Macro reactor

[ChrisfromBrick]

A.R.I.D. N18 Macroalgae Reactor (40-120 Gal. Sys.)

A Quantum Leap in Nutrient Management The A.R.I.D (Algae Remediation Illuminated Device) Reactors bring macroalgae culture into the modern era of reefkeeping, incorporating highly refined, elegant design and innovative technology for a macroalgae reactor unlike any other. This ingenious device...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

This is essentially a fuge outside of your sump? For those of us that dont have room for a typical refugium? I wonder if this would do too good of a job and bottom out nutes.

 

[Treehrtsme]

A.R.I.D. N18 Macroalgae Reactor (40-120 Gal. Sys.)

A Quantum Leap in Nutrient Management The A.R.I.D (Algae Remediation Illuminated Device) Reactors bring macroalgae culture into the modern era of reefkeeping, incorporating highly refined, elegant design and innovative technology for a macroalgae reactor unlike any other. This ingenious device...

www.bulkreefsupply.com

This is essentially a fuge outside of your sump? For those of us that dont have room for a typical refugium? I wonder if this would do too good of a job and bottom out nutes.

I'm a big advocate of algae reactors. I don't believe it's necessary to go to the top of the line ones though. I found just about every reactor and set up right they grow algae great. You do have to worry about them sucking up some Trace elements and your tank and occasionally will have to supplement but overall I strongly recommend them. I've been through a few pax bellum, I even own a c-36, and I personally don't believe the price tag on it justifies any improvement in performance and may have. That's just my two cents

 

[ChrisfromBrick]

I'm a big advocate of algae reactors. I don't believe it's necessary to go to the top of the line ones though. I found just about every reactor and set up right they grow algae great. You do have to worry about them sucking up some Trace elements and your tank and occasionally will have to supplement but overall I strongly recommend them. I've been through a few pax bellum, I even own a c-36, and I personally don't believe the price tag on it justifies any improvement in performance and may have. That's just my two cents

Thank you! Would using less phyto in one of these keep it from sucking all my nitrate out?

 

[GARRIGA]

Tunz has one that's less complicated and potentially a diy candidate. Could also just do a diy HOB. Lots of options on google although those Pax sure look cool and might get one assuming I have a place for them. Wish they were fatter and shorter and designed like the Tunz where one doesn't have to mess with trays.

 

[GARRIGA]

As for nutrients and trace. Latter easy to replace and former can be manipulated by photoperiod. Makes something smaller over-perform keeping it on 24/7 yet twice the size perform the same or around that based on half the photoperiod which most run opposite lights but I'd rather pull co2 constantly due to my peculiar high room contents. Also can prune it more often so less available to draw both.

 

[Treehrtsme]

Tunz has one that's less complicated and potentially a diy candidate. Could also just do a diy HOB. Lots of options on google although those Pax sure look cool and might get one assuming I have a place for them. Wish they were fatter and shorter and designed like the Tunz where one doesn't have to mess with trays.

Reef octopus makes their models like that at least in the fatter and shorter sense

 

[Treehrtsme]

Thank you! Would using less phyto in one of these keep it from sucking all my nitrate out?

It depends on what other filtration you're using. And do you mean chaeto? Using the standard cheatomorpha, it will grow very fast as it is primarily photosynthetic and how fast it grows can be dependent on the lighting in the reactor and nutrients in your tank so sometimes I just used an oversized reactor and throw a small amount in there so it adds water volume and in the end is less maintenance though you do have to be careful about the lighting being too strong and run it a little less, but when you're working with something like a Geo 418 you want to keep an eye on it weekly. In general people do not empty their reactors but every two weeks or so, but ease of maintenance is important to me.

I don't think an algae actor alone could completely strip your tank unless it's completely loaded and you don't have a large bio load, but if you're running it with an AFR and a strong protein skimmer you may want to limit how long the protein skimmer runs. I run all my algae reactors on reverse light cycle during the night to keep pH stable and I've ran a reactor meant for tanks over 100 gallons on a 22 as the primary means of nutrient export and still manage to maintain levels of nitrate. Some reactors are made so you can actually view how the growth is without opening it and that is helpful, but I haven't experimented with using slower growing algae in a reactor yet.

The plates can definitely be a bit annoying depending on what reactor you're using, but some are made in the manner in which there are no plates at all or almost none which makes maintenance easier. Personally, I've found some of the cheaper reactors to be almost more effective or better in certain design aspects then your typical pax bellum. I love the Pacific Sun line, but they are a bit hard to get. They have a clear lid so you can kind of look down into there and see what's going on and the plates are easily movable which helps prevent any tubing or piping from getting algae in it. The smaller Tunze isn't a bad option though personally I've had mixed success with them. And my algae reactors that keep the algae more static, I've seen massive growth of anthropods, though this is only correlation.

Reef octopus makes their models like that at least in the fatter and shorter sense

An example I used a geo 418v1 to clean up a fairly dirty tank and over the course of maybe a week and a half this is maybe 2/3 of the hall I pulled out of a 418

 

[Treehrtsme]

As for nutrients and trace. Latter easy to replace and former can be manipulated by photoperiod. Makes something smaller over-perform keeping it on 24/7 yet twice the size perform the same or around that based on half the photoperiod which most run opposite lights but I'd rather pull co2 constantly due to my peculiar high room contents. Also can prune it more often so less available to draw both.

Have you had success with running out your reactors 24/7? That's something I've never tried long-term but I'd be interested in how it works. I know depending on the light you have a potential of burning out your algae especially if it's static. I viewed this multiple times when pulling out huge loads from reactors with internal lights where the algae closest to the light is in very bad condition and the algae further out is a nice green color

 

[GARRIGA]

Have you had success with running out your reactors 24/7? That's something I've never tried long-term but I'd be interested in how it works. I know depending on the light you have a potential of burning out your algae especially if it's static. I viewed this multiple times when pulling out huge loads from reactors with internal lights where the algae closest to the light is in very bad condition and the algae further out is a nice green color

Got the idea from pot growers constantly pushing the edge for faster yield. First tested it in FW with single cell algae, Hornwort, Water Lettuce and Hyacinth. All did exceptionally well to the point water lettuce had to be pruned twice weekly and each pruning was 50% removal. Hyacinth once per week 25% removal. Fish didn't seem affected either. Latter rather surprising.

Latest experiment was running pom pom macroalgae 24/7 and they grew as well although GHA overtook it and that also didn't miss a beat yet grew better than in display which was a bitter sweet silver lining. NO3 was zero per ICP. PO4 was 1.4 ppm but I was topping off with tap to test metal removal by macroalgae as well as free dosing of silicate to fight dinos. Best of all my pH went from 7.5 to 8.1. The real reason for running Fuge/ATS. This tank the display light were off at night but the grow light glow I'm sure kept the fish somewhat amused. Test was with HOB.

Best just try it and see how it goes. Won't know otherwise and internet seems to think max 22 hours as if plants need sleep and yet we are talking about rather primitive plants. I'm sure there's some paper out there claiming the need for lights out yet my experience says I'll write my paper on this :rolling-on-the-floor-laughing:

 

[Treehrtsme]

Got the idea from pot growers constantly pushing the edge for faster yield. First tested it in FW with single cell algae, Hornwort, Water Lettuce and Hyacinth. All did exceptionally well to the point water lettuce had to be pruned twice weekly and each pruning was 50% removal. Hyacinth once per week 25% removal. Fish didn't seem affected either. Latter rather surprising.

Latest experiment was running pom pom macroalgae 24/7 and they grew as well although GHA overtook it and that also didn't miss a beat yet grew better than in display which was a bitter sweet silver lining. NO3 was zero per ICP. PO4 was 1.4 ppm but I was topping off with tap to test metal removal by macroalgae as well as free dosing of silicate to fight dinos. Best of all my pH went from 7.5 to 8.1. The real reason for running Fuge/ATS. This tank the display light were off at night but the grow light glow I'm sure kept the fish somewhat amused. Test was with HOB.

Best just try it and see how it goes. Won't know otherwise and internet seems to think max 22 hours as if plants need sleep and yet we are talking about rather primitive plants. I'm sure there's some paper out there claiming the need for lights out yet my experience says I'll write my paper on this :rolling-on-the-floor-laughing:

Well I do know that macro algae needs a bit of rest time from light, but if it's spinning in a sense it's getting that rest time just in small increments. Also I forgot to include the photo that I mentioned from my last load pulled out of a 418. I had a fish that died in quarantine and was in there for more than a day so I ran the reactor on there and when I pulled it out I had enough algae to start up all my reactors from scratch. Herr was just a portion of it, but I think this is a good example of how well algae can do. Before they had protein skimmers and all the fancy equipment we have today using natural methods was the go-to for aquariums. And some of my algae reactors I'm able to wrap fleece or filter floss around one of the areas in the bottom, and successfully exclude mechanical filtration, though if I leave the floss in there too long eventually the algae gets pretty dirty. I also initially got my first algae reactor because I simply didn't have room in my cabinet for a refugium. Most algae reactors are made to look aesthetically pleasing. There's only one or two off the top of my head that would bother me having to see outside of the cabinet. You can always put them up on a little pedestal if it's a smaller model or something that makes it look more intentional. Hard plumbing and using true unions to color match can make them look pretty cool or you can just use tubing, but anything clear will dirty up in a month or so

 

[GARRIGA]

Well I do know that macro algae needs a bit of rest time from light,

Based on?

 

[ChrisfromBrick]

It depends on what other filtration you're using. And do you mean chaeto? Using the standard cheatomorpha, it will grow very fast as it is primarily photosynthetic and how fast it grows can be dependent on the lighting in the reactor and nutrients in your tank so sometimes I just used an oversized reactor and throw a small amount in there so it adds water volume and in the end is less maintenance though you do have to be careful about the lighting being too strong and run it a little less, but when you're working with something like a Geo 418 you want to keep an eye on it weekly. In general people do not empty their reactors but every two weeks or so, but ease of maintenance is important to me.

I don't think an algae actor alone could completely strip your tank unless it's completely loaded and you don't have a large bio load, but if you're running it with an AFR and a strong protein skimmer you may want to limit how long the protein skimmer runs. I run all my algae reactors on reverse light cycle during the night to keep pH stable and I've ran a reactor meant for tanks over 100 gallons on a 22 as the primary means of nutrient export and still manage to maintain levels of nitrate. Some reactors are made so you can actually view how the growth is without opening it and that is helpful, but I haven't experimented with using slower growing algae in a reactor yet.

The plates can definitely be a bit annoying depending on what reactor you're using, but some are made in the manner in which there are no plates at all or almost none which makes maintenance easier. Personally, I've found some of the cheaper reactors to be almost more effective or better in certain design aspects then your typical pax bellum. I love the Pacific Sun line, but they are a bit hard to get. They have a clear lid so you can kind of look down into there and see what's going on and the plates are easily movable which helps prevent any tubing or piping from getting algae in it. The smaller Tunze isn't a bad option though personally I've had mixed success with them. And my algae reactors that keep the algae more static, I've seen massive growth of anthropods, though this is only correlation.



An example I used a geo 418v1 to clean up a fairly dirty tank and over the course of maybe a week and a half this is maybe 2/3 of the hall I pulled out of a 418

great answer thank you. Yes I meant chaeto not phyto, lol.

There’s one that’s like a hundred bucks on Brs and the rest are like 500 and up. I’m currently running gfo/carbon reactor, skimmer, and a co2 scrubber. My nitrates are 50 and up and phosphate is around .20. I want a macro reactor or fuge for 2 reasons. first, the ability to raise ph a bit and then the ability to keep nitrate to a good level.

 

[Treehrtsme]

Based on?

As per a post by @saltyfilmfolks
" You can but I wouldn't. Photosynthesis does need a rest.

pH and the Reef Aquarium - REEFEDITION

by Randy Holmes-Farley For many aquarists, pH is not something that they have much experience with aside from their aquarium. For many, pH is almost a black box measurement: something to be considered, but whose physical meaning makes little sense to them. This article will Read more here...

www.reefedition.com

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-10/rhf/index.php

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-08/eb/index.php "

If you're actually looking for citations.

Yes you can stick a light in front of macro algae 24/7 and never turn it off but with all the research I've done in macro algae reactors, and 10 years of messing around with them from custom made 416s to the pax bellum c-36 there are benefits to giving the algae dark period. Lighting and nutrients can affect things, but the end of the day, photosynthesis.... I can't think of a place off the top of my head anywhere in the world where the sun is present 24/7 and plants thrive. The life of the macro algae may not be at risk immediately but I find better performance and growth running with some dark time. You always have to cull out a certain amount of algae that's just no good when pruning your reactor and I've done it enough times to get an idea of what might affect that bad portion, the only based on correlation. Now I'm using lights that minimize at perhaps 24 Watts and go well above that so heat can clearly play a factor too. I'll go out and buy it Tuesday right now because now I'm curious to see if allergy and constant motion run on a 24 seven cycle is an effective means of nutrients export and parameter balance.

 

[GARRIGA]

As per a post by @saltyfilmfolks
" You can but I wouldn't. Photosynthesis does need a rest.

pH and the Reef Aquarium - REEFEDITION

by Randy Holmes-Farley For many aquarists, pH is not something that they have much experience with aside from their aquarium. For many, pH is almost a black box measurement: something to be considered, but whose physical meaning makes little sense to them. This article will Read more here...

www.reefedition.com

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-10/rhf/index.php

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-08/eb/index.php "

If you're actually looking for citations.

Yes you can stick a light in front of macro algae 24/7 and never turn it off but with all the research I've done in macro algae reactors, and 10 years of messing around with them from custom made 416s to the pax bellum c-36 there are benefits to giving the algae dark period. Lighting and nutrients can affect things, but the end of the day, photosynthesis.... I can't think of a place off the top of my head anywhere in the world where the sun is present 24/7 and plants thrive. The life of the macro algae may not be at risk immediately but I find better performance and growth running with some dark time. You always have to cull out a certain amount of algae that's just no good when pruning your reactor and I've done it enough times to get an idea of what might affect that bad portion, the only based on correlation. Now I'm using lights that minimize at perhaps 24 Watts and go well above that so heat can clearly play a factor too. I'll go out and buy it Tuesday right now because now I'm curious to see if allergy and constant motion run on a 24 seven cycle is an effective means of nutrients export and parameter balance.

Skimmed those references and first not sure of their qualifications yet didn't see anything stating scientific proof macroalgae can't be lit 24/7 and need a dark period. That's solely my contention. Not challenging your knowledge but have you actually kept macroalgae or any plants lit 24/7 for extended periods? I'm speaking from actual experience and not citing others. FW plants and single cell algae were kept lit for a couple of years with no ill affects and growth was optimal to the needs of removing organics which was all I cared about facilitated by heavy feeding and zero measurable nutrients, stable pH and alkalinity.

Don't take my word for it. You have tinkered with running experiments what I gather therefore run a test where lights on day one and don't come off for six months and see what the results give you. Since my experiment with pom pom was only four months I can't speak to longer test although I'd think four months long enough to see ill affects.

Anecdotally, others have stated running chaeto and ATS 24/7 without ill affect.

My main purpose for Fuge/ATS being the removal of co2 with nutrient and metal control a side consideration. Goal is to run the lights off pH results and have the controller turn them off only if they exceed my maximum (yet to be determined) number. Was going to be 8.3 but now I'm curious if running 8.55 where higher increases calcium precipitation just to see how life responds.

Hear me out. I'm all for other's experience and science based testing yet no way even scientist can possibly test the affects on all life forms therefore when confronted with differing facts to my own experience then I choose my experience until further trials and tribulations tell me otherwise. Not saying I'm right and the only voice and simply expressing my thoughts and seeking knowledge. Why I asked "based on" because that might lead me in a new path.

As for a place on earth where plants receive 24/7 just consider the arctic winters where sun doesn't go away for months and plants there evolved to be lit 27/7 part of the year yet total darkness the other and although nature is a reference to how we keep any life in captivity the mere fact this is captivity means the boundaries set by nature may no longer exist.

Struggle to grasp how tumbling provides a dark period. Thought that was more to keep GHA from attaching and ensuring all sides get lit yet seen where myself with Hornwort and pom pom saw no issues with the underside not getting enough light and I don't tumble although trying to figure out how to get that accomplished since GHA beat my pom pom to literal death. Seen videos of think mats of chaeto grown in such a way as to prevent light from reaching the base and only the aquarist tumbling provided that and seen discussions where some don't bother and yet it grows. Skeptical but then perhaps further tests will enlighten me.

Last note, when first discovering pot growers and their 24/7 strategy I also searched the web for confirmation and failed to find any. Apparently science tells me they need darkness to perform certain functions and I doubt I had super plants in FW or salt therefore why I often question science as it can't possibly replicate everything we do and obtain conclusive evidence one must follow a strict path. Fact I didn't goes to prove you can't believe everything you read although the pot growers were correct. At least as to what they grow and my experiments.

One more last note. Unless running the Triton Method, life expectancy of Macroalgae is the next pruning therefore longterm affects of zero darkness need not be considered.