Mandarin Dragonet questions

[justintime742]

Looking for any recommendations on where to order captive bred dragonets. I’ve got one that was wild caught that was doing good for a bit (2 1/2 mos or so), LFS showed me feeding on frozen mysis, and was working on the copepod population I have, but is rapidly decreasing in weight. If anyone has any suggestions or help keep him/her alive, that’d be even better but I don’t for-see this being a happy ending unfortunately. Tried with a fry box at 30 min intervals so the other fish didn’t yoink the mysis shrimp, but he/she had no interest whatsoever. Also regularly dropping in 2 bottles of copepods every 2 weeks just to be sure the population is stable.

 

[kevgib67]

Looking for any recommendations on where to order captive bred dragonets. I’ve got one that was wild caught that was doing good for a bit (2 1/2 mos or so), LFS showed me feeding on frozen mysis, and was working on the copepod population I have, but is rapidly decreasing in weight. If anyone has any suggestions or help keep him/her alive, that’d be even better but I don’t for-see this being a happy ending unfortunately. Tried with a fry box at 30 min intervals so the other fish didn’t yoink the mysis shrimp, but he/she had no interest whatsoever. Also regularly dropping in 2 bottles of copepods every 2 weeks just to be sure the population is stable.

Sorry to hear, I hope it turns around. I got my captive bread about 6 weeks ago from Dr.Reef after it went through 6 weeks quarantine and fed on frozen food. It’s small, just over an inch but fat and happy. Good luck.

 

[DaJMasta]

Could they have been different mysis? Are you leaving the pumps off for a bit for it to hunt around? Are you feeding every day?

I like to keep my new introduction mandarins in a breeder box and feed them twice a day with a variety of frozen (cleaning once a day.) Across the board, the first prepared food taken is frozen bloodworms, so that's probably a good bet. Feeding copepds, amphibious, or newly hatched brine shrimp always works and is added supplementary to get them yo start grazing, but it usually takes 2-3 weeks for them to reliably go after newly added frozen food of at least two types, and at that point I let them out.

 

[justintime742]

Could they have been different mysis? Are you leaving the pumps off for a bit for it to hunt around? Are you feeding every day?

I like to keep my new introduction mandarins in a breeder box and feed them twice a day with a variety of frozen (cleaning once a day.) Across the board, the first prepared food taken is frozen bloodworms, so that's probably a good bet. Feeding copepds, amphibious, or newly hatched brine shrimp always works and is added supplementary to get them yo start grazing, but it usually takes 2-3 weeks for them to reliably go after newly added frozen food of at least two types, and at that point I let them out.

I try twice a day in the fry box, with the same mysis he feeds, fresh hatched brine, tried a bottle of a variety of copepods, and blood worms. I feed the display with powerhead and return off for about 30-45 minutes before I power the return back on, and set my power head to feed mode (10 min setting of 1% power I believe) before it returns to random variance in the morning before work, and then again once I get home around 5/6ish. The food in the fry box usually ends up being tossed as he doesn’t touch it. Would you suggest leaving in the fry box full time instead of intervals? I just feel bad how small of an area and no rocks for him to hide.

Edit: This is the fry box I’m currently using. https://kensfish.com/products/marina-hang-on-breeding-box-large

 

[DmitryB]

Biota has aquacultured Mandarins.

 

[slingfox]

How big is your tank and how long has it been running?

I have two captive mandarins from biota. I never feed them anything directly. They just cruise the rocks all day looking picking at it for food.

 

[DaJMasta]

I try twice a day in the fry box, with the same mysis he feeds, fresh hatched brine, tried a bottle of a variety of copepods, and blood worms. I feed the display with powerhead and return off for about 30-45 minutes before I power the return back on, and set my power head to feed mode (10 min setting of 1% power I believe) before it returns to random variance in the morning before work, and then again once I get home around 5/6ish. The food in the fry box usually ends up being tossed as he doesn’t touch it. Would you suggest leaving in the fry box full time instead of intervals? I just feel bad how small of an area and no rocks for him to hide.

Edit: This is the fry box I’m currently using. https://kensfish.com/products/marina-hang-on-breeding-box-large

I leave them in the box the whole time. Think of it this way: it's a numbers game. The longer they are randomly grazing around food, the better, so feeding fairly heavily in a small space they can't get out of makes the chance they accidentally eat the right thing go way, way up. A few eaten and they start realizing it's good and what it looks like.

Since yours is probably used to you and the tank, I don't know if this is as big a deal, but not being able to see through the sides is an advantage if adding a new fish. Yeah, it doesn't get to meet things and there is still an introduction later, but it gives it something to hide in, and the finer mesh sided ones tend to do a better job holding in small food particles.

Moving them into a box each time may also be making them want to hide or get away or whatnot, which would make them even less likely to actually try to eat when in the box. Normally, they will hide from me for the first few days even though they come out and eat later with the mostly opaque mesh sided boxes, just showing up above them is something they have to get used to before they resume their normal foraging.

 

[justintime742]

How big is your tank and how long has it been running?

I have two captive mandarins from biota. I never feed them anything directly. They just cruise the rocks all day looking picking at it for food.

Currently have a 32 biocube, had a mandarin way back in 2015 in a 60g reef who never had an issue getting as skinny as this guy has, running a bit over a year and a half probably closer to 2 years with the biocube. Roughly 40lbs live rock, had copepods established before introducing him back in May, no other active copepods eaters.

 

[1Meshy]

Definitely try Dr. Reef!! They are pretty small when you first receive them, but put them in a breeder box to let them grow for a bit.

I've had mine for a few months now and he's been eating like a pig since day one. Absolutely loves TDO pellets, mysis, brine shrimp and fish eggs. I feed him twice daily along with my seahorses and he's nice and fat.

I do add pods once a month but he doesn't rely soley on them; they're just a nice addition.

 

[slingfox]

Currently have a 32 biocube, had a mandarin way back in 2015 in a 60g reef who never had an issue getting as skinny as this guy has, running a bit over a year and a half probably closer to 2 years. Roughly 40lbs live rock, had copepods established before introducing him back in May, no other active copepods eaters.

The tank is likely mature enough and the size is theoretically okay for one dragonette. Do you have any wrasse or other fish which hunt for copepods? The challenge is have a small wrasse is super useful for pest management but they compete against the dragonete for copepods.

Anyhow, the Biota mandarins seem pretty bulletproof. They come in tiny but grow very fast.

 

[justintime742]

The tank is likely mature enough and the size is theoretically okay for one dragonette. Do you have any wrasse or other fish which hunt for copepods? The challenge is have a small wrasse is super useful for pest management but they compete against the dragonete for copepods.

Anyhow, the Biota mandarins seem pretty bulletproof. They come in tiny but grow very fast.

I have no problem on size, I plan on upgrading to a 75 or bigger in the near future and using the biocube as a frag/fish grow out. I'll definitely order from biota if the little one gives up, but trying my best to give this little guy the best fighting chance I can with whatever knowledge and hints/tips I can get. I really appreciate the suggestion!

 

[justintime742]

I leave them in the box the whole time. Think of it this way: it's a numbers game. The longer they are randomly grazing around food, the better, so feeding fairly heavily in a small space they can't get out of makes the chance they accidentally eat the right thing go way, way up. A few eaten and they start realizing it's good and what it looks like.

Since yours is probably used to you and the tank, I don't know if this is as big a deal, but not being able to see through the sides is an advantage if adding a new fish. Yeah, it doesn't get to meet things and there is still an introduction later, but it gives it something to hide in, and the finer mesh sided ones tend to do a better job holding in small food particles.

Moving them into a box each time may also be making them want to hide or get away or whatnot, which would make them even less likely to actually try to eat when in the box. Normally, they will hide from me for the first few days even though they come out and eat later with the mostly opaque mesh sided boxes, just showing up above them is something they have to get used to before they resume their normal foraging.

The current fry box I have almost acts as a separate aquarium other than it hangs on the tank and water is constantly funneling in from the display tank through a little air hose connection which controls the flow, and on the opposite side is a small return to keep the water as fresh as possible. Problem being is he kind of just freezes when he's in it, stays in place just like in the picture, and only returns to normal when in the display. I'll throw some sand in and make a make shift privacy type of deal see if that helps him at all.

 

[DHill6]

I just ordered a female from Biota, she’s in an acclimation box which also has a pvc elbow for her to hide in. It took her a day to check out the elbow, now she’s inside, on top of it, not bothering her. TDO xsmall pellets which I place into the elbow with a small tube feeder so they don’t get blown back out of the box. It’s working, she’s eating.

 

[DaJMasta]

The current fry box I have almost acts as a separate aquarium other than it hangs on the tank and water is constantly funneling in from the display tank through a little air hose connection which controls the flow, and on the opposite side is a small return to keep the water as fresh as possible. Problem being is he kind of just freezes when he's in it, stays in place just like in the picture, and only returns to normal when in the display. I'll throw some sand in and make a make shift privacy type of deal see if that helps him at all.

Substrate could help, but the problem is that he's suddenly in a foreign place with no where to hide and views of all the scary things on all sides. If you want to use that box, cover the external sides (at least two) with paper or tape or something to block line of sight. Bottom would probably be good but maybe less important. I like putting a couple segments of 3/4" locline in mine to make a little cave to hide in (some random 1" or smaller PVC fittings would do the job), and those should go a long way towards reducing the stress of being in the box.

The bottom line is, if he's not grazing in the box, there is literally no benefit of using it. So either leave him in for long enough for him to start grazing with the food around, or try to make it work just in the tank. Especially if this involves handling/catching him every day to put him in there. My vote, if I get one, would be just leave him in the box (sides shaded, some structure to hide in) and try to fatten him up with live and prepared foods.

 

[justintime742]

The current fry box I have almost acts as a separate aquarium other than it hangs on the tank and water is constantly funneling in from the display tank through a little air hose connection which controls the flow, and on the opposite side is a small return to keep the water as fresh as possible. Problem being is he kind of just freezes when he's in it, stays in place just like in the picture, and only returns to normal when in the display. I'll throw some sand in and make a make shift privacy type of deal see if that helps him at all.

Substrate could help, but the problem is that he's suddenly in a foreign place with no where to hide and views of all the scary things on all sides. If you want to use that box, cover the external sides (at least two) with paper or tape or something to block line of sight. Bottom would probably be good but maybe less important. I like putting a couple segments of 3/4" locline in mine to make a little cave to hide in (some random 1" or smaller PVC fittings would do the job), and those should go a long way towards reducing the stress of being in the box.

The bottom line is, if he's not grazing in the box, there is literally no benefit of using it. So either leave him in for long enough for him to start grazing with the food around, or try to make it work just in the tank. Especially if this involves handling/catching him every day to put him in there. My vote, if I get one, would be just leave him in the box (sides shaded, some structure to hide in) and try to fatten him up with live and prepared foods.

Grabbed some 1in pvc fittings, blocked out the vision all around other than main display, and to my surprise it appears he’s taken some blood worms. Gonna keep him in and try and fatten him up until he goes back to main display. I’ll provide an update in a week or so hoping that he makes it. Thank you all for the help.

 

[DaJMasta]

Glad to hear it's working. I think that reflects that he's already been introduced to frozen and relatively comfortable around you. I don't know how long putting on some weight would take, but the clear bottom makes it easier to tell. If for whatever reason you can't tell, a week would be my guess too, confirming that he's eating other kinds of food, then reintroduce to feed - in tank - with pumps off (gives them a chance to graze, they will learn to swim up to food eventually to compete slightly with other fish.)

 

[justintime742]

Not the updated I wanted to give but he since passed away last week, did all I could for him, so in my mind I gave him the best fighting chance. Ordered a captive bred from Biota.

 

[PolypPocket]

Not the updated I wanted to give but he since passed away last week, did all I could for him, so in my mind I gave him the best fighting chance. Ordered a captive bred from Biota.

Sorry