracing diversity with diver collected live rock.

 

[LoveAquatics]

No fixed ratios. Too many variables and unable to quantify with measured data.

“It sounds intriguing to me and I like trying new (at least to me) ideas.”

@LoveAquatics
It’s a leap of faith. If you take a “walk on the wild side”, then consider embracing diversity with diver collected live rock.

Thanks for sharing your information that comes from experience, that is the best there is. One more question, what is a good source for diver collected live rock?

 

[steveschuerger]

Thanks for sharing your information that comes from experience, that is the best there is. One more question, what is a good source for diver collected live rock?

Tampa Bay Saltwater(waiting line if not local) , Gulf Live Rock and KP are three best known. I’ve used them all. Right now I’m using a mix of KP base rock and Primo from Gulf Live in my 25

 

[TheReefAbides]

No fixed ratios. Too many variables and unable to quantify with measured data.

“It sounds intriguing to me and I like trying new (at least to me) ideas.”

@LoveAquatics
It’s a leap of faith. If you take a “walk on the wild side”, then consider embracing diversity with diver collected live rock.

Thanks for sharing your information that comes from experience, that is the best there is. One more question, what is a good source for diver collected live rock?

I see a lot of reefers talking about tbsaltwater.com live rock. TampaBaySaltwater

 

[LoveAquatics]

Is there a specific tank gallon to mud bed size ratio?

How much and how often do you change/replace mud, if at all?

 

[Subsea]

How much and how often do you change/replace mud, if at all?

I have miracle mud in 25 year mature refugium. Never replaced mud and in 25 years mud depth has increased by 3/4”, feels spongy to the touch and is crawling with worms & pods.

 

[LoveAquatics]

I have miracle mud in 25 year mature refugium. Never replaced mud and in 25 years mud depth has increased by 3/4”, feels spongy to the touch and is crawling with worms & pods.

So no socks, no skimmer and no light. Just let it go and the detritus etc. just accumulates with no ill affects? What are your nitrates and phosphates like?
Since I will be starting fresh is okay to start this way or run it with a light and chaeto to start?